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The proselytising atheist, why?

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posted on Apr, 26 2014 @ 01:44 PM
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originally posted by: LittleByLittle


From my point of view you can be a follower of any religion or lack of religion and still be my definition of a satanist. God have created ways for the ego demonic ones to fool themselves into believing they are right even when they are lost.


Right back atcha. For curiosities sake, what is Your definition with examples of how I am a satanist?


A sheep is a sheep by the fruits no matter if they are atheists or follow any religion. And even atheists are by Jesus words protected by him since they are following him in action just like Jesus preached.


Sweet, I'm always down for having a backup plan.


The problem I have with some atheists is that they are close minded (boxed in) and will not believe in kundalini or Reiki even if I use scientific methods to prove it. But then I have the same problem with some people following certain religions who do not want the science of spirituality to be quantified like science and known and proven for all.


So then could you utilize those scientific methods to substantiate your claims of reiki and kundalini? Just to clarify, yes I am an atheist. Yes I have had reiki done on me along with acupuncture and other various fun time treats. I'm not sure how you get closed minded as such a large stereotype of an entire group. I know some really smart Christians but so,e really ignorant ones too. Should I state that ALL Christians are ignorant by default? I'd prefer not to but since you seem to be an authority on the matter I eagerly anticipate your judgements.




posted on Apr, 26 2014 @ 07:46 PM
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a reply to: Spiramirabilis

Well I am glad you were clever enough to parody my parody, it just seemed a little inane.
My mistake



posted on Apr, 26 2014 @ 08:17 PM
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originally posted by: peter vlar

originally posted by: borntowatch

My agenda...is to hear a non believer say they want to stop the preaching of the gospel, stop people hearing and teaching the gospel and ultimately stop others from accepting Christ.


Oh, so you're seeking a predetermined and pre approved response that any derivation of would likely be considered untrue or invalid. In all fairness I would say that the percentage of atheists of the mind set you ascribe to us all is as small or smaller than the percentage of Christians who handle rattle snakes during services. Just because a person does not believe in god and has no use for religion in their life doesn't mean we want to begrudge you to pray to god, baby Jesus or flying monkeys for that matter. Im far more interested in how you treat me as a person than to who or what you pray to. What you seem incapable of accepting is that there is an appropriate place for preaching and teaching your scriptures. It is in your houses of worship, your Sunday schools, your summer time Jesus Camp's and your own homes. Hell, you can even stand on a street corner and yell scripture at the top of your lungs while wearing a sign board while pontificating that the end is nigh if it makes you happy.

The only place I really draw the line is I public, tax payer funded places like public schools, court houses and state and federal legislatures or opening public, community meetings with prayer. Not wanting Christianity forced upon my children in public school in no way shape or form compromises your ability to believe, pray or preach.

Even if I was still Catholic I wouldn't want someone else's interpretation of Christianity forced upon my kids. I don't know what your denomination is, but if you were for example a Southern Baptist, Would you want a Catholic or perhaps a Mormon interpretation of Christianity pushed on your offspring in a public school? I'm willing to bet not. You guys like to make Christianity sound like a one size fits all comfort sized box when its more like a Russian Matryoshka doll so please, do everyone a favor and step down off your cross and stop playing martyr. It's getting a little sad. And for the record, if I were proselytizing and a religion unto myself please send me my tex exempt status ASAP because if we taxed churches we could drastically reduce the national debt but since nobody will, atheists are obviously not their own proselytizing religion because we all pay our taxes.


No actually I am seeking the truth.
If I am wrong and thats not their agenda then fine I will accept that.
I am sure if you read my posts again you may well see I am not suggesting all atheists act in the same way, quite the opposite in fact, I have made it very clear I am not talking about the majority, just a fundamentalist minority, Ok?

As for my preaching, care to point it out, in this conspiracy in religions forum. Now lets see a conspiracy in religions forum, somewhere were religion and preaching is going to happen.
Preaching of atheism as well if you dont mind. Not that I have a problem with preachy atheists, you are welcome and I am happy to read and consider your position, if its of substance.
My issue is with comments that are irrelevant and of no value, I dont see the need for them, from either the religious or atheists.

Now what goes on in public schools, court houses and state and federal legislatures or opening public, community meetings, relating to prayer is none of my business, maybe like others in this thread you can stop people in your country having the democratic right to vote, take it away from them and you will get your way. Outside of that move to another state, country or run for office where you can dictate your own policy.

Sounds like you want everyone to get along, but only with you.
I know some things taught in schools borders on secular religions. I can live with that without a big song and dance.

and then finally lets not pretend atheism isnt its own bunch of Babooshka dolls.

Believe what you want, its your right, but as I said in the opening post , why the avalanches of inane anti religious rhetoric that offers no value.
Simple question, dont over think the question or over answer the question



posted on Apr, 27 2014 @ 08:33 AM
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a reply to: borntowatch

I'm glad you have a sense of humor


:-)

That was humor - right?



posted on Apr, 27 2014 @ 09:41 AM
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originally posted by: captaintyinknots
a reply to: LittleByLittle




The problem I have with some atheists is that they are close minded (boxed in) and will not believe in kundalini or Reiki even if I use scientific methods to prove it. But then I have the same problem with some people following certain religions who do not want the science of spirituality to be quantified like science and known and proven for all.
Another flat out lie, and another prime example of the TOTAL lack of understanding of who atheists are.

I am an atheist. I believe, and have seen proof of, energy, chakras, etc.


As I said some atheists not all.
. Seems that people read something else than what you write to have to defend their faith. Would you not call Richard Dawkins a very outspoken Atheist that are on a crusade against anything that is not in his box(Kundalini and Reiki was something he ridiculed as mumbo jumbo)? A faith driven response from the religion (Science) of this time ridiculing something that are not 100% quantified yet by science.

edit on 27-4-2014 by LittleByLittle because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 27 2014 @ 11:56 AM
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originally posted by: borntowatch

No actually I am seeking the truth.
If I am wrong and thats not their agenda then fine I will accept that.


It's not the agenda and there is no agenda for most Atheists. The same cant really be said about most Christians however who look down in contempt and judgement at atheists in particular and feel its their mandate to correct us.


I am sure if you read my posts again you may well see I am not suggesting all atheists act in the same way, quite the opposite in fact, I have made it very clear I am not talking about the majority, just a fundamentalist minority, Ok?


Fair enough in hind site I suppose but the impression you leave is decidedly the opposite of your stated intent.


As for my preaching, care to point it out, in this conspiracy in religions forum. Now lets see a conspiracy in religions forum, somewhere were religion and preaching is going to happen.


Maybe I missed it when reading over my post but could you point out where I said that you specifically are preaching? When someone uses you or your, there is context to consider and I was only referring to you or your in relation to your personal Inclinations of religion. It was a generalized statement not specific to you personally. Sorry for the confusion.


Preaching of atheism as well if you dont mind. Not that I have a problem with preachy atheists, you are welcome and I am happy to read and consider your position, if its of substance.


More power to you. I have just as big a problem with preachy atheists as I do preachy Christians, Muslims or whomever is preaching their version of history and the future.


My issue is with comments that are irrelevant and of no value, I dont see the need for them, from either the religious or atheists.


But just because you personally dont find value in a comment doesn't mean someone else will. This is a public four populated by people from across the globe who are here to exchange ideas and hopefully learn from others. If you can't hang with that I'm sure there are some religious specific message boards you would be more comfortable in after a few rounds of patting each other on the back.


Now what goes on in public schools, court houses and state and federal legislatures or opening public, community meetings, relating to prayer is none of my business, maybe like others in this thread you can stop people in your country having the democratic right to vote, take it away from them and you will get your way. Outside of that move to another state, country or run for office where you can dictate your own policy.


How did this turn into losing democratic rights or voting rights? First, I live in the United States, a republic not a democracy. Second, why on earth would I want to deny anyone who is a citizen the right to vote? I never stated or implied that. You may think however that what goes on in these public and tax payer funded institutions is none of your business but you couldn't be farther from the truth.

The Supreme Court has affirmed time and again that religious figures and acts do not belong in these places and have even cited Jeffersons letter to the Danbury Baptists. Why would I want to run away to another town country etc... When I'm well aware of what is right and what is legal. This is where my home is and i'll fight for what's right and not turn tail and run.


Sounds like you want everyone to get along, but only with you.
I know some things taught in schools borders on secular religions. I can live with that without a big song and dance.


Wrong. I get along just fine with peopled of many conflicting faiths. I just don't want or need to be preached to about god any more than youwant to be subjected to a constant stream of anti religious sentiment.


and then finally lets not pretend atheism isnt its own bunch of Babooshka dolls.


I never once stated nor inferred that was the case. I even differentiated between the average atheist and the minority of militant, in your face type atheists. Never, your defensiveness made you completely miss the point because you didn't address the statement really. Would you want a different brand of Christianity plied upon your children? If you were. Baptist, would you want your local public school to push Mormonism on your children, teaching them the tenets of that particular brand to your kids and convince them that everything YOU believe true or false about the world and faith is wrong? I seriously doubt that you would be OK with that.


Believe what you want, its your right, but as I said in the opening post , why the avalanches of inane anti religious rhetoric that offers no value.
Simple question, dont over think the question or over answer the question


Once again, only what you personally feel is a comment of value can be valued I guess. Despite the fact that the vast majority of comments in this thread are trying to clear up massive generalizations and ignorance based assumptions about who and what atheists are and their motivations. Sorry, I'm not buying into that. As far as over thinking the question or answer, the only outcome of ignoring due diligence is continued ignorance and that's just not good for anyone on either side unless they aren't really interested in the truth and merely want to propagate their own version of facts.

edit on 27-4-2014 by peter vlar because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 28 2014 @ 03:08 AM
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Or propagate something else.
Are you denying some atheists dont make inane valueless comments

As for your republic, I guess if the majority want churches to have a tax free status, prayer in school, etc, majority rule.
Isnt that what a republic is based on?



posted on Apr, 28 2014 @ 07:55 AM
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originally posted by: borntowatch


Or propagate something else.
Are you denying some atheists dont make inane valueless comments


No more so than Christians, Muslims, Jews, Hindi, Ba'Ha'I, Spanish, Italian, Irish or anyone else. Ignorance and inanity are not specific to groups you disagree with, it's a human trait across the entire spectrum of beliefs.


As for your republic, I guess if the majority want churches to have a tax free status, prayer in school, etc, majority rule.
Isnt that what a republic is based on?


Show me where the majority want that, better yet explain how prayer in shool is constitutional(its not and has been upheld by SCOTUS for 5 decades).

For the record since we apparently need a brief reprisal of civics class, the majority rules concept is called a democracy. A constitutional Republic such as the USA, means the majority elect representatives who then write bills, debate them and vote them into laws. It's not the same thing as "well if the majority wants it then let it be so".

ETA- to frame some context
edit on 28-4-2014 by peter vlar because: (no reason given)
edit on 28-4-2014 by peter vlar because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 29 2014 @ 06:21 AM
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Can we agree there are bad atheist comments and bad Christian comments at least

As for US politics, I dont understand it, dont really care to, maybe was a wrong assumption. Hence why I said "I guess".
Maybe the US political system is in a bad way if the majority are not heard.

Edit, just read what a Republic means, seems people have a right to pray in schools and not pay taxes, whats up with that.

Every person is sovereign to themselves
edit on 29-4-2014 by borntowatch because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 29 2014 @ 08:42 AM
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originally posted by: borntowatch
Can we agree there are bad atheist comments and bad Christian comments at least


Ignorance an inanity are part of the human condition and aren't bound by politics or theological concepts


As for US politics, I dont understand it, dont really care to, maybe was a wrong assumption. Hence why I said "I guess".
Maybe the US political system is in a bad way if the majority are not heard.


would your stance on that be any different if it weren't regarding prayer in school or any other religious notions? as shown in the chart above, the "majority" varies depending on what part of the country myou are living in.


Edit, just read what a Republic means, seems people have a right to pray in schools and not pay taxes, whats up with that.

Every person is sovereign to themselves


In a strict definition of republic, in theory...sure. The US is a constitutional republic though governed by a specific set of federal laws under the constitution. That is the law of the land. When you get right down to it, what constitutes a republic varies widely from the dictionary definition. Just look at the differences between the Roman Republic, the French Republic and the system we use in the states, same term widely varying interpretations and implementations.



posted on Apr, 29 2014 @ 07:28 PM
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originally posted by: benrl

originally posted by: Prezbo369
a reply to: benrl

Lots of people (such as yourself) seem unable to come to terms with the word atheist, despite that being exactly what you/they are.

Atheists dont by default claim that there is no god, most (such as you and I) state that we do not know, and so can be described as agnostic-atheists.....





atheist  
Use Atheist in a sentence
a·the·ist [ey-thee-ist] Show IPA
noun
a person who denies or disbelieves the existence of a supreme being or beings.




Atheism is, in a broad sense, the rejection of belief in the existence of deities.[1][2] In a narrower sense, atheism is specifically the position that there are no deities.[3][4][5] Most inclusively, atheism is the absence of belief that any deities exist.[4][5][6][7] Atheism is contrasted with theism,[8][9] which in its most general form is the belief that at least one deity exists.[9][10]


Pardon my ignorance, I use words as the English language defines them.

Not what ever niche group decides they mean.



To deny a belief in something is not the same as to claim knowledge that it is untrue.

Gnosticism/agnosticism deals with what we know.

Theism/atheism deals with what we believe.

Understanding this reveals that what Prezbo said is actually in no way incongruous to the definitions you yourself provided.
edit on RAmerica/Chicago30uTue, 29 Apr 2014 19:29:05 -05004-0500fCDT07 by ReturnofTheSonOfNothing because: ...



posted on May, 1 2014 @ 07:35 AM
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a reply to: ReturnofTheSonOfNothing

Addenum as a supplimentary to the previous post -

Consider this diagram -




posted on May, 1 2014 @ 07:48 AM
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a reply to: borntowatch

I agree with the OP but just for this forum, every other forum on ATS should be open for the atheists to vent and attack but this one. Why ? This forum is more for religious discussion within the context that God exists. This is not the forum to debate cosmology, abiogenesis, and evolution. It should be sort of a religious gusher sanctuary, Christians debating other Christians over dogma, of coarse other religions are able discuss as well but generally the discussions seem to focus on Judeo/Christian ideology. Of coarse sincere questions by agnostics are always welcome.
But why would a hardcore atheist troll these forums ? Really ? Seriously ?

It would be like me going in the Alien/UFO threads and mocking and trolling them, because I don't believe.
Why would I do that ? I wouldn't because I know it's stupid and rude.



posted on May, 1 2014 @ 09:23 AM
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a reply to: Blue_Jay33

I see ATS as an open forum.

Everyone is allowed to post everywhere as long as they do it in a civil manner.

What you and the OP are suggesting is exclusionary and insular, and there are many sites out there that are dedicated to theist mental masturbation, where certain thoughts and ideas are forbidden. Don't try to carve out a piece of ATS for a specific ideaologies circle jerk... welcome the colourful tapestry of diversity of thought.

This site is about denying ignorance, which means everything can be questioned in any context, as long as it is on topic. Any thread that contains the concept of God, by its very nature begs the question of there being no God, so it is relevant for an atheist or otherwise to question the perceived truth.

Whichever side is true actually doesn't matter in the face of lively debate.

;-j



posted on May, 1 2014 @ 12:53 PM
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Could someone explain what a Gnostic atheist is?




posted on May, 2 2014 @ 07:03 AM
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a reply to: Akragon

An atheist that claims to know that there is no god.



posted on May, 2 2014 @ 11:06 AM
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originally posted by: Blue_Jay33
a reply to: borntowatch

I agree with the OP but just for this forum, every other forum on ATS should be open for the atheists to vent and attack but this one. Why ? This forum is more for religious discussion within the context that God exists. This is not the forum to debate cosmology, abiogenesis, and evolution. It should be sort of a religious gusher sanctuary, Christians debating other Christians over dogma, of coarse other religions are able discuss as well but generally the discussions seem to focus on Judeo/Christian ideology. Of coarse sincere questions by agnostics are always welcome.
But why would a hardcore atheist troll these forums ? Really ? Seriously ?

It would be like me going in the Alien/UFO threads and mocking and trolling them, because I don't believe.
Why would I do that ? I wouldn't because I know it's stupid and rude.


Well its hard to argue but I will

I think legitimate questions and serious issues should be aired in all forms, the bible should be questioned, Christians should be accountable for their faith. Atheists should be allowed to apply pressure.
I would like to see the replys valid and relevant

I was just asking for a little more respect, its rare, but not just here
edit on 2-5-2014 by borntowatch because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 2 2014 @ 11:10 AM
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originally posted by: puzzlesphere
a reply to: Blue_Jay33

I see ATS as an open forum.

Everyone is allowed to post everywhere as long as they do it in a civil manner.

What you and the OP are suggesting is exclusionary and insular, and there are many sites out there that are dedicated to theist mental masturbation, where certain thoughts and ideas are forbidden. Don't try to carve out a piece of ATS for a specific ideaologies circle jerk... welcome the colourful tapestry of diversity of thought.

This site is about denying ignorance, which means everything can be questioned in any context, as long as it is on topic. Any thread that contains the concept of God, by its very nature begs the question of there being no God, so it is relevant for an atheist or otherwise to question the perceived truth.

Whichever side is true actually doesn't matter in the face of lively debate.

;-j


I think you misread my original post.
All I asked for was a civil manner and decorum, I am not and never have asked for exclusions of replys, just they have value

Is that to much



posted on May, 2 2014 @ 04:59 PM
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a reply to: borntowatch

My apologies. ;-j

The post I was responding to made me think I was in that other thread from a little while ago suggesting that atheists shouldn't be allowed to post in the religious forum.

I undersand wanting civility and decorum, and prefer it myself (I always try to be civil... apologies again as my previous post did contain a little venom at exclusionary ideaologies). Though sometimes you need a little rubble to make the gems shine. ;-j





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