U.S. Supreme Court Ruling: Atheists Lose...Again.

a reply to: windword

again,

yeah church and state are separate.

and

Most of your fellow citizens are christian.

Your point?

Is it about the validity of christianity as a faith system to YOU or are you contesting the previously stated comments?

a reply to: tadaman

My point? As a republic, religion, including the majority religion, Christianity, can't be legislated.

a reply to: windword

and it is not.

are you saying that church and state arent separate?

If so please show me where a religious leader makes, enforces or judges state laws.

if not, "me thinks she doth protest too much".....would be applicable.


EDIT TO ADD:

Ill tell you whats up, you have a problem with a particular culture, and as a result the very expression of that culture is so offensive to you that you cant help yourself. You have to be disrespectful, contemptuous, and vile towards it at any step OUT OF A PERSONAL resentment with all legalities aside. It is obvious that this is not a legal issue since not a single valid example of how church and state ARENT separated has been presented yet.

This is all butt hurt.

originally posted by: Daedalus
a reply to: uncommitted

right, right....but the taking of jerusalem from the christians was, again, about the whole invisible friend thing....thinking one group of lunatics had more of a right to occupy a city, than another group of lunatics, because their specific invisible friend said so...

as a side note...i always found the concept of religion funny for a number of reasons...one of them being:

if you're a child, and you have an invisible friend, and have conversations with it, it's completely ok...if you're an adult, and you have an invisible friend, and have conversations with it, they wanna put you on drugs, because you're "crazy"...if you're an adult, and you have an invisible friend, and have conversations with it, but that invisible friend is "god", you're suddenly not crazy...

Hmmm, you are I think applying 21st century context to something that happened 1,100 years ago. Whether you believe in God or not is neither here nor there - I think you are missing that. Jerusalem and more to the point the area around it represented power at the time. The patronsing tone is ok though, I appreciate you to just want to bash religion and you thought the crusades were a good example, that's fine. JFK was a staunch Catholic and was persuaded (wrongfully and with obviously shocking repercussions) to launch the war with Vietnam - probably a better example really of those who thought that being God fearing meant right was on your side - in the Crusades, both sides did.

a reply to: tadaman

maybe he's not, but i will..

when you can have the ten commandments on courthouses, prayer before government functions, politicians campaigning and winning elections based on how christian they are, the ability to refer to the united states as "one nation, under god" in the pledge of allegiance, and "in god we trust" on the money, church and state are most certainly NOT separate.

a reply to: Daedalus

So you think that they have magical powers to affect the outcome of the legal system?

Oh, and I thought I had faith.

Show me where our laws are:

enforced, judged or dictated by religious leaders...

All you mention is part OF THE CULTURE OF YOUR PEOPLE.

It is not illegal to express it. Just like it wouldnt be wrong for a wiccan to say a mass before trial...(oh wait... they did in this town, along with tons of other faiths)

I guess you just dont like any religion. That is why you dont want even wiccans or jews to be able to make cultural religious expressions.

a reply to: tadaman

Are you just being dense and obtuse?

There is no majority rule, when the majority opinion goes against the constitution. It matters not who happens to be the majority, what matters is that the rule of law is based on the equality provided by the constitution.

America is all about equality, not about majority rule.

a reply to: windword

What is your question?

What a democracy IS or how what YOU WANT it to be could be?

Also, are you saying that most Americans ARENT Christian?

EDIT TO ADD:
Looks like in the absence of an actual point, silence is that which fills the void between the ears......

originally posted by: uncommitted
Hmmm, you are I think applying 21st century context to something that happened 1,100 years ago. Whether you believe in God or not is neither here nor there - I think you are missing that. Jerusalem and more to the point the area around it represented power at the time. The patronsing tone is ok though, I appreciate you to just want to bash religion and you thought the crusades were a good example, that's fine. JFK was a staunch Catholic and was persuaded (wrongfully and with obviously shocking repercussions) to launch the war with Vietnam - probably a better example really of those who thought that being God fearing meant right was on your side - in the Crusades, both sides did.

it's not really bashing, so much as highlighting certain logical flaws...

what does JFK being a catholic have to do with anything?

i understand what jerusalem represented, but to a number of faiths, it has ALWAYS been considered "holy land"..

and i only brought up the crusades, as an example of something awful that was done in the name of god/religion.

a reply to: tadaman


nice try.

i don't have a problem with people believing in whatever weird-ass thing they want to...what i have a problem with is it having ANY presence in governmental function.

a reply to: Daedalus

SO do you have a problem with any cultural expression within a courthouse or governmental function? Or is it just with religion?

a reply to: tadaman

What is your question?

I have no question for you. I have made statements, that you seem to have taken "butt hurt" offense to.

1) The US is not a Christian nation.

2) The majority population of Christians don't even agree with each other.

3) The United States of America is a Republic before it's a Democracy. All democratically held elections must abide by the Constitution, which is based on equality for all.

originally posted by: tadaman
a reply to: Daedalus

SO you have a problem with any cultural expression within a courthouse or governmental function? Or is it just with religion?

again, not what i said.

you may as well stop trying to bait me into saying something you can use to paint me as a "racist", or some other undesirable category..it's not going to work.

discuss properly, or leave me alone.

a reply to: windword

1) The US is not a Christian nation.

Yet, it is if most people are christian. Do you mean to tell me that you are so dense that you cant see the context I am using here?

2) The majority population of Christians don't even agree with each other.
AND? Not valid to you because of that? Neither do our political leaders....or us...So should we ban people from any governmental function because they dont agree always?

3) The United States of America is a Republic before it's a Democracy. All democratically held elections must abide by the Constitution.

And they do.

so just butt hurt.
OK

a reply to: Daedalus

If you cant answer then thats fine. Saying I am using some mastermind tactic to "get you" is laughable.

Just try that in the real world.

"No not answering, not because I am stuck in my own looping dark logic, no. Its because you are using tactics to win the conversation...."(argument at this point according to you, shows where you are going with this)

a reply to: tadaman

Is America a "white" nation, because most citizens are white? Is Congress a man's group, because most congressmen of male?

a reply to: tadaman

ME:
3) The United States of America is a Republic before it's a Democracy. All democratically held elections must abide by the Constitution.

And they do.

I can think of a number of elections result that were overturned because they were ruled unconstitutional.

a reply to: windword

actually yes. Hence why MINORITIES are classified as such.

Are asking if I AGREE WITH it? No. I would love full 100% diversity.

BUT I am not going to stick my head in the sand.

Is congress NOT mostly male? Are whites NOT the MAJORITY of people here compared to MINORITIES? (that may have changed actually)

You are just sticking your finger in your ears singing LALALA at this point.

YES. They are.

a reply to: tadaman

no..twice, so far, you've tried to bait me into saying something you can use against me.

you've not addressed what i've said, you've either addressed what you THINK i said, or what you WISH i'd said...

it's nothing to do with any kind of "looping dark logic"..at least not on my part...

you classify religion as american culture, which it is not, and then you ask me if i'm against cultural expression.....even a complete retard can see where you're going with that line of questioning...

a reply to: windword
Based on RELIGION?

and

so the system works.

Glad to see you noticed that. Nows the time to stop bitching.