Authorities Threaten to 'Liquidate' Crimean Tatar Council

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
Pressure from the west WILL escalate this because that's what the west does. They escalate land disputes into regional wars for profit and power redistribution, all while their citizens sit around waving little flags and chanting the initials of their country like fans at a football game.

Don't interject war profit and power redistribution into this argument unless you can support. I am getting tired of claims with nothing to support them other than personal issues the person has with said country.

Pressure / Appeasement - might work but not in this case / does not work - period.

The pressure applied to Hitler did a world of good did it?

There are people it will work on and their are people it wont work on. Putin is a person who it will not wok on, and he has blatantly stated that sentiment when asked about sanctions and pressure being applied from western nations.

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
It would be ridiculously comical if it wasn't for the fact that the United States is the chief offender and provider of the mindless citizenry. Just once it would be enjoyable to sit on the sidelines and chuckle at everybody else's Animal Farm act instead of facepalming as the whole damn neighborhood bleats to the beat of the DC drumline.

I don't see the Us military airdropping into Ukraine do you? Secondly the actions you disdain the US for doing are the same Russia is doing, yet for some reason, and correct me if I am wrong, you don't seem to have issues with the double standard. If anything what I am seeing is an annoyance towards the US that you see no problem if a nation other than the US does it.

is that right or no because its what I am seeing / hearing from your wording here.

The reason I reject this premise -
Just because Staling murdered up to 20 million people and just because Hitler murdered a crap ton of people does not mean its ok to pick up where they left off using the argument that some other nation did it.


Dialogue is required to solve this and so far Russia's idea of dialogue is give up the South and East and change your form of government to a federation.

that's not dialogue, its a threat and I refuse to ignore Putin's actions, especially because of his background and his vanity.

This is not Russia verse Ukraine.

it is Putin vs those he think should bow down and respect him.
The same mindset Staling had...
the same mindset Hitler had...
the same mindset Pol Pot had...
The same mindset Idi Amin had...

You don't wait to be shot when some is coming at you, weapon raised while the person is putting you in their sights.

a reply to: burdman30ott6

I'd rather stay the hell out of it, as it is absolutely none of our business at this time.

It will become our business if a victory in Ukraine encourages Putin to attack a NATO nation, like Latvia. If you can nip a problem in the bud, why wait for it to grow into a disaster?

originally posted by: anHairInTheSoup
why does it have to be systematically about pro or against russia ?

if you criticize the acting nazi gvt you're pro russia, if you question msm reports you're pro-russian, if you question the imf deal you're pro-russian, if you show compassion and anger because Ukrainian people are being tortured and killed by the ukraine nazi junta you're pro russia.

You really don't see your own hypocrisy do you? It's utterly astounding to me that anyone can write what you have written and not see the completely obvious.

You're doing it again, ignoring FACTS and rejecting REALITY.

The "nazi government" in Kiev is the ELECTED GOVERNMENT working in temporary continuation with the leaders of the protest movement until DEMOCRATIC ELECTIONS are held. A small number of Right Sektor ultra nationalists were involved, we know this, but they are NOT THE MAJORITY and they DO NOT HOLD POWER.

I feel like I'm banging my head against a brick wall here, with people irrationally ignoring the facts to be able to support the pro-Russian stance. You guys are literally trying to change reality to justify your support of an invading enemy and if it wasn't so utterly bizarre it would almost be funny!

a reply to: Rocker2013

The real hypocrisy is that I'm pretty sure the OP is a member of Front Nationale. He will be back shortly with a new nomme de geurre.

a reply to: Xcathdra

Unfortunately, I have debated much of Putin's actions over the last year and a half with others and we seem to come to the same conclusion. While Putin is currently calling those in Kiev "fascists", he himself is the one acting like a fascist, almost directly copying a plan set out by a historical figure we are all too familiar with.

While Putin is screaming "Nazis!" about Kiev, the following has all happened in Russia over the last year and a half...

1. The Russian Duma considered a proposal to build 80 "prison camps" across the country, this was later withdrawn to be rewritten when the international press started discussing it.

2. The Russian government was heavily criticized by Human Rights organizations for the appalling conditions in what are called "gulags" in the country.

3. The Russian Duma has considered a bill to allow the removal of children from families where any member is LGBT, with children to be removed to state institutions.

4. Political opposition and those daring to protest in the street have been beaten and imprisoned.

5. All major broadcasters and news organizations in the country have been solidified under Kremlin control.

6. The VK social network was seized by the Russian government just last month.

7. The man promoted to head the new media conglomerate of the Russian government is a celebrity who openly stated that all gay people should be "burned alive in ovens".

8. Russia invaded Crimea.

9. Russia is continuing to threaten Ukraine with a military presence on the border.

10. Russia is continuing to stoke tensions and violence within E Ukraine by sending in Russian military disguised (poorly) as "locals".

And finally we have the the events of last week, with the terrible fire in Odessa. Given everything Putin and Russia has done over the last year and a half I could only immediately suspect or at least consider that Odessa was Putin's attempt at a "Reichstag" event. While I doubt that any real evidence will come forward to be able to say definitively, this at least has to be suspected. Putin has been claiming all along that people are being attacked in Ukraine and he needs to "protect them", and this was another perfect excuse to justify his continued aggression against Ukraine.

Even someone (rightly) criticizing the existence of Right Sektor in Kiev, and even someone (rightly) distrusting of the US and the "the West", cannot look at all of this and claim that Russia is not a fascist nation. These are not the actions of a democratic country. These are the actions of a fascist leadership dominating its people, silencing opposition and stoking interior hatred and violence against minority groups.

It literally looks like Putin is reading through a history book and emulating what the Nazis did.

a reply to: Rocker2013

It literally looks like Putin is reading through a history book and emulating what the Nazis did.

Which is why so many of his supporters use neo-Nazi code words: "Zionist," "banksters," etc.

a reply to: bjarneorn

Just go watch the whole Ukraine series on Vice news YouTube channel and you will see that the Russia of old is back. They proved its the Russian Army is in plain clothes leading all the attacks in eastern and southern Ukraine. They even detained and beat the main reporter from Vice for days with no explanation. All the Russians complained about were Nazis in Kiev and blaming all these attacks against them by right sector meanwhile they had no proof at all that they were even being attacked. One time the Russians stole two cars from a guy, riddled them with bullets and then set them on fire claiming people were attacked by right sector and killed. The owner of the cars admitted they had been stolen from him two days before the so called attack.

Russia deserves a butt whopping for Georgia and this latest aggression but Putin the dictator or I should just say DIC.

originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: Rocker2013

It literally looks like Putin is reading through a history book and emulating what the Nazis did.

Which is why so many of his supporters use neo-Nazi code words: "Zionist," "banksters," etc.

Putin is using the Nazi plans...

Some of the translations are a bit of when translated into Cyrillic. Putins speeches / comments and plans are much better in the original german form.

originally posted by: Xcathdra

originally posted by: ProfessorT
I'm not sure if you caught my posts in the other thread (they are 5 pages back I think) but due to my personal connections I am in touch with Tatars in Crimea. They are in contact with officials from Turkey's Ministry of Foreign Affairs due to the discrimination shown by the Russian Federation. Turkey will not stand idly by.

Of course its 5 pages back...

This is one of those stories that calls out the Pro Russians who have absolutely no chance of defending this action so their only hope is to either ignore, as is being done in this thread, or dismiss it without offering anything to the contrary, which again is whats going on in this thread.

It begs the question -
Why is Putin not a fascist for allowing this and does this now make Pro Russians supporters of the "Neo Nazi" " Fascists" as well?

The Pro Russian hypocrisy and deafening silence is telling.... yet not surprising.

You are so full of it.

Any little scrap you find, you jump on it like it's the smoking gun that validates everything you say.

First of all, I'm still lost as to who these supposed "pro-Russian" members are. There's lots of pro-Ukrainians (as in the Ukrainian people, not the junta). I have yet to see any Russian posters on ATS.

Second, how can you realistically expect many people to comment on this? I may be trained in global cultural geography, but I don't really know anything about the Tartars. How am I supposed to know what is going on with them? Do you happen to be an expert on Tartar relations?

Third, what does this have to do with neo-Nazis? You're just making stuff up as you go along. The people in Kiev are self-proclaimed career neo-Nazis, and you act like "neo-nazi" is just some subjective insult thrown around.

If this story is true then it's not surprising. Russia is not some holy land; it is a capitalist empire, same as the other empires it is competing against. There are obvious fascist overtones in Russian government, but it's still a different system from the western model. But there's not much point in trying to describe it when all of this sociopolitical thought has been theorized in books by social leaders a hundred years ago.

she very gently they it make youtu.be... Caucasian and Crimean other mejlises on money CIA and j*wish oligarchs we should not prohibit killers punishers their necessary physically destroyed

originally posted by: mangust69
she very gently they it make youtu.be... Caucasian and Crimean other mejlises on money CIA and j*wish oligarchs we should not prohibit killers punishers their necessary physically destroyed

Another outraged Canadian, I see.

originally posted by: DJW001

originally posted by: sosobad

originally posted by: DJW001

originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter
a reply to: DJW001

Tatar Only make up to 5%of the Population not really a majority in the whole are of Crimea. If they want they can go back to Turkey.

Because Stalin killed or deported most of them.

You do know Stalin is dead right?

He lives on in Putin.

Lol just like George W. Bush lives on in Obama?

originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter

Lol just like George W. Bush lives on in Obama?

and Hitler lives on in Putin.

originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: Rocker2013

It literally looks like Putin is reading through a history book and emulating what the Nazis did.

Which is why so many of his supporters use neo-Nazi code words: "Zionist," "banksters," etc.

That's because everybody who isn't with you is a terrorist of some sort, right?

originally posted by: Xcathdra

originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter

Lol just like George W. Bush lives on in Obama?

and Hitler lives on in Putin.

I believe you wrote in the wrong name of who you're quoting, otherwise known as plagiarism.

a reply to: Vovin

That's because everybody who isn't with you is a terrorist of some sort, right?

Please provide a link to a post where I call someone who disagrees with me a terrorist, or where I call anyone outside of Hamas or Hezbollah one. You can't, because your statement is a blatant lie. Meanwhile, not one of the people I have accused of anti-Semitism has bothered to deny it. The hypocrisy is self evident.