An Atheist's view on life vs. A Christian's view on life.

originally posted by: AfterInfinity

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: AfterInfinity

My example was an answer to the question of how one could be an atheist Jew.

I don't see how that's possible either. One cannot be a Jew and simultaneously be an atheist.

Thank you, that is the entire point.

a reply to: DarknStormy

I think you both are being deliberately obtuse.

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: DarknStormy

I think you both are being deliberately obtuse.

No I can understand what you are saying, but to me by denouncing the teachings of Christianity you yourself have given up your right to call yourself a Christian regardless of what comes before and after it, especially with Atheist on either side of it.

It doesn't matter whether you were brought up with Christianity, you are not a Christian now and therefore shouldn't use the label to describe yourself in any sense. Correct?

a reply to: DarknStormy

Why do Christians thrive on division, always trying to label who is and who is not a Christian? I don't claim to belief in Christian claims, but I still follow the moral and cultural teachings of my upbringing and heritage.

Christian atheism

Christian atheism is a theological position in which the belief in the God of Christianity is rejected or absent but the moral teachings of Jesus are followed.

Jewish atheism

Jewish atheism refers to atheism as practiced by people who are ethnically, and to some extent culturally, Jewish. Because Jewishness encompasses ethnic as well as religious components, the term "Jewish atheism" does not necessarily imply a contradiction. Based on Jewish law's emphasis on matrilineal descent, even religiously conservative Orthodox Jewish authorities would accept an atheist born to a Jewish mother as fully Jewish

a reply to: windword

Hmm. So...lemme see if I've got this straight: Jewish atheism is basically being a Jew, minus the whole reason Jews exist in the first place. And Christian atheism is basically being a Christian, minus the whole reason Christians exist in the first place.

...That's dumb. For reasons that should be entirely self-evident.

a reply to: windword

I'll put it to you this way...

What's the essence of being a Christian, a Jew or a Muslim? It's faith. Do you see Jews picking and choosing parts of the Torah to suit themselves? Do you see Muslims picking and choosing parts of the Qu'ran to suit themselves? Same as Christians?

The truth is there are many from each religion who do and they are the ones who usually give the religions the bad names whether it is deliberate or accidental. Putting your faith into religion is believing not only the teachings of Christ but the entire Bible, same as a Muslim and a Jew with their respective teachings. The Bible teaches to look out for people like the above and also expose them.

In the Jewish faith, not upholding the Jewish laws gives you an automatic loss of Jewish birthright whether you are born into a Jewish family or a convert. The same with Islam. Christianity I don't know but it does not promote Atheist Christians, that's for sure.

You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of Demons; you cannot partake of the Lord's table and of the table of Demons 1 Cor 10:21

In otherwords, you cannot be a 50/50 Christian. I guess I could use George Bush's quote to sum this up

You are either with us, or against us lol

Its really sad that this us and them mentality is so heavily propagated from both sides.
Its even sadder that this mentality is propagated from the Christian side, they are called to do better than act the way they do.
Sadly it is a world where fences are created and people are attracted to the fence.

Sometimes we should just read these types of messages, consider those who wrote them are lacking care and compassion and work out a way to help explain a reasoned understanding of ones position.

If you as an atheist feels slighted by the video, how about clarifying your position in a reasonable friendly way.

Its funny, I am a Christian atheist as well, I believe in God, His Son Jesus and the Spirit. I dont believe in Christians though.

a reply to: borntowatch

That would make you a Christian. It doesn't matter what others believe because you are true to the Bible and not others opinions and ridiculous idea's.

a reply to: DarknStormy

No, no, no. S/he is atheist, but borrows ethical guidelines from Christianity. Hence, the apparent need to reflect Christianity in the label of "Christian atheist". I guess atheism in and of itself doesn't include morals. You have to go to your Christian neighbor to borrow some. And then you have to include credit to that neighbor in your shop sign. "Hey, I'm a total atheist, but I borrow my morals from Christians because I don't have any of my own. Thanks!"

You can't just pick out a few guidelines from Christianity and refer to yourself as a Christian in any capacity. Declaring yourself to be an atheist, for one, closes that door until you take it back. Cherry picking your "Christian-ness" is another good way to ensure that you're not a "real Christian". And I see Windword doing both of those things - and assuming that those pieces s/he incorporates are actually Christian at all.

a reply to: AfterInfinity

The religions are based off faith. I could live by the Qu'ran but does that mean I go and borrow guidelines from a Satanic cult because it's apparently OK? The Bible is a guideline, that is the point of it.

But in saying that also, I disagree with many Christians and their interpretations of the Bible also and I am not saying that I am correct. I am only stating my opinion on the subject and nothing more. I don't see Atheists as bad people, The guidelines of all the religious books suggest that people will in fact turn to false doctrines and this Atheist Religious person could possibly be one of them.

a reply to: DarknStormy

What's the essence of being a Christian, a Jew or a Muslim? It's faith. Do you see Jews picking and choosing parts of the Torah to suit themselves? Do you see Muslims picking and choosing parts of the Qu'ran to suit themselves? Same as Christians?

Of course they do. Plenty of Jews enjoy a ham and cheese sandwich, washed down with a big glass of milk! LOL

There's more to religions than faith. There's also a cultural and social component. People don't just abandon their family's traditions because they have grown out of certain superstitions.

In the Jewish faith, not upholding the Jewish laws gives you an automatic loss of Jewish birthright whether you are born into a Jewish family or a convert.

No it doesn't.

You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of Demons; you cannot partake of the Lord's table and of the table of Demons

In otherwords, you cannot be a 50/50 Christian. I guess I could use George Bush's quote to sum this up

You are either with us, or against us lol

And, there it is!

I don't drink with demons, I'm not 50% Christian, I'm a Christian atheist! I don't believe in your god!

I'm not against anyone. I merely no longer believe the Christian fairy tales that I was fed when I was a child. I have outgrown such superstition, and have a more evolved spiritual outlook than your "For us or agin us!" mentality.

a reply to: windword

I'm a Christian atheist! I don't believe in your god!

Windword, you know I like you, but I'm calling serious weapons grade BS on this one. So you think following the ten commandments - and nothing else - qualifies you to call yourself a Christian in the same breath you call yourself an atheist? Ha. You're funny.

Jesus was/is the son of God.

Jesus died for our sins.

Jesus resurrected after three days of being dead.

Those are the three big ones. If there is any of those which you do not whole heartedly believe, you're not a Christian. Why? Because the Bible says so, and because those are the three questions they ask when you are baptized. They ask for a reason, you know. "Christian atheist" is absolute malarky, and I'm sorry that you even feel compelled to adopt the Christian label in order to reflect that you're not a complete asshat. You don't believe in the Christian god, and that means you're not a Christian. You're an atheist, deist, pantheist, whatever. Has nothing to do with morals.

a reply to: AfterInfinity

I don't really care what you think. In my opinion, Christian atheist is best way I can describe my life outlook. I reject the Christian god, ergo Christian atheist.

Take it, leave it, I don't give a damn.

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: AfterInfinity

I don't really care what you think. In my opinion, Christian atheist is best way I can describe my life outlook. I reject the Christian god, ergo Christian atheist.

Take it, leave it, I don't give a damn.

So you just decided to slap two opposite labels together and call it good? For your own sake, stay away from chemistry sets!

Also, I asked specifically. I asked if you meant that you were atheistic in regard to the Christian god. And you said that you consider yourself a Christian atheist because you don't believe in a god but you do borrow ethical elements from Christianity...lemme go back and find it.

Christian atheism is a theological position in which the belief in the God of Christianity is rejected or absent but the moral teachings of Jesus are followed.

The absurdity of this label, this term, is just...too much. Also, you've been using two different definitions/justifications for your adoption of this...pointless label.

a reply to: AfterInfinity

I didn't make up, or "coin" the term, it exists whether or not I choose to adopt it. Just like the term Atheist Jew, agnostic atheist, etc. there are all kinds of people with all kinds of belief / non-belief systems.

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: AfterInfinity

I didn't make up, or "coin" the term, it exists whether or not I choose to adopt it. Just like the term Atheist Jew, agnostic atheist, etc. there are all kinds of people with all kinds of belief / non-belief systems.

I don't care what part you played in the birth of the "Christian atheist", I thought you had more respect for yourself than to play such a transparent game. You might as well call yourself a Democratic Republican for all the practical good that kind of label does for you. "Christian atheist" is no choice at all. It's just pretending to choose so you can continue to play both sides of the fence.

You don't believe in a god? Then you're not Christian.

You believe in a god? Then you're not an atheist.

It. Is. That. Simple.

a reply to: windword

Actually, you do lose your birthright as a Jew.

Idolatry, Idolaters and Idolatrous Practices
312.Not to make a graven image; neither to make it oneself nor to have it made by others (Ex. 20:4) (CCN9).
313.Not to make any figures for ornament, even if they are not worshipped (Ex. 20:20) (CCN144).
314.Not to make idols even for others (Ex. 34:17; Lev. 19:4) (CCN10).
315.Not to use the ornament of any object of idolatrous worship (Deut. 7:25) (CCN17).
316.Not to make use of an idol or its accessory objects, offerings, or libations (Deut. 7:26) (CCN18). See Grape Products.
317.Not to drink wine of idolaters (Deut. 32:38) (CCN15). See Grape Products.
318.Not to worship an idol in the way in which it is usually worshipped (Ex. 20:5) (CCN12).
319.Not to bow down to an idol, even if that is not its mode of worship (Ex. 20:5) (CCN11).
320.Not to prophesy in the name of an idol (Ex. 23:13; Deut. 18:20) (CCN27).
321.Not to hearken to one who prophesies in the name of an idol (Deut. 13:4) (CCN22).
322.Not to lead the children of Israel astray to idolatry (Ex. 23:13) (CCN14).
323.Not to entice an Israelite to idolatry (Deut. 13:12) (CCN23).
324.To destroy idolatry and its appurtenances (Deut. 12:2-3) (affirmative).
325.Not to love the enticer to idolatry (Deut. 13:9) (CCN24).
326.Not to give up hating the enticer to idolatry (Deut. 13:9) (CCN25).
327.Not to save the enticer from capital punishment, but to stand by at his execution (Deut. 13:9) (negative).
328.A person whom he attempted to entice to idolatry shall not urge pleas for the acquittal of the enticer (Deut. 13:9) (CCN26).
329.A person whom he attempted to entice shall not refrain from giving evidence of the enticer's guilt, if he has such evidence (Deut. 13:9) (negative).
330.Not to swear by an idol to its worshipers, nor cause them to swear by it (Ex. 23:13) (CCN13).
331.Not to turn one's attention to idolatry (Lev. 19:4) (CCN16).
332.Not to adopt the institutions of idolaters nor their customs (Lev. 18:3; Lev. 20:23) (CCN21).
333.Not to pass a child through the fire to Molech (Lev. 18:21) (negative).
334.Not to suffer any one practicing witchcraft to live (Ex. 22:17) (negative).
335.Not to practice onein (observing times or seasons as favorable or unfavorable, using astrology) (Lev. 19:26) (CCN166).
336.Not to practice nachesh (doing things based on signs and portents; using charms and incantations) (Lev. 19:26) (CCN165).
337.Not to consult ovoth (ghosts) (Lev. 19:31) (CCN170).
338.Not to consult yid'onim (wizards) (Lev. 19:31) (CCN171).
339.Not to practice kisuf (magic using herbs, stones and objects that people use) (Deut. 18:10) (CCN168).
340.Not to practice kessem (a general term for magical practices) (Deut. 18:10) (CCN167).
341.Not to practice the art of a chover chaver (casting spells over snakes and scorpions) (Deut. 18:11) (CCN169).
342.Not to enquire of an ob (a ghost) (Deut. 18:11) (CCN172).
343.Not to seek the maytim (dead) (Deut. 18:11) (CCN174).
344.Not to enquire of a yid'oni (wizard) (Deut. 18:11) (CCN173).
345.Not to remove the entire beard, like the idolaters (Lev. 19:27) (CCN177).
346.Not to round the corners of the head, as the idolatrous priests do (Lev. 19:27) (CCN176).
347.Not to cut oneself or make incisions in one's flesh in grief, like the idolaters (Lev. 19:28; Deut. 14:1) (CCN28).
348.Not to tattoo the body like the idolaters (Lev. 19:28) (CCN163).
349.Not to make a bald spot for the dead (Deut. 14:1) (CCN164).
350.Not to plant a tree for worship (Deut. 16:21) (negative).
351.Not to set up a pillar (for worship) (Deut. 16:22) (CCN162).
352.Not to show favor to idolaters (Deut. 7:2) (CCN20).
353.Not to make a covenant with the seven (Canaanite, idolatrous) nations (Ex. 23:32; Deut. 7:2) (negative).
354.Not to settle idolaters in our land (Ex. 23:33) (negative) (CCI26).
355.To slay the inhabitants of a city that has become idolatrous and burn that city (Deut. 13:16-17) (affirmative).
356.Not to rebuild a city that has been led astray to idolatry (Deut. 13:17) (negative).
357.Not to make use of the property of city that has been so led astray (Deut. 13:18) (negative).

That's true Judaism of course

a reply to: windword

So because the Bible puts Atheism with Satanic, you are a Satanic Christian?

a reply to: DarknStormy

But the joy of being a Christian atheist is the inherent ability to use your disbelief of the Christian god to ignore whatever scripture you choose. I wonder if Windword flips a coin each day to decide which side plays the dominant role?

originally posted by: DarknStormy
a reply to: windword

So because the Bible puts Atheism with Satanic, you are a Satanic Christian?

Makes about as much sense.