Spiritual Reorientation 4: Eternal Life is Eternal Death

originally posted by: AfterInfinity
The historical etymology of the word 'spirit' is easily accessible to those with even an amateur knowledge of the internet.

Because the question was not directed to you and because the question was directed to Aphorism because Aphorsim has stated that 'spirit' is breath - it does not matter that 'the historical etymology of the word 'spirit' is easily accessible to those with even an amateur knowledge of the internet'.

originally posted by: Itisnowagain
a reply to: AfterInfinity
That seems to be a bit of a cop out.(oh, you have completely changed what you said it the post)
When the body appears to be dead and is pronounced dead the breath has stopped entering it but the breath (which Aphorism has stated is 'spirit') has escaped the body.

I think coming up with an exact definition for "spirit", whether it be breath or life or any other whimsical contrivance you happen to pull out from between your ears, is going to be argued with and debated and rejected and spit on by someone. So there's no point discussing with this you, and Aphorism has often expressed similar sentiments. He has a...distaste for slapping labels on things.

But yes, let's wait and see what Aphorism has to say. I'm sure he's getting tired of repeating himself, so let's pay attention this time.

a reply to: AfterInfinity
So why do you feel the need to stick your nose in? This is Aphorisms thread and I replied to him. He has defined 'spirit' - I did not happen to pull out from between my ears any definition.
Why are you speaking for him?

So there's no point discussing with this you, and Aphorism has often expressed similar sentiments.

What is your intention then? Is it just writing for the sake of writing? Are you just trying desperately to appear clever? Telling me to check on line what 'spirit' means - why if there is no definite definition?
Please notice that I have not defined 'spirit' - I am asking about Aphorisms definition and would like to explore what 'breath' means to him and whether he has considered the points I have offered.

a reply to: Itisnowagain

Would you say that you are the body or would you say that you are what animates the body? - See more at: www.abovetopsecret.com...

The body animates itself. "Breath" is a word describing the air we inhale and exhale.

originally posted by: Aphorism
The body animates itself. "Breath" is a word describing the air we inhale and exhale.

Have you ever seen a body that has expelled the air for the last time? Have you noticed that it does not move itself? It ceases to move when the breath is no longer going in and out of it.
Have you seen an animated body without air going in and out of it?

Eternal life is not a goal but a state of being. That is, we have souls and they are eternal. Near death experiences show that I am right. Although, there are certain NDE's that speak about obliteration of the soul, which would imply that if the forces of darkness are strong enough, they can destroy the soul... maybe.

a reply to: Itisnowagain

Have you ever seen a body that has expelled the air for the last time? Have you noticed that it does not move itself? It ceases to move when the breath is no longer going in and out of it.
Have you seen an animated body without air going in and out of it?

Yes. The body no longer breathes it in nor exhales it out.

a reply to: Itisnowagain

I am asking about Aphorisms definition and would like to explore what 'breath' means to him and whether he has considered the points I have offered.

What points are you offering?

a reply to: Aphorism

Spirit was "the breath", which ather than signify ghosts and spirits, should signify life, living etc.

Spirit is the breath and without the breath going in and out of the body there is no life.
Are you the life (breath) or are you the body that the breath animates?

originally posted by: Aphorism
What points are you offering?

You have stated that 'spirit is the breath'. When the body you see moving stops moving because breath has ceased and been expelled for the last time maybe you will see that you are the breath (spirit/life) and not the body. I am not telling you this is how it is or that this is true - I am offering a new way of looking at 'spirit being the breath' (which you yourself stated).

a reply to: Itisnowagain

Spirit is the breath and without the breath going in and out of the body there is no life.
Are you the life or are you the body that the breath animates?

Am I life? Is life something that lives? I don't understand the question. The body requires air to survive.

Spirit: ORIGIN Middle English: from Anglo-Norman French, from Latin spiritus ‘breath, spirit,’ from spirare ‘breathe.’

a reply to: Itisnowagain

You have stated that 'spirit is the breath'. When the body you see moving stops moving because breath has ceased and been expelled for the last time maybe you will see that you are the breath (spirit/life) and not the body. I am not telling you this is how it is or that this is true - I am offering a new way of looking at 'spirit being the breath' (which you yourself stated).

I think I might understand. But air is not life nor an example of life. I don't think one is able to inhale or exhale without the necessary bodily faculties to do so. When one takes his last breath it is because he has stopped breathing, not because his spirit or air has left him without anything to breathe.

a reply to: Aphorism

Spirit was "the breath", which ather than signify ghosts and spirits, should signify life, living etc.

I am not sure why you do not understand what I am saying - it is you who stated that 'spirit is the breath which signifies life'. The body is dead without breath is it not?
Or do you believe you are just dead meat?

Oh well never mind - I was just exploring the idea.

a reply to: john666

We need to acknowledge that "near death" is not death, it is imcomparable.....

originally posted by: Aphorism
I think I might understand. But air is not life nor an example of life. I don't think one is able to inhale or exhale without the necessary bodily faculties to do so. When one takes his last breath it is because he has stopped breathing, not because his spirit or air has left him without anything to breathe.

It is obvious from the post above that you believe you are the body only and that it is you (as a body) that breaths the air in and out. I am looking at it a little differently - what if you are the spirit of life (the breath) and you (as air/breath) enter into a body and then leave the body when the body dies. I do not expect you to believe what I suggest as I do not know either - it is just another way of looking at the idea of 'spirit - a spirit reorientation.

The definition of spirit being "breath" or "wind" is not literal,it is describing a function.Spirit is not "literal air".It's meaning is derived from for a human to "live" it must breathe.That "life" is the spirit of man.

The construct of "spirituality" is false.Man does not "have a soul" like they "have a heart" nor are they a "spirit" being .They ARE a soul which is a body animated by "life".They are all one "entity"of "a"man.The only "life" any man can"know" in the physical realm" is the "spirit of man".

When Yahoshua is stating what "Spirit"Is it is not the "spirit" of man.All men die.They eventually "lose" their spirit of man".That is why he says even "when" you die ....you will live.The spirit of man will be dead and in the realm of death.The realm of imperception where NOTHING is known.That is why the physical realm is the "valley of the shadow of death"..it is also in the realm of imperception of "other "spirit".

The construct of "spirit" being the "thing"like an entity you are…. has twisted the truth of reason.It has created a world of "spirit beings" of a multitude of varieties that are good and evil" that are at "war" with each other when the reality is the only war is between mans ears in their mind against reality.

Spirit IS life.In that sense everyone is "spiritual" just not the false construct of religion or philosophy or psychology or even science..There are different kinds of "life" but ALL life is living.The physical realm life is of the lowest form because it dies.That is the most consistent fact that is known.

Mankind's purpose in the physical realm is very simple…LIVE.That is ALL you can do because it is positive you WILL die.You cannot ascend into a higher realm of existence in the physical realm because it is impossible because the spirit of man" is ALL in this realm.The false construct of "spirituality" is just part of a Belief System.

a reply to: Itisnowagain

It is obvious from the post above that you believe you are the body only and that it is you (as a body) that breaths the air in and out. I am looking at it a little differently - what if you are the spirit of life (the breath) and you (as air/breath) enter into a body and then leave the body when the body dies. I do not expect you to believe what I suggest as I do not know either - it is just another way of looking at the idea of 'spirit - a spirit reorientation.

Yes. My last thread is called "You are your Body". Naturally, that is what I believe.

Sure, it's an interesting idea. Most people think their bodies are just air bags anyways.

The Spirit is the breath, the breath which moves through the body animating it, and when the body dies, it takes its last exhale leaving the body.

APHORISM, you say that you believe that you are the body? Who are "you"? Who is this "you" that you are associating with the body?

Once you say "I am MY body", you are admitting that a body is something that you have, not something that you are.

You could argue against this saying, "well you can easily say 'I am MY spirit' proving that the spirit is something that you have not 'what you are', however,

I will ask then, when you remove identification,
"I am MY body", "I am MY mind", "I am MY thoughts", "I am MY emotions", "I am MY spirit"

when you do not Identify the "I" with anything, what is the "I" really?

I like how people throw the word "meaningless" around. Like in this thread about spirituality. Meaning comes from the intelligent agent. Not intelligent in terms of knowledge but in awareness of ones self. Meaning can be given to ANYTHING. Therefore spirituality is most certainly meaningful depending on who you ask and to say otherwise is only to deny a preference. Denying a preference is senseless because essentially its just projecting ones lack of meaning to another meaning, having no affect on either.

a reply to: arpgme

APHORISM, you say that you believe that you are the body? Who are "you"? Who is this "you" that you are associating with the body?

Once you say "I am MY body", you are admitting that a body is something that you have, not something that you are.

You could argue against this saying, "well you can easily say 'I am MY spirit' proving that the spirit is something that you have not 'what you are', however,

"I am my body" is A = A. It is a tautology and has little to do with possession. This is what I mean when I say I am my body. It is the body that is thinking and typing this. The body says "I" when referring to itself.

I will ask then, when you remove identification,
"I am MY body", "I am MY mind", "I am MY thoughts", "I am MY emotions", "I am MY spirit"

when you do not Identify the "I" with anything, what is the "I" really?

The "I" to me is the symbol or set under which we define ourselves. It seems a conglomeration of memories, experiences, emotions, and senses to which the body both produces and refers to when it wants to express itself and orientate itself in the world.