The bible is the bait and hook the "devil" uses to get you.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: DarknStormy
a reply to: BuzzyWigs

This is one of those things which I think could of been changed to fit the Roman agenda. Ancient Egyptians were Sun Worshippers and I would say the Roman Pagans could fall under the same banner. Maybe it was them that introduced the reincarnation thing to Christianity? But at the same time I'm not saying it's correct either.

The Romans are the ones who pushed the current dogma of Christianity. So it is more likely that reincarnation was the accepted part of Christianity first, then the Romans changed it to fit their needs.

There is no evidence that the early christians or the Romans had anything to do with reincarnation. Even sun worship is a resurrection idea, the resurrection from the nether world of the sun each day on its solar barge. This is how hard core sun worshipers saw themselves. That's why the Egyptians took care to mummify the dead because the body would be resurrected at some point. Christian ideas about resurrection do diverge from the sun worshipers to a very great extent theologically even if they appear to be convergent to the unlearned.

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: Logarock

There's some pretty prominent Mormons that don't care what you think: Cliven Bundy, Mitt Romney and Harry Reid, just to name a few.

I wouldn't dismiss the Mormons as fools so readily.

I am certain that you wouldn't if you get the drift.

a reply to: Logarock

No, I don't get your drift. Why don't you just say what you mean?

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: Logarock

Jesus did not teach reincarnation in an eastern method, a modified method or any method or likeness at all. Nothing was changed around, borrowed, affixed or dovetailed into christianity from the concept of reincarnation.

Excuse me (us) if I (we) don't accept your authoritative stance on this issue. Your opinion is just that, your opinion.

There's more than enough evidence to prove that early Christians accepted reincarnation. But, if you think you can prove otherwise, you should make a thread on it.

I suppose to anyone that has a mind for what constitutes a good idea or theory would deduce that no thread is needed based on the scanty evidence, because there is none, provided in this thread, that christians ever accepted reincarnation. Not to mention trusting those that steadily eviscerate christians and christianity with the truth about any such idea.

I also suppose that, having hoped not to be required to say it out loud, my concerns about peoples opinions in a thread like this are truly mutual.

a reply to: Logarock

There's loads of proof for reincarnation in the Bible, contemporary literature and in early church history and writings.

Pre-existence, Reincarnation & Christianity

Wow! THANK YOU for enlightening me! This is BY FAR the most eye opening, truth revealing, non-biased, non-distorted, fully bathed in awe inspiring, jaw dropping, truth I myself have read in such a VERY long time!

One Nation Under: Lies

The story of Lucifer bears a strong resemblance to the story of Prometheus, he gave humans knowledge and enlightenment, and gets punished for it for eternity by the pantheon of gods who hold court over everything. History is written by the victor, in this case Lucifer may have been given a bad rap. Who is it that directly commits genocide and orders the deaths of millions at the hands of his servants www.evilbible.com... 9 yet says murder is against the commandments. How many people did lucifer supposedly kill? dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com...

originally posted by: muzzleflash
Everyone is their own Devil and Jesus.
Only you can choose for you, no one else is responsible for you in the end.

It's that simple.

I like it and agree in a way that i cant explain.

How about this.

I read the OP and think that maybe you never even read the Bible. Also, it's interesting that it's always about loving others except christians. All of us intolerant christians and our foolish beliefs. And we must be super stupid to get fooled by that crafty genius of a devil. I think if your the devil maybe your not that smart. From what I hear it didn't turn out well. But again I am believing these foolish lies. Well, sir(or ma'am), thank you for your opinion. I would ask do you believe in evolution, but that is another thread. It is a belief system in itself, you know.

But arguing facts is more important here, I think. Someone predisposed to a belief is not going to have their minds changed by a ATS thread, are they? Especially one that is insulting and kind of childish, no offense.

Let's see here:
1) One of the most free nations on the earth was since it's foundation predominantly christian. The devil really put the screws to us there.
2)One of the least religious nations(Japan) also happens to have one of the highest suicide rates. And they even blur their porn. There is actually a forest where people go, just to kill themselves. The true god must be encouraging our death by our own hands. Curious.
3) Anton Levay thought he was personally responsible for the decapitation of Jane Mansfield because he accidentally cut a picture in a magazine. Sounds like he had it all together. Did he worship the god of the Bible satan or the satan satan? I am confused. Or better I am perplexed, which are the reported last words of one Aleister Crowley, a man called "The Beast", probably not because he was great to hang out with. Read about him, he was a gas gas gas.
4) As far as reincarnation goes, they actually asked Yeshua about it. His reply was "Now about the dead rising—have you not read in the Book of Moses, in the account of the burning bush, how God said to him, ‘I am the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob’[d]? 27 He is not the God of the dead, but of the living. You are badly mistaken!” This of course does not necessarily mean reincarnation, but resurrection after death. Hope that helps

Seems there is a group of individuals that find joy in mocking others for sport, despite not really coming off as factual or intelligent. So instead it kind of seems you mock yourself unknowingly. And that is sad. As far as the character of these devil worshipping christians, I believe a non religious man said it best:

"There are no atheist soup kitchens" Marc Maron

You read the OP and promptly shoved your head back in the sand, You suffer from cognitive dissonance. Believe it or not Athesist actually know more about your bible than you do. Oh and there is this www.huffingtonpost.com...

a reply to: Krazysh0t
Simple, the OP you are talking about is not an attack on the koran, but an attack on people who do not believe in the same interpretation as the OP did. ATS is by no means as free as you think it is. For anything to be free it must be questioned all the time otherwise it finds a dark corners to hide. Ats has lots and lots of dark corners.

originally posted by: pleasethink
I read the OP and think that maybe you never even read the Bible. Also, it's interesting that it's always about loving others except christians. All of us intolerant christians and our foolish beliefs. And we must be super stupid to get fooled by that crafty genius of a devil. I think if your the devil maybe your not that smart. From what I hear it didn't turn out well. But again I am believing these foolish lies. Well, sir(or ma'am), thank you for your opinion. I would ask do you believe in evolution, but that is another thread. It is a belief system in itself, you know.

But arguing facts is more important here, I think. Someone predisposed to a belief is not going to have their minds changed by a ATS thread, are they? Especially one that is insulting and kind of childish, no offense.

Let's see here:
1) One of the most free nations on the earth was since it's foundation predominantly christian. The devil really put the screws to us there.
2)One of the least religious nations(Japan) also happens to have one of the highest suicide rates. And they even blur their porn. There is actually a forest where people go, just to kill themselves. The true god must be encouraging our death by our own hands. Curious.
3) Anton Levay thought he was personally responsible for the decapitation of Jane Mansfield because he accidentally cut a picture in a magazine. Sounds like he had it all together. Did he worship the god of the Bible satan or the satan satan? I am confused. Or better I am perplexed, which are the reported last words of one Aleister Crowley, a man called "The Beast", probably not because he was great to hang out with. Read about him, he was a gas gas gas.
4) As far as reincarnation goes, they actually asked Yeshua about it. His reply was "Now about the dead rising—have you not read in the Book of Moses, in the account of the burning bush, how God said to him, ‘I am the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob’[d]? 27 He is not the God of the dead, but of the living. You are badly mistaken!” This of course does not necessarily mean reincarnation, but resurrection after death. Hope that helps

Seems there is a group of individuals that find joy in mocking others for sport, despite not really coming off as factual or intelligent. So instead it kind of seems you mock yourself unknowingly. And that is sad. As far as the character of these devil worshipping christians, I believe a non religious man said it best:

"There are no atheist soup kitchens" Marc Maron

1) One of the most free nations? You are delusional, in denial or simply have no idea what freedom is.
"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free."

2) You have very strange logic. War veterans have a higher risk of suicide as well, High IQ'ed people too. I could twist statistics to my advantage and say the most Christian country in the world is also the one that produces the most porn, weapons, violent movies. high crime and inmate population. So the Japanese people are existentially depressed...they should be! look around you!

3)What does Satan have to do with anything pertaining this thread? Did I ever mention Satan? Satan is a biblical concept...I'm talking about the devil or evil one whose name has proven to be elusive. And when did I imply that Anton LaVey was somehow lucid, enlightened or anything like that? But it's funny you should use the kooky Jane Mansfield example considering most Christians believe in a LITERAL talking snake, among other kooky literal interpretations.

4)About John the Baptist..."And if you are willing to understand what I, mean, he is Elijah, the one the prophets said would come. And if ever you were willing to listen, listen now!|" and then Elijah again in the end times..."Behold I will send you Elijah the prophet, before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord." (Malachi 4:5)
o, Original Elijah...who then comes back as John the Baptist....Elijah appears in the transfiguration....then before the day of the Lord...so, this dude is coming back to earth regularly in different bodies...hmmmm

I'm not mocking what I consider to be the supreme, perfect, formless, purest, holiest spirit. I'm just not buying MOST of the anthropomorphic evil bs that has been attributed to it...through the human-written bible.

originally posted by: lupodigubbio


So maybe the devil in his 10000+ IQ mind thinks...hmm, if I give them 100% pure rat poison they might not eat it...so instead I'm going to mix the poison with yummy cheese so they can't even taste the bitterness but will surely feel it later...slowly...until they die....spiritually.

So by mixing truth with lies, you end up not knowing what to do...the answers are there for sure but so altered and #ed up that you have to take it out with tweezers, wash it and then marvel at the sheer tactics of this genius of evil. The best trap to lure us in and confuse the hell out of us (literally) so that we won't find "the way, the truth and everlasting life"

Agree ,actually many brainwashing ads use the same trick.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: DarknStormy

When it comes down to it, you can only change the course and thought process of your spirit, no-one else can.

Correct. And it takes many, many stints here (or in other worlds/dimensions) to get to the goal.
But, the really really good news is that we all make it. Eventually.

Screw up as much as it takes. You'll be fine. We all will.

Agree with most of what you have posted, but this part, is just not possible without some interesting intervention.

Many souls, of creation are already too far gone.

Notice in the ENTIRE higher astral travelling, self-realizing, every dam sort of teachings that talk about the Universe and such as being all love etc. ARE ALL THE SAME, they all teach different ways of stupidity that look like they are true, but dug deep enough into are easily proven false.

Take yourself to levels of amazingness and vibration that are just totally beyond human, and you will see that a GOOD MANY things in every dimension are completely and totally not going to make it.

It is certainly part of the entrapments that the ENTIRETY OF CREATION, and the original 'creator' so to speak are NOT immune to failure, and of becoming so damaged that no return is ever possible.

I have found that NO teachings on this earth, have resulted from "truth" but from a place of fear that masquerades as the greatness of GOD, but ALL are dedicated to "harvesting" your good efforts for nothing more than stopping you from seeing the totality of Utter Failure of the Original Goals.

God throwing itself into the Creation to make it real, total fracture and non-remembering are COMPLETE.

Until one throws aside the bizarre beliefs that something is in Control, it will continuously loop and loop, without question, until nothing more than delusion exists,

Already 99.99% the way there.

originally posted by: sk0rpi0n
if satans plan was to publish books warning people to stay away from...Satan. That has to be the worst plan ever. Satan will not fight himself.___________________________________________________ Those who follow satan do so out of their own free will. After all, satan can only control those who chose to consciously follow him.

No he isn't tricking you to stay away form Satan, he is tricking you into siding with him under the belief that he is in fact the good guy, and the good guy is bad.

edit: didn't realize how late I was into this thread.

originally posted by: lupodigubbio
Of course, by Devil I don't mean this dude, out of drag.

I mean this devll, in full drag, ready to deceive.

and his weapon of choice, the book of truth and lies.

You see, one of the biggest, most fallacious and repeated cliches of all time says time and time again:
"The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was to convince the world he didn't exist"

Let me offer you an alternative:
"The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was to convince the world he was God"

But what is the benefit of tricking others into believing you don't exist? Where's the glory, the worship, the praise, the stroking of the ego? Doesn't seem like pride is involved in strategy by someone who wants to "ascend above the tops of the clouds; I will make myself like the Most High."
What about the benefits of tricking others into believing you are God? Well, for starters, all the blame is immediately pinned elsewhere, like human condition for example, sinful evil little humans and their little pet serpent. "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain" So, by deflecting attention from yourself, it shifts to someone else. Another benefit is absolute, unquestioning allegiance of weaker beings who trough intimidation and awesome displays of power will obey your every word.

After all, he is the father of lies isn't he? Meaning, he is the most cunning, strategic, intelligent liar there ever was so it would be easy to manipulate a world full of hybrid monkeys...kind of like we trick animals into becoming our dinner, only a bit more sophisticated.
Which brings me to my point.. The "Devil" is not as dumb as we think. (btw, I'm just exploring more logical scenarios here)

To think that human intelligence can come even close to figuring out the most complex archetype with all the resources to carry out his plans, millions of human and non-human armies at his disposal...somehow, we, the average human, know exactly how the story ends because, well, we read the book. God's book.

So this book, in your opinion, is infallible, perfect, has all the answers to life's problems, is easy to digest, follow and apply and is the literal word of God...

A book that:

-Is not a book but a collection of books...about a God with multiple personality disorder (or several Gods wink wink

) about genetic manipulation...xenophobia, war and genocide....animal abuse...and extreme laws....written by human beings...through CHANNELING....and hearsay...in different countries...with different cultures...different languages....spread throughout thousands of years...cherry picked...translated back and forth...edited...interpreted...and SOLD in a church near you.

HOWEVER...if the bible was JUST that then it would be easy to figure out and anyone with an IQ of 80 and above would say...."heeyyyyy wait a minute mister!"

But it's so much more than that. It is also filled with....ancient hermetical knowledge...esoteric secrets of all kinds...clues as to how to use the universal laws to your advantage....really good advice about everyday life...the most amazing teacher ever...and a guide to salvation.

So maybe the devil in his 10000+ IQ mind thinks...hmm, if I give them 100% pure rat poison they might not eat it...so instead I'm going to mix the poison with yummy cheese so they can't even taste the bitterness but will surely feel it later...slowly...until they die....spiritually.

So by mixing truth with lies, you end up not knowing what to do...the answers are there for sure but so altered and #ed up that you have to take it out with tweezers, wash it and then marvel at the sheer tactics of this genius of evil. The best trap to lure us in and confuse the hell out of us (literally) so that we won't find "the way, the truth and everlasting life"

The point of this whole harangue is...blind belief in 100% of the bible is naive,dangerous and certainly not a requisite for salvation or spiritual advancement. You can be a follower of Christ and not even read the bible once. How? By loving your neighbor as yourself and by not judging others....like I am judging you LOL.

Last thing I promise.

"Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it."

Your argument is seemingly based off the assumption that people do not objectify to the teachings of the bible. There are too many holes in your theory for it to hold any unquestionable truths, such as what exactly would be the purpose of creating a false God in order to cover up a true false God? By doing so one would then be abolishing the God-Complex all together by inadvertently implying that any such belief in a higher power, or God, is to accept the satanic path.

Truly I feel that you are merely intellectualizing the catalysts of widely accepted truths, and by hypothesizing an opposite opinion, you deem it credible due to it's resonance with your own beliefs or perceptions. This pattern of thinking is dangerous to maintaining a healthy mind.

The Truth leaves no room for questions.

a reply to: lupodigubbio




Gee, does this mean the idea I had about the big deception ( the one that is described in the Bible) about 3 years ago, that all the bible thumpers are going to have the Apocolypse (also means an unveiling) of knowledge that they have been worshipping the devil for millennia? Might actually hold some water? Thank you for the reinforcement of the idea.

Me, personally, I can find better things to do with my time and money, Thank you.

To me, if you treat people the way you want to be treated, the world would be a WAYYYYY better place, BUUUTTTTT NNNNOOOOO, you always have people who think they are better than you, or, want to screw you over to get what you got, pretty sad if you ask me.

I have no religious preference, just to be true to myself, cuz after all, if you aren't, you are living a lie....right?

ETA: Kudos for starting this thread, I would read it, but, I don't want to read all the bickering. Because, what ever anyone believes in is right and the guy is wrong, and visa-versa.

originally posted by: thepolish1
a reply to: lupodigubbio




Gee, does this mean the idea I had about the big deception ( the one that is described in the Bible) about 3 years ago, that all the bible thumpers are going to have the Apocolypse (also means an unveiling) of knowledge that they have been worshipping the devil for millennia? Might actually hold some water? Thank you for the reinforcement of the idea.

Me, personally, I can find better things to do with my time and money, Thank you.

To me, if you treat people the way you want to be treated, the world would be a WAYYYYY better place, BUUUTTTTT NNNNOOOOO, you always have people who think they are better than you, or, want to screw you over to get what you got, pretty sad if you ask me.

I have no religious preference, just to be true to myself, cuz after all, if you aren't, you are living a lie....right?

ETA: Kudos for starting this thread, I would read it, but, I don't want to read all the bickering. Because, what ever anyone believes in is right and the guy is wrong, and visa-versa.

I appreciate your ideals of this matter, thepolish1.

This perspective is a perfect example of the missunderstood belief that an external great deception exists. If this were so, one could only succeed in deceiving one who chooses to internalize this ideaology, or better stated, if one decides to adopt the beliefs of another beings perception/opinion as their own without appropriately experiencing the ideal with regards to gaining an understanding of the truths, if any, of the matter. We as beings are designed for discernment by means of experiential processes and the wisdom that is acquired from such.

For one to accept a belief without experiential evidences, in my opinion, is a costly mistake of ignorance. This is why it is crucial to ask "why?"

a reply to: lupodigubbio

I believe the points I made are valid, and you haven't really refuted them, you just pointed at them and said "That's stupid" (generalization) along with insulting me personally and what I believe in. Can I get some of that enlightenment you possess? It's obviously better than everyone else's. Your character and words testify.

And Satan and the devil are pretty much one and the same. If I was to ask one hundred random people on the street "Who is Satan?" at least 90% would answer "the devil". So am I also incorrect in using that name instead of the devil? Is this another area where you will teach me about how delusional I am?

And say what you want about America, any nation that a woman can paint art with her period blood is obviously a little more free then it should be, IMO. That's probably why we lead the world in porn etc etc. But to call it unfree is a little ludicrous just because we possess laws. I would go further and say no one is truly free, unless they are set free by G-d, but oooooohhhhhhh that would stir the poop storm wouldn't it? I've known a lot of people that follow masonry and other esoteric gnostic leaning teachings. I've also been around a lot of christians. I like the christians better. They love more. And are kinder. And it's not a invite only operation of elitists who love to stroke each others egos and talk about how "enlightened" they are and how "stupid" everyone else is. I was tested at 148 IQ. I scored an 80 on my ASVAB out of a possible 99. For those in the Armed Services, they know this test also tests mechanical aptitude as well as academic. I scored in the top 95% of all graduating seniors in the US in my GED on all five sections. My TABE was 12.9 across the board(highest you can go boyo). All while dropping out of high school at 15 in the ninth grade. My cousins are charter members of Mensa. And Yeshua has saved my life and I see the work His Father did all around me. Intelligence never lead me to wisdom. But G-d did. And I didn't even deserve it, as I am a shameful creature. What a glorious G-d is He! Thank you for reminding me how great He truly is.

“Though seeing, they do not see;
though hearing, they do not hear or understand.
14 In them is fulfilled the prophecy of Isaiah:

“‘You will be ever hearing but never understanding;
you will be ever seeing but never perceiving.
15 For this people’s heart has become calloused;
they hardly hear with their ears,
and they have closed their eyes.
Otherwise they might see with their eyes,
hear with their ears,
understand with their hearts
and turn, and I would heal them.

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: Logarock

There's loads of proof for reincarnation in the Bible, contemporary literature and in early church history and writings.

Pre-existence, Reincarnation & Christianity

Strictly speaking, of a classical eastern idea about reincarnation, or any ideas about a persons spirit being transferred into a new body in a life cycle, none of this is in the books of the bible.