The Truth About Consciousness. Based On Science.

Out of the 14 billion years that the universe has been here, why do you think that this is the time that you have come into this universe on this planet as the human individual you are today? Could you not have just as easily been born as a cat or a worm? When you die, what's stopping you from being born again as some other animal or as another human or maybe on another planet?

The truth about consciousness is that you were born through natural processes known to science. The human was born as a thinking individual prone to set up an identity through individualized awareness. That's why you're here now. You're here because your body is here. The profoundity of it is, there are many individuals.

Separation is a creation of the mind.

originally posted by: smithjustinb
Out of the 14 billion years that the universe has been here, why do you think that this is the time that you have come into this universe on this planet as the human individual you are today? Could you not have just as easily been born as a cat or a worm? When you die, what's stopping you from being born again as some other animal or as another human or maybe on another planet?

The truth about consciousness is that you were born through natural processes known to science. The human was born as a thinking individual prone to set up an identity through individualized awareness. That's why you're here now. You're here because your body is here. The profoundity of it is, there are many individuals.

Separation is a creation of the mind.

Well imho, I am currently here because I believe that as our souls try to reach full purity/Nirvana/whatever you want to call the highest form, our souls go wherever it needs to for the current "lesson"/cycle. Each stage could mean that we end up on different planets & in different forms.

As for being born through natural processes known to science, we barely know anything about science so how can we claim it's a natural process? How do we know that we weren't some freak mutation that has managed to survive this entire time?

originally posted by: knoledgeispower

originally posted by: smithjustinb
Out of the 14 billion years that the universe has been here, why do you think that this is the time that you have come into this universe on this planet as the human individual you are today? Could you not have just as easily been born as a cat or a worm? When you die, what's stopping you from being born again as some other animal or as another human or maybe on another planet?

The truth about consciousness is that you were born through natural processes known to science. The human was born as a thinking individual prone to set up an identity through individualized awareness. That's why you're here now. You're here because your body is here. The profoundity of it is, there are many individuals.

Separation is a creation of the mind.

Well imho, I am currently here because I believe that as our souls try to reach full purity/Nirvana/whatever you want to call the highest form, our souls go wherever it needs to for the current "lesson"/cycle. Each stage could mean that we end up on different planets & in different forms.

As for being born through natural processes known to science, we barely know anything about science so how can we claim it's a natural process? How do we know that we weren't some freak mutation that has managed to survive this entire time?

There are different theories as to the origin of all life. But the origin of your own life is no mystery. You came from a woman who had her egg fertilized by a sperm. There was no soul waiting up in some netherrealm to descend upon a soulless fetus to participate in the birthing process. That theory is not supported by any science. It was a assumption thrown out long ago that people went with. Its based on imagination and lack of knowledge. It is a subjective interpretation.

I don't know how we got here, but I do know the truth isn't going to involve an invisible world that we can't see. The truth is going to involve physics, math, and biology, and it will be arrived at in a sequence of discoveries that build off one another.

originally posted by: smithjustinb

originally posted by: knoledgeispower

originally posted by: smithjustinb
Out of the 14 billion years that the universe has been here, why do you think that this is the time that you have come into this universe on this planet as the human individual you are today? Could you not have just as easily been born as a cat or a worm? When you die, what's stopping you from being born again as some other animal or as another human or maybe on another planet?

The truth about consciousness is that you were born through natural processes known to science. The human was born as a thinking individual prone to set up an identity through individualized awareness. That's why you're here now. You're here because your body is here. The profoundity of it is, there are many individuals.

Separation is a creation of the mind.

Well imho, I am currently here because I believe that as our souls try to reach full purity/Nirvana/whatever you want to call the highest form, our souls go wherever it needs to for the current "lesson"/cycle. Each stage could mean that we end up on different planets & in different forms.

As for being born through natural processes known to science, we barely know anything about science so how can we claim it's a natural process? How do we know that we weren't some freak mutation that has managed to survive this entire time?

There are different theories as to the origin of all life. But the origin of your own life is no mystery. You came from a woman who had her egg fertilized by a sperm. There was no soul waiting up in some netherrealm to descend upon a soulless fetus to participate in the birthing process. That theory is not supported by any science. It was a assumption thrown out long ago that people went with. Its based on imagination and lack of knowledge. It is a subjective interpretation.

I don't know how we got here, but I do know the truth isn't going to involve an invisible world that we can't see. The truth is going to involve physics, math, and biology, and it will be arrived at in a sequence of discoveries that build off one another.

So you don't believe in alternate realities/dimensions? Our souls could have been in a different plane of existence & then when our bodies were ready, we slipped into this existence?

Alternate dimensions can be of science & physics because again, we hardly know squat about science & physics.

originally posted by: smithjustinb
Out of the 14 billion years that the universe has been here, why do you think that this is the time that you have come into this universe on this planet as the human individual you are today? Could you not have just as easily been born as a cat or a worm? When you die, what's stopping you from being born again as some other animal or as another human or maybe on another planet?

The truth about consciousness is that you were born through natural processes known to science. The human was born as a thinking individual prone to set up an identity through individualized awareness. That's why you're here now. You're here because your body is here. The profoundity of it is, there are many individuals.

Separation is a creation of the mind.

Have you come to these conclusions based on your own personal experience as being a human being with your own perceivable portion of consciousness? Or have you come to these conclusions because you believe that someone with a piece of paper deeming them credible said so?

originally posted by: smithjustinb

originally posted by: knoledgeispower

originally posted by: smithjustinb
Out of the 14 billion years that the universe has been here, why do you think that this is the time that you have come into this universe on this planet as the human individual you are today? Could you not have just as easily been born as a cat or a worm? When you die, what's stopping you from being born again as some other animal or as another human or maybe on another planet?

The truth about consciousness is that you were born through natural processes known to science. The human was born as a thinking individual prone to set up an identity through individualized awareness. That's why you're here now. You're here because your body is here. The profoundity of it is, there are many individuals.

Separation is a creation of the mind.

Well imho, I am currently here because I believe that as our souls try to reach full purity/Nirvana/whatever you want to call the highest form, our souls go wherever it needs to for the current "lesson"/cycle. Each stage could mean that we end up on different planets & in different forms.

As for being born through natural processes known to science, we barely know anything about science so how can we claim it's a natural process? How do we know that we weren't some freak mutation that has managed to survive this entire time?

There are different theories as to the origin of all life. But the origin of your own life is no mystery. You came from a woman who had her egg fertilized by a sperm. There was no soul waiting up in some netherrealm to descend upon a soulless fetus to participate in the birthing process. That theory is not supported by any science. It was a assumption thrown out long ago that people went with. Its based on imagination and lack of knowledge. It is a subjective interpretation.

I don't know how we got here, but I do know the truth isn't going to involve an invisible world that we can't see. The truth is going to involve physics, math, and biology, and it will be arrived at in a sequence of discoveries that build off one another.

Hate to burst your bubble, but most of the known world is an invisible world that we cannot see...

Presume much??? There is lots of science that backs up a consciousness outside of physical reality, that the paradigms you cling to denies this evidence and the realms of science that this evidence makes up shows how closed minded you are.

I won't bother describing a credible scientific theory explaining how the mechanisms for this would work as it is obvious by your carte blanche statements that you would scoff at them and ignore them anyways...

Jaden

a reply to: smithjustinb

Out of the 14 billion years that the universe has been here, why do you think that this is the time that you have come into this universe on this planet as the human individual you are today?

It comes easier if you imagine the Universe has always been there.

And you are unique, there is only one you. The chances of you happening are one in infinity.

originally posted by: EviLCHiMP

originally posted by: smithjustinb
Out of the 14 billion years that the universe has been here, why do you think that this is the time that you have come into this universe on this planet as the human individual you are today? Could you not have just as easily been born as a cat or a worm? When you die, what's stopping you from being born again as some other animal or as another human or maybe on another planet?

The truth about consciousness is that you were born through natural processes known to science. The human was born as a thinking individual prone to set up an identity through individualized awareness. That's why you're here now. You're here because your body is here. The profoundity of it is, there are many individuals.

Separation is a creation of the mind.

Have you come to these conclusions based on your own personal experience as being a human being with your own perceivable portion of consciousness? Or have you come to these conclusions because you believe that someone with a piece of paper deeming them credible said so?

A combination of both. But I wouldn't say, "personal experiences". More like logical deduction. And I wouldn't say, "person with a piece of paper". More like scientists who dedicate their careers to solving these problems in the most honest and objective way possible.

originally posted by: Masterjaden


Hate to burst your bubble, but most of the known world is an invisible world that we cannot see...

Presume much???

After that statement, you should be asking yourself that question.

There is lots of science that backs up a consciousness outside of physical reality,

Actually, there is none. There is no science about anything "outside of physical reality". That is a contradiction to science. Metaphysics is the study of the things outside of physical reality. Actual physics is not. And metaphysics is mostly subjective.

that the paradigms you cling to denies this evidence and the realms of science that this evidence makes up shows how closed minded you are.

Science is the paradigm. All the evidence points to either panspermia or abiogenesis. There may be some other ones that I'm forgetting about. But, none of the evidence points to any magical realms.

I won't bother describing a credible scientific theory explaining how the mechanisms for this would work as it is obvious by your carte blanche statements that you would scoff at them and ignore them anyways...

Jaden

I don't know if I would ignore them, but yeah, I'd probably scoff.

originally posted by: knoledgeispower

So you don't believe in alternate realities/dimensions? Our souls could have been in a different plane of existence & then when our bodies were ready, we slipped into this existence?

Alternate dimensions can be of science & physics because again, we hardly know squat about science & physics.

There are theories of alternate dimensions, and I'm not discounting them. But none of these theories include any evidence that they are somehow related to consciousness.

And, a cat lives in a different reality than I do.

a reply to: smithjustinb

Generally speaking, I don't think it's that likely that you would go from a human to an animal via reincarnation. I think that evolution is mostly a forward process, that is unless a much higher being's mission was to rescue beings in general of a lower stream of evolution. But even this I would say mostly applies to humans.

a reply to: smithjustinb

Your beliefs are strong, I can't help but respect that. Best of wishes on your journey my friend.

originally posted by: brazenalderpadrescorpio
a reply to: smithjustinb

Generally speaking, I don't think it's that likely that you would go from a human to an animal via reincarnation. I think that evolution is mostly a forward process, that is unless a much higher being's mission was to rescue beings in general of a lower stream of evolution. But even this I would say mostly applies to humans.

I'm not saying you go from one to another. I'm not saying when you die, you will be reincarnated. I'm saying there are trillions of others alive now. The fact that they individualize their awareness does not necessarily mean that they are separate from the universe.

You see out of your eyes and no one else's only because that's all you can do. But the other that is seeing out of their eyes and no one else's is no different than you. Even if the other is another animal. Even if the other is a worm and doesn't have eyes. You think you are an individual, but really you are just a body with a mind in an ocean of bodies with minds. For that reason, even though you're not aware of it, you are seeing out of all eyes.

Also, you are only superior to other animals if the purpose of life is to learn. But if the purpose of life is to enjoy life, imo, the sloth is superior. Superiority and purpose are both subjective and relative and don't hold much weight against the truth.

originally posted by: EviLCHiMP
a reply to: smithjustinb

Your beliefs are strong, I can't help but respect that. Best of wishes on your journey my friend.

Thank you sir or madam.

There are different theories as to the origin of all life. But the origin of your own life is no mystery. You came from a woman who had her egg fertilized by a sperm. There was no soul waiting up in some netherrealm to descend upon a soulless fetus to participate in the birthing process. That theory is not supported by any science. It was a assumption thrown out long ago that people went with. Its based on imagination and lack of knowledge. It is a subjective interpretation.

I don't know how we got here, but I do know the truth isn't going to involve an invisible world that we can't see. The truth is going to involve physics, math, and biology, and it will be arrived at in a sequence of discoveries that build off one another.

The concept of the soul isn't created out of a lack of knowledge, it's just a different form of knowledge that conflicts with the Western thought process. Science is one focus of this thought process in order to try to create a worldview which is only based on objective information. The problem here is that you can't get an absolute understanding of reality just from objective information. There are many forms of knowledge where the main three come from experience, empirical information, and testimony. Since consciousness is experienced subjectively, trying to create a theoretical framework to understand consciousness empirically will only produce limited and partial understanding of questions that originate from the subjective perspective. Testimonial and potential experiential information obtained through various spiritual traditions gives us a greater understanding of consciousness in the frame of our subjective question. The understanding here comes from undertaking spiritual practices that exercise core principles and have similar experience that only vary because of a person's experiences and personality that give them a unique way of understanding.

While the knowledge we gain from the various forms of neuroscience and cognitive science in relation to consciousness has tons of applications, there are still much more fascinating experiences and understanding we can gain on the nature of consciousness by exploring other domains of inquiry. Especially from my personal experiences I have learned to gain my overall understanding from many different perspectives which some include science, psychology, and spirituality. In fact the father of psychology William James was one of the people who warned future psychologists against Cerebralism which is the doctrine/thought process stating the mind is just the brain.

people, animals. rocks...we are all equal. nothing is more superior tan anything else.
and, once upon a time, sperm was unknowm as a fertiliser and birth was magic.

I love these threads where the existence of a soul is a forgone conclusion for most. Before I go contemplating where the soul comes from or where it goes I think we still have a long way before the/a soul has even been established to exist.

originally posted by: smithjustinb
Out of the 14 billion years that the universe has been here, why do you think that this is the time that you have come into this universe on this planet as the human individual you are today? Could you not have just as easily been born as a cat or a worm? When you die, what's stopping you from being born again as some other animal or as another human or maybe on another planet?

The truth about consciousness is that you were born through natural processes known to science. The human was born as a thinking individual prone to set up an identity through individualized awareness. That's why you're here now. You're here because your body is here. The profoundity of it is, there are many individuals.

Separation is a creation of the mind.

LOL, separation is a creation of the mind. You are correct there, but your post is a contradiction to me. I do believe science and spirituality or metaphysics will merge...mark my words! You also mention 'awareness' , in which you are lacking. No offense, but you've had no experiences of the metaphysical or consciousness outside of the body, because you are not open to it.

I've had some strange experiences! One theory I do know without a doubt is that we are all connected on a soul level or I wouldn't know when events are about to or have happened to people in my life at that moment in time without my being there. Even Einstein referred to 'spooky' science.

Someone once told me I was psychic and I didn't believe him. He said I i wasn't 'aware'. I have since learned what that means. I have even experienced a 'higher' consciousness in which a person could compare it to 'instant' ...I can't explain it, but it is referred to as 'anointed' in a book. I like to back everything up by science and have come to the conclusion that we are much more than flesh and blood, although DNA is very special and even in ancient depictions of the Sumerians we see the DNA stands, which actually look 'crystallized' with the pinecomb at the base of the skull. I believe this is connected to the pineal gland.

I do agree with the scientific theory of Panspermia and water is a very special element.

You are capable of so much more than you 'know' and that word has a great deal of significance.

a reply to: xicor

If it weren't for a thing called delusions, people's personal experiences could be trusted. Unfortunately, sometimes our personal beliefs don't correspond to reality, especially when not based on a solid foundation of things proven, but based on a foundation of other personal experiences. Math is different. It never lies and it can be trusted. Science interprets data wrong sometimes, but the good thing is, as more data is gathered, the interpretations get corrected. So, it is progressing towards a destination of a complete truth that all can agree on. Whereas philosophies and metaphysics have been around for a long time and haven't changed much over time. They aren't going anywhere and they aren't progressing towards a destination of a complete version of truth that we can all agree on. So they can't really be classified as knowledge, as you can never really know. Only believe.

a reply to: smithjustinb

try to think of things that don't fit a narrow fixed and rigid scientific margin as already reached its completion.