Family, Friends Of Dead Home Invaders Say “They Didn’t Deserve To Get Killed.”

I said it before in another thread. If you're unknown to me and inside my home, that's not my fault, and you'll probably end up minus one head.

I'm not taking precious time to determine what this persons intentions are, I live with my wife and a newborn.

I've read before about people being mentally ill or drunk and winding up in the wrong house somehow, but even then, that's not my fault.

Hi NightHawk- Ive gone on record as a registered owner what I would have had to do. People dont understand that this instance could really be a classic poster for why we certify, practice and maintain permits and licenses to carry...or those who legally keep long arms in their homes for safety.

This is one of the only...just one...of the valid reasons for home defense. Find someone in your home, and you dont have time to say "Excuse me?" in the dark..."Do you have a weapon?"....or "Hey you! Get outta my house!".

The answer is simple, the response acceptable, the action necessary in this "you against me and my family" situation. Its the final and sometimes fatal consequence to those teens poor judgment.

I don't know what I'd do. If I found a stranger who broke into my home, I honestly would attack with as much lethal force as I could with what was available. That could be a firearm or a knife depending on where I encounter them.
If it was a much younger person/teenager or a woman then I'd still use force to subdue them or at least drive them out. I'd have no problem beating them and trying to inflict serious bodily injury to them. They've invaded my home and I have no idea if they've come to steal or to rob me or even to kill me. They knowingly and willingly put their lives in jeopardy when they break into a persons homes or commit a crime.
People have to realize that there are many many crazy people out there. Many will try to break into peoples homes for various reasons, and a much smaller number will react very violently to those who do break into their homes. The best thing you can do is don't piss other people off and don't commit crimes. That's something everybody is going to have to start learning, everybody.

a reply to: mclarenmp4

Yes the person breaking in is criminal and deserves punishment for their crimes but is death really a justified reaction to a property intrusion?

Probably not; that's why one should always 'aim to maim'. If you fail, that makes you as lousy a shot as they are (were )burglars!

a reply to: nighthawk1954

They asked for it. They got it. Toyota.

Keep in mind a teenager said the quote, who may not be aware of adult consequences in situations. Does the teen think that their parents would not react in a similar break in, especially with young daughters? Articles says that they have robbed before, and if anything had a slap on the hand by mommy or daddy. If considering the parents even cared and or could do anything to thwart, if known, behavior-info needed here. It's indeed very tragic all around.

It's also a split second situation, depends on where you live, how your trained in situations, etc. Perhaps the homeowner didn't want to "shoot to kill" but based on the little info provided and safety reasons; they were thinking of their safety first being elderly probably figured a) couldn't fend them off without force as such b) feared being being attacked again(elderly woman) or killed c) articles indicated fingers prints matched previous break ins, this time the homeowner was going to stop it once and for all. Overall it's consequence, involving risk if you want to participate in those illegal and dangerous activities.

Hi to Doc, Mac and all the other people who answered my questions.

Much appreciated, understood and respected.

Maybe I should underline the fact once again that I am not in the USA and that Gun violence (especially home burglaries) are a most uncommon thing to happen over here (unless you live in Marseille).

Thus being the reason that I would if I had to use the shoot to disable (especially with buckshot to the knees... not that hard to miss) method compared to the shoot to kill option centered at the chest or face... (if I miss and they die then there is nothing I can do but live with that.)

Not only this but here in France, even if you do use a firearm on intruders 10 times out of ten you end up in prison.

An example over here is the simple fact that even if you point an unloaded firearm at intruders they can file a complaint and you are the one that gets arrested.

But... saying that, this would still not stop me from defending my loved ones and my home.

Kindest respects

Rodinus

In a country where the populus has 89 firearms for every 100 people, theres an elevated probability that if you go out to rob a house, the owner will have a firearm.
The fact he has a gun should be read as a message that he is prepared to use it if necessary.

Being shot to death is an occupational hazard for these street filth.

The fact the family of these actually have a voice in the matter is a joke "ay, they were such GOOD boys"...good boys don't burgle the house of an eldery woman 2 or 3 times.

Scum do, though. The same scum that threatened the elderly widow days before which prompted her to ask her brother to stay with her.

Today, Sacremento and the world is a better place.

Yesterday a poster from Scotland was talking about how people pull together and help each other out on his neck of the woods... My hat goes off to the Scots for keeping this valued principal.

Crikey, I remember roughly about 30 years ago in the UK (depending on where you lived) that if you were burgled or robbed (especially if you were a pensioner, lady or a child), people pulled together and you could be sure that the scum who did this were sorted out fairly quickly "old school style"... So to speak... It was rare that a firearm had to be used as a couple of mates sent round to give them a good hiding or at the very worst a paving stone or a drill through the kneecap did the job quite well and reminded the criminals that they were not the ones in charge...

This still happens in certains parts of France (or should I say similar) where I live now (especially in the South where criminals can be found with broken legs in the middle of a public park or "disappear" into the back country of Marseille and its surroundings (many wild boar who eat absolutely everything)) but unfortunately people are becoming more and more turned towards themselves and the community spirit has practically all but gone.

It is so deeply saddening how society has changed for the worst to defend our own interests.

Kindest respects

Rodinus

It was a 14 year old (one victims sister) who said this, so I think we can all (or at least should) be able to agree; that a 14 year old does not have the cognitive capabilities to understand the dynamics of this situation. Really the entire headline is an emotion seeking farce to get some views/ probably make the news company some money.

He looks so....innocent....just goes to prove that looks can be deceiving.

originally posted by: macman
a reply to: nighthawk1954

How is it that people are surprised these days when home invaders are shot?

Don't want to get shot?? Don't break into someone else's home.

Don't want to get shot? Don't cut someone off in traffic.

Where do you draw the line?

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: macman
a reply to: nighthawk1954

How is it that people are surprised these days when home invaders are shot?

Don't want to get shot?? Don't break into someone else's home.

Don't want to get shot? Don't cut someone off in traffic.

Where do you draw the line?

Where do I draw the line?

Cutting someone off in traffic is not the same thing as having that DEEP feeling that you have been physically violated Aaz...

Ask anyone who has ever experienced an intruder breaking into their home (your safe cocoon that you have worked so hard to build to protect your loved ones, the only place that you think is safe from the rest of the world where you can consider your family protected...)... This happened to my family when I was still in the UK and I popped a couple of punches on the chin and nose of the person responsable when they broke through the bathroom window of our house... (they were two and both ended up doing a 2 year stretch in prison (one of them had surgery as his nose was not in the right place after he broke into our home)... He fell down the stairs... apparently?

Someone cuts you off in traffic then you just ignore them... or flip them a mental finger covered in dogsh*t and just carry on with what you have to do.

Home and protection of loved ones are a different matter altogether compared to some numptey who wants to have an intellectual erection driving his/her pimped up or expensive car.

Kindest respects

Rodinus

originally posted by: Rodinus
Cutting someone off in traffic is not the same thing as having that DEEP feeling that you have been physically violated Aaz...

Ask anyone who has ever experienced an intruder breaking into their home (your safe cocoon that you have worked so hard to build to protect your loved ones, the only place that you think is safe from the rest of the world where you can consider your family protected...)... This happened to my family when I was still in the UK and I popped a couple of punches on the chin and nose of the person responsable when they broke through the bathroom window of our house... (they were two and both ended up doing a 2 year stretch in prison (one of them had surgery as his nose was not in the right place after he broke into our home)... He fell down the stairs... apparently?

I've had it happen. Not by criminals but by cops, because they thought they could score a drug bust. They broke in during the middle of the night wearing masks and body armor, murdered my dog, put me naked face down in a pool of my dogs blood, told me if I moved at all they would blow my head off then proceeded to take what little cash I had, my TV, my computers, and everything else they wanted. Under asset forfeiture laws I never got any of it back. They also broke the doors and punched so many holes in the walls I'm surprised the house is still standing. Oh, and they took the tomato plants my roommate was growing indoors that they mistook for drugs as the reason for the raid as well. If not for the police cars parked outside to this day I would not believe it was the cops.

I'm well aware of the feeling of being invaded, assaulted, and robbed while feeling powerless to do anything about it. I don't wish it on anyone.

In my opinion if you're willing to escalate the situation to where someone WILL be shot (and that's a reasonable escalation considering you have a right to defend yourself), it's also your responsibility to do what you can to make sure it doesn't end there, and that it makes it to trial. If you simply kill the person you're circumventing the laws with our justice system and in the end are no better than the criminal. They may still die, but there's a big difference between shooting until they're down then calling an ambulance and shooting until they're down then letting them bleed out.

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: macman
a reply to: nighthawk1954

How is it that people are surprised these days when home invaders are shot?

Don't want to get shot?? Don't break into someone else's home.

Don't want to get shot? Don't cut someone off in traffic.

Where do you draw the line?

The line is rather clearly drawn already by law and morality. You don't use deadly force unless you or someone else is in danger of death or severe bodily harm. Being cut off in traffic or arguing about last night's football match are not justification for any sort of physical violence much less deadly force.

originally posted by: andy1972

He looks so....innocent....just goes to prove that looks can be deceiving.

It seems that neck and face tattoos are an indicator that you neither have a choir boy or rocket scientist on your hands.

Not that all people with tattoos are miscreants, far form that, but neck and face tattoos in young people who get into trouble seems to be a pattern.

originally posted by: Rodinus
Hi to Doc, Mac and all the other people who answered my questions.

Much appreciated, understood and respected.

Maybe I should underline the fact once again that I am not in the USA and that Gun violence (especially home burglaries) are a most uncommon thing to happen over here (unless you live in Marseille).

Thus being the reason that I would if I had to use the shoot to disable (especially with buckshot to the knees... not that hard to miss) method compared to the shoot to kill option centered at the chest or face... (if I miss and they die then there is nothing I can do but live with that.)

Not only this but here in France, even if you do use a firearm on intruders 10 times out of ten you end up in prison.

An example over here is the simple fact that even if you point an unloaded firearm at intruders they can file a complaint and you are the one that gets arrested.

But... saying that, this would still not stop me from defending my loved ones and my home.

Kindest respects

Rodinus

Kid of sad that that a criminal can file a complaint against the person he was robbing and the victim will go to jail, isn't it? That is such a topsy turvy way of going about things.

originally posted by: NavyDoc

originally posted by: Rodinus
Hi to Doc, Mac and all the other people who answered my questions.

Much appreciated, understood and respected.

Maybe I should underline the fact once again that I am not in the USA and that Gun violence (especially home burglaries) are a most uncommon thing to happen over here (unless you live in Marseille).

Thus being the reason that I would if I had to use the shoot to disable (especially with buckshot to the knees... not that hard to miss) method compared to the shoot to kill option centered at the chest or face... (if I miss and they die then there is nothing I can do but live with that.)

Not only this but here in France, even if you do use a firearm on intruders 10 times out of ten you end up in prison.

An example over here is the simple fact that even if you point an unloaded firearm at intruders they can file a complaint and you are the one that gets arrested.

But... saying that, this would still not stop me from defending my loved ones and my home.

Kindest respects

Rodinus

Kid of sad that that a criminal can file a complaint against the person he was robbing and the victim will go to jail, isn't it? That is such a topsy turvy way of going about things.

Sadly Doc, that is the way things go in regards to cultural differences...

However and as usual, I wil continue to bla bla about it... and stick to my point of view... however much your point of view is understood and respected... (I will probably have to keep my gob shut taking into account that this is mainly a US targeted site and that no-one else matters in the world)... Cultural difference again that some people have issues with understanding... whatever?...

We all have different points of views but my last word is :

... Aim for the knees ...

Rodinus :

15 years active service as a veterinary officer at Porton down in ballistics before being affected to the Royal Signals / 2 Para as well as another regiment AND also had some great times with the Black Watch and had fun at Otterburn and in Germany... Bunch of puffs... *wink wink knudge knudge...* Christ... first night out in Newcastle with the Black Watch girls was a nightmare?... my head still hurts 30 years after...

Kindest respects

Rodinus

originally posted by: Rodinus

originally posted by: NavyDoc

originally posted by: Rodinus
Hi to Doc, Mac and all the other people who answered my questions.

Much appreciated, understood and respected.

Maybe I should underline the fact once again that I am not in the USA and that Gun violence (especially home burglaries) are a most uncommon thing to happen over here (unless you live in Marseille).

Thus being the reason that I would if I had to use the shoot to disable (especially with buckshot to the knees... not that hard to miss) method compared to the shoot to kill option centered at the chest or face... (if I miss and they die then there is nothing I can do but live with that.)

Not only this but here in France, even if you do use a firearm on intruders 10 times out of ten you end up in prison.

An example over here is the simple fact that even if you point an unloaded firearm at intruders they can file a complaint and you are the one that gets arrested.

But... saying that, this would still not stop me from defending my loved ones and my home.

Kindest respects

Rodinus

Kid of sad that that a criminal can file a complaint against the person he was robbing and the victim will go to jail, isn't it? That is such a topsy turvy way of going about things.

Sadly Doc, that is the way things go in regards to cultural differences...

However and as usual, I wil continue to bla bla about it... and stick to my point of view... however much your point of view is understood and respected... (I will probably have to keep my gob shut taking into account that this is mainly a US targeted site and that no-one else matters in the world)... Cultural difference again that some people have issues with understanding... whatever?...

We all have different points of views but my last word is :

... Aim for the knees

...

Rodinus :

15 years active service as a veterinary officer at Porton down in ballistics before being affected to the Royal Signals / 2 Para as well as another regiment AND also had some great times with the Black Watch and had fun at Otterburn and in Germany... Bunch of puffs... *wink wink knudge knudge...* Christ... first night out in Newcastle with the Black Watch girls was a nightmare?... my head still hurts 30 years after...

Kindest respects

Rodinus

Oh, I wasn't trying to be confrontational with you, just musing at what I see as a great societal injustice in that sort of rules. Even if one hates guns, I would hope they can see the injustice of letting a burglar make any sort of complaint against the person being burgled--it is like the criminal has more rights.

I've already said why I think aiming for the knees is neither wise nor absolves someone of the moral issues around using deadly force, so I won't rehash.

originally posted by: Aazadan


Don't want to get shot? Don't cut someone off in traffic.

Where do you draw the line?

Maybe be polite and don't worry about such moronic scenarios.