Reconciling Arius...

a reply to: jmdewey60

Do you respect Elaine Pagels, jm??

I have yet to read any of her books, but I think her ideas are very much worth considering.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Do you respect Elaine Pagels, jm??

She is an academic so doesn't operate in a vacuum, meaning high level experts in their fields collaborate with her so that she has the best information available at the time of writing.
That, and she does a lot of research herself, and one of the reasons why people are willing to assist her, plus she is just a good writer who makes all this stuff that could be very dry, interesting.

a reply to: Akragon

Well, I have to say thank you for this thread AK. It brings
my knowledge further along and I appreciate that bigtime.

SnF

a reply to: randyvs

My pleasure...

Oh, and please don't take offence to my ramblings in your thread... It was not meant to be hurtful...

a reply to: Akragon

C'mon you know I'm thick skinned and as I've said
before, refuse to hold grudges from thread to thread
AK. And you seem to reciprocate the same respects
rather well. So, were good on my end.

Now this is a thread point I like. Spot on!

Stay strong.

a reply to: Akragon

In AD 325 Emperor Constantine convened the Council of Nicaea, the very first ecumenical council. More than 300 bishops came from all over the Christian world to debate the nature of the Holy Trinity. It was one of the early church's most intense theological questions. Arius, from Egypt, was teaching that Jesus the Son was not equal to God the Father. Arius forcefully argued his position at length. The bishops listened respectfully.

As Arius vigorously continued, Nicholas became more and more agitated. Finally, he could no longer bear what he believed was essential being attacked. The outraged Nicholas got up, crossed the room, and slapped Arius across the face! The bishops were shocked. It was unbelievable that a bishop would lose control and be so hotheaded in such a solemn assembly. They brought Nicholas to Constantine. Constantine said even though it was illegal for anyone to strike another in his presence, in this case, the bishops themselves must determine the punishment.

The bishops stripped Nicholas of his bishop's garments, chained him, and threw him into jail. That would keep Nicholas away from the meeting. When the Council ended a final decision would be made about his future.

Nicholas was ashamed and prayed for forgiveness, though he did not waver in his belief. During the night, Jesus and Mary his Mother, appeared,* asking, "Why are you in jail?" "Because of my love for you," Nicholas replied. Jesus then gave the Book of the Gospels to Nicholas. Mary gave him an omophorion, so Nicholas would again be dressed as a bishop. Now at peace, Nicholas studied the Scriptures for the rest of the night.

When the jailer came in the morning, he found the chains loose on the floor and Nicholas dressed in bishop's robes, quietly reading the Scriptures. When Constantine was told of this, the emperor asked that Nicholas be freed. Nicholas was then fully reinstated as the Bishop of Myra.

The Council of Nicaea agreed with Nicholas' views, deciding the question against Arius. The work of the Council produced the Nicene Creed which to this day many Christians repeat weekly when they stand to say what they believe.

a reply to: godlover25

Nicholas was ashamed and prayed for forgiveness, though he did not waver in his belief. During the night, Jesus and Mary his Mother, appeared,* asking, "Why are you in jail?" "Because of my love for you," Nicholas replied. Jesus then gave the Book of the Gospels to Nicholas. Mary gave him an omophorion, so Nicholas would again be dressed as a bishop. Now at peace, Nicholas studied the Scriptures for the rest of the night.

When the jailer came in the morning, he found the chains loose on the floor and Nicholas dressed in bishop's robes, quietly reading the Scriptures. When Constantine was told of this, the emperor asked that Nicholas be freed. Nicholas was then fully reinstated as the Bishop of Myra.
www.stnicholascenter.org...

Pfft! What a scam! The Catholic Church, committing pious forgeries and creating lies since the Council of Nicaea (and before)! LOL!

a reply to: godlover25

The Council of Nicaea agreed with Nicholas' views, deciding the question against Arius. The work of the Council produced the Nicene Creed which to this day many Christians repeat weekly when they stand to say what they believe.

In the Episcopal church, they don't stand to say it. They kneel and humbly bow their heads. Or, at least they did 40 years ago.
I repeated it weekly for about 15 years, and clearly remember how even as I 'recited' it I knew for sure that I did not believe it. That it was nonsense.
At about age 10.

a reply to: godlover25

In AD 325 Emperor Constantine convened the Council of Nicaea, the very first ecumenical council. More than 300 bishops came from all over the Christian world to debate the nature of the Holy Trinity.

That's a hoax.
It was really decided at the second Council.

What is known as the "Niceno-Constantinopolitan Creed" or the "Nicene-Constantinopolitan Creed"[16] received this name because of a belief that it was adopted at the Second Ecumenical Council held in Constantinople in 381 as a modification of the original Nicene Creed of 325. In that light, it also came to be very commonly known simply as the "Nicene Creed".
en.wikipedia.org...

The Council of Nicea was about Easter and pensions for nuns and a couple other things.
There was a fable invented after the fact when Arius died, to make out that there had been a council that condemned him, thus making his death seem like righteous retribution for daring to be disagreeable to the doctrine being pushed by Athanasius.

So this is war-time (the centuries long war against Arianism) propaganda that stuck, perpetrated with forged documents that have been pointed out as being such, for example the list of so-called signers being off, where some were not bishops at that time, or they are matched up wrongly with their constituencies.
(this stuff was gone over in detail in an earlier thread that I contributed to, that was originally about the myth that the Council of Nicea was about what books to include in the Bible)

a reply to: Akragon

Thing is, that Jesus was like his Father-- a Father. His son, Bar-Jesus (Strong's G919 Βαριησοῦ* Acts 13:6), turned out to become a magician settling in Crete, whom Paul calls «son of the Devil» (Jesus is the Devil, Paul?) in Acts 13. We can only hope it is a friendly and ironic salute. Anyway Paul demonstrates his latest trick with what I believe was 'the spirit of blindness' and 'the water of life', methanol and ethanol made with an alambique like the one below perhaps. Since he claims the blindness effect is momentary we can only assume he knew how to cure him and actually managed to do cure him.

a reply to: Utnapisjtim

that is stretchin it brother...

would you mind posting some links to your theory?

I could see Jesus having a son... but a magician, with Paul dissing him?

Wow lol...