Obama: US military ‘significantly superior’ to Russia’s

originally posted by: renden

originally posted by: ammocase
I dont support military war in any way, but the US military are Giants when compared to any other country. Some posters are mixing up failures in occupying with failures in actual combat and engagement. Not only does the US have top technology when it comes to military weaponary, but they are the leader when it comes to training exercises around the world, they also engage in practice sessions with other countries due to their broad associations (like anti-terrorism training with the Israelis).

They are also allies and training partners with other nations who also are leaders in military technology, and also have a past of military invasion/imperialism (which believe it or not, counts when it comes to adding up experience to look back on).

And what are other people dont put into account - they have a large and high-tech spy network. If you think Afghanistan and Iraq was just oil and revenge, then you are wrong - the US i am sure infilitrated their gold-mine of terrorists networks that were hidden and in some cases ran those countries ( a country full of immigrants like the USA has its advantages, one being that we can hire a "die for the usa" american-born that is full-blooded muslim/arab, etc. to infiltrate and take over terrorist networks) - there is no coincidence that all these muslim countries are all of a sudden "REVOLTING" out of thin air, it started with the invasion of afghanistan and iraq, which were terrorists hot-spot centers that the USA now broke in and put under their wing.

I dont see Russia at that level at all.

Here's the real level.

Guys with AKs are getting blasted by Cobras, easy hunting, right?

Just fly right on there, press a button and presto, guys with AKs are turned in to dog scraps.

Nope, a determined guy out there fighting a war for his land, even with a same old AK is still a warrior to be feared.

Here's one shooting back at a Cobra that's trying to strafe him, shoots the pilot dead.

www.youtube.com...

So what tech is thas? When in the 21st century, a guy with an AK can still flat out kill a Cobra pilot. Where is all that wonder super tech? Yeap, it's all dumped into the black hole of Pentagons wonderwaffe projects, all that cash simply stolen by MIC corporations, exactly what Dwight Eisenhower was warning America about during his last Presidential speech.

So? And I can sneak up on a guy in full armor and put a knife through the opening his neck? So what?
A guy can hide underground and get caught once his buddy steps out and uses his cellphone, an hour later a bomb hits the ground and squashes him as the earth over him kills him.

This is a different time and a different war. USA wont occupy, they will crush and dismantle power and conflict mass casualties- who is to say we would ever meet face to face? They can press a button and kill hundreds without touching the ground. They have toppled govenments both on and off camera for years doing this. And USA is not in the business of occupying, they dont do the nam "kill the ones who shoot at us until they stop, until then we wait" thing anymore - only reason we have troops holding ground in Iraq and Afghanistan is because of possibly financial gain,but more likely as stated to take out specific people for war crimes/revenge who held political power (Saddam and Osama) - without their regimes they had to occupy and plant a puppet government. Those are the "wars" on tv, but you would have to have a lot of faith in the news to believe that we havent had american soldiers involved in secret battles across the globe - the ones we dont invade in and wave our representative flags for (which is why i state the usa is more battle-hardened than most people know).

Plus, the Soviet Union fell. Its not hard to look up how Europe played some roles in the background to accelerate that process. So, in a nutshell, war doesnt have to be fought me vs you on a battlefield all the time.

As if I wasn't embarrassed enough by my leaders. We are going to resort to the "my dick is bigger than yours"?

For # sake, learn some tact.

originally posted by: ammocase

originally posted by: renden

originally posted by: ammocase
I dont support military war in any way, but the US military are Giants when compared to any other country. Some posters are mixing up failures in occupying with failures in actual combat and engagement. Not only does the US have top technology when it comes to military weaponary, but they are the leader when it comes to training exercises around the world, they also engage in practice sessions with other countries due to their broad associations (like anti-terrorism training with the Israelis).

They are also allies and training partners with other nations who also are leaders in military technology, and also have a past of military invasion/imperialism (which believe it or not, counts when it comes to adding up experience to look back on).

And what are other people dont put into account - they have a large and high-tech spy network. If you think Afghanistan and Iraq was just oil and revenge, then you are wrong - the US i am sure infilitrated their gold-mine of terrorists networks that were hidden and in some cases ran those countries ( a country full of immigrants like the USA has its advantages, one being that we can hire a "die for the usa" american-born that is full-blooded muslim/arab, etc. to infiltrate and take over terrorist networks) - there is no coincidence that all these muslim countries are all of a sudden "REVOLTING" out of thin air, it started with the invasion of afghanistan and iraq, which were terrorists hot-spot centers that the USA now broke in and put under their wing.

I dont see Russia at that level at all.

Here's the real level.

Guys with AKs are getting blasted by Cobras, easy hunting, right?

Just fly right on there, press a button and presto, guys with AKs are turned in to dog scraps.

Nope, a determined guy out there fighting a war for his land, even with a same old AK is still a warrior to be feared.

Here's one shooting back at a Cobra that's trying to strafe him, shoots the pilot dead.

www.youtube.com...

So what tech is thas? When in the 21st century, a guy with an AK can still flat out kill a Cobra pilot. Where is all that wonder super tech? Yeap, it's all dumped into the black hole of Pentagons wonderwaffe projects, all that cash simply stolen by MIC corporations, exactly what Dwight Eisenhower was warning America about during his last Presidential speech.

So? And I can sneak up on a guy in full armor and put a knife through the opening his neck? So what?
A guy can hide underground and get caught once his buddy steps out and uses his cellphone, an hour later a bomb hits the ground and squashes him as the earth over him kills him.

This is a different time and a different war. USA wont occupy, they will crush and dismantle power and conflict mass casualties- who is to say we would ever meet face to face? They can press a button and kill hundreds without touching the ground. They have toppled govenments both on and off camera for years doing this. And USA is not in the business of occupying, they dont do the nam "kill the ones who shoot at us until they stop, until then we wait" thing anymore - only reason we have troops holding ground in Iraq and Afghanistan is because of possibly financial gain,but more likely as stated to take out specific people for war crimes/revenge who held political power (Saddam and Osama) - without their regimes they had to occupy and plant a puppet government. Those are the "wars" on tv, but you would have to have a lot of faith in the news to believe that we havent had american soldiers involved in secret battles across the globe - the ones we dont invade in and wave our representative flags for (which is why i state the usa is more battle-hardened than most people know).

Plus, the Soviet Union fell. Its not hard to look up how Europe played some roles in the background to accelerate that process. So, in a nutshell, war doesnt have to be fought me vs you on a battlefield all the time.

Let's not forget U.S. Super-power status of the 21st Century in terms of Economic warfare capabilities.

a reply to: 200Plus

I think you lack the faith in the U.S. defensive capabilities. The U.S. has been working on deterring Russia/china nukes for a very very long time. You just have to call their bluff, ask them would they rather live in a nuclear waste land of a world or would you want to grow into the universe and leave our petty squabbles about resources and religion/race behind, as we move forward with exploiting space. Endless resources for the taking.

Lets shake off the weakness of religion and racist in fighting. Let the weak die to make way for our future. We are stuck in an endless cycle(Insanity). Humans(Us) have been fighting and building and destroying empires throughout history, but we finally have a chance to break away from that cycle and move towards more.

Space is the answer, regardless of what you think. Everything we have done throughout our planets life will have been in vain if we don't figure away to escape our sun.

originally posted by: crazyewok

originally posted by: rickynews
There is no question that the U.S. is the world's Only Military Super-Power.

You may be the most powerful military on paper.

Good luck trying to invade and occupy Russia or China.

You couldn't even pacify Vietnam, what chance would you have in a full out war with China or Russia?

No those two wouldn't even be able to even land troops in the USA but do you really think the USA could have a chance in hell of marching on Moscow or Beijing? Not a chance.

The US does not have to. China would have its global trade destroyed by the USN. The US could so that at sea and watch China collapse upon itself with up rising in Tibet and Xinjang who would find a sudden surge of weapons arriving.. Russia would be in the same boat. Once its much smaller airforce was dealt with, it would have to disperse troop formations to keep them from being destroyed from the air. They would also lose all command and control abilities. The US could even choose to pull an Afganistan and support the millions in Caucasus who want to throw off Russian rule. With air support they could not only take control of Russias vital oil supply they could also cause havoc across the country.

Regimes would fall and new ones would arrive and they would be asking the US to send in help. The US would not need to fight its way to Russia or Beijing they would be invited.

Russia's big problem is they no longer have the numbers advantage and massive corruption. The big problems the Russians had in Georgia with lack of readiness, lack of communication, lack of navigation, beat up or not working equipment etc. Russia tried miltary reforms but, they have mostly failed to corruption at evey level of the armed foces, new equipment never finds its way to the troops as it is sold off by unit commanders who pocket the money etc.

Russia is still trying to change from a World War 2 style military to a modern one. Internal corruption has ruined attempts to do so.

originally posted by: Skorpy
a reply to: 200Plus

The U.S. has been working on deterring Russia/china nukes for a very very long time. You just have to call their bluff, ask them would they rather live in a nuclear waste land of a world or would you want to grow into the universe and leave our petty squabbles about resources and religion/race behind, as we move forward with exploiting space. Endless resources for the taking.

And Russia/China could say the same. It's called M.A.D. Mutually Assured Destruction. If an all out nuclear war broke out no one would be spared. The difference is America appears to be the only nation craziest enough to do it, followed closely by North Korea....

originally posted by: Rosinitiate

originally posted by: Skorpy
a reply to: 200Plus

The U.S. has been working on deterring Russia/china nukes for a very very long time. You just have to call their bluff, ask them would they rather live in a nuclear waste land of a world or would you want to grow into the universe and leave our petty squabbles about resources and religion/race behind, as we move forward with exploiting space. Endless resources for the taking.

And Russia/China could say the same. It's called M.A.D. Mutually Assured Destruction. If an all out nuclear war broke out no one would be spared. The difference is America appears to be the only nation craziest enough to do it, followed closely by North Korea....

America's use of an atomic weapon against Japan ended the 2nd World War. Countless lives (well into the millions no doubt) were spared, and we haven't had a World War since. This is the Historical fact. I'm not advocating use of nuclear weapons, but at the same time, incinuations or suggestions that the U.S. Is anything like North Korea is flat out ridiculous.

[snipped]

While it's obvious the US military and NATO is vastly superior I don't understand why he would say that nor do I understand the dick swinging in this thread either

Who cares

originally posted by: MrSpad


The US does not have to. China would have its global trade destroyed by the USN. The US could so that at sea and watch China collapse upon itself with up rising in Tibet and Xinjang who would find a sudden surge of weapons arriving.. Russia would be in the same boat. Once its much smaller airforce was dealt with, it would have to disperse troop formations to keep them from being destroyed from the air. They would also lose all command and control abilities. The US could even choose to pull an Afganistan and support the millions in Caucasus who want to throw off Russian rule. With air support they could not only take control of Russias vital oil supply they could also cause havoc across the country.

Regimes would fall and new ones would arrive and they would be asking the US to send in help. The US would not need to fight its way to Russia or Beijing they would be invited.

Russia's big problem is they no longer have the numbers advantage and massive corruption. The big problems the Russians had in Georgia with lack of readiness, lack of communication, lack of navigation, beat up or not working equipment etc. Russia tried miltary reforms but, they have mostly failed to corruption at evey level of the armed foces, new equipment never finds its way to the troops as it is sold off by unit commanders who pocket the money etc.

Russia is still trying to change from a World War 2 style military to a modern one. Internal corruption has ruined attempts to do so.

Wishful thinking.

Thinking that could get alot of people killed.

And your forgetting its Nuclear stockpiles.

If Russia was to be beaten into collapsing I would put money on the fact they will take down as many Americans as it could with them.

Obama is just stating the obvious. The US defense budget is more than every other nation combined. Militarily they are probably a good 20 years ahead of the rest of the planet and that I think is being conservative. Think about it, they only showed the world the F117 in Bosnia in the mid 90s. That plane had been developed in the early 70s. What do they have now that they aren't showing? With that said, a war with Russia would be suicide for all, I can't imagine such a conflict not turning nuclear at some point if one of the sides is desperately beaten conventionally.

I think people need to understand, that in 2014, its not US Americans vs Russia 'Russians' anymore. And the game has changed, its not a game of invasion anymore. In many cases, invasions might not work, most empires have collapsed (or imo- has changed to a whole different tactic of "control").

Its a game of political, economic and corporate control. Plant a seed, and send the resources (which is the reason for many wars in the first place, no one wants to invade a country to convert that country to "american"- they would bomb the whole nation and wipe them out if they could, its to get to the bread and butter they are after). With better transportation, and internet networking - they can seize these resources without a full force occupation.

Every nation is trying to spread their influence for this very reason, either through political 'smiles and handshakes' or to the last resort of force - that they will follow-up with them pretending to smile and handshake as they plant puppets or control the higher-ups.

Thats our modern way of invasion.

A war with Russia will NOT be this way - they will either fight on the contested territory (lets pretend its Ukraine), or somewhere else on land or sea - or it will be done remotely, as i dont see the benefit of a land-invasion- unless they intend to bring in Putin, or completely wipe out Russia (which i dont think its possible to do so quickly, even if they intend to just take out main cities). I see this more as inflicting casualties, both sides showcasing their numbers and victories on their respective controlled news outlets - both declaring its not a "war but a conflict" (always possible imo)- and at one point one side will be economically weakened (which would be the sole victory condition if a war happened, not "lets invade!")- and i dont believe russia has the spy networks, influence, or experience to infiltrate and use other methods besides shoot and kill when compared to the USA who imo has been doing that for years.

But, i still dont see this route. I see it as two corporations, USA mix corporate power vs Russia- Putins corporate power- its all about "how much money can we gain or lose... or do we really want to lose out on us and putin money?" Its not USA big, usa strong, usa best anymore- even the idea of the cold war democracy vs communism was about money in nature, as a country falling into communism means a business partner that USA can exploit falls out of their influence.

a reply to: MrSpad

I wish I could give you a half star but I couldn't so I gave you a full one. I agree that the US is better established than Russia and if it is just Russian forces that needed to be overtaken it would probably not last long. The trouble I see is that a lot of Europe and Asia still need Russian energy and such. How are the west going to do with boots on the ground in Russia, securing oil and water or whatever? Occupations have never worked and that is especially true in Russia. Have you fought a Russian before? They are OK with the pain, but not OK without pride. Americans have a soft stomach for pain and clearly have no pride. They will not be able to secure Russia from within and control it's government. I won't bring up Vietnam or Afghanistan because I don't think that winning in the conventional sense was ever the goal. Just taking Russians on their own merits, I think the US would have a hard time controlling the population. They can take out the Russian forces but Russia still has a candy store that is in demand. How will the west control resources inside Russian boarders?

a reply to: Vovin

I think Obama should show some class and just STFU, I believe the USA has the superior army if we would just fight a real war and drop all this PC crap by coddling the enemy and loosing good men over it, fight to win and take the spoils of war to finance it like it has been done through out history, and bitch slap any one who dont like it. Fight a real war or stay home. Just my opinion here
Thanks Ed

originally posted by: rickynews

originally posted by: Rosinitiate

originally posted by: Skorpy
a reply to: 200Plus

The U.S. has been working on deterring Russia/china nukes for a very very long time. You just have to call their bluff, ask them would they rather live in a nuclear waste land of a world or would you want to grow into the universe and leave our petty squabbles about resources and religion/race behind, as we move forward with exploiting space. Endless resources for the taking.

And Russia/China could say the same. It's called M.A.D. Mutually Assured Destruction. If an all out nuclear war broke out no one would be spared. The difference is America appears to be the only nation craziest enough to do it, followed closely by North Korea....

America's use of an atomic weapon against Japan ended the 2nd World War. Countless lives (well into the millions no doubt) were spared, and we haven't had a World War since. This is the Historical fact. I'm not advocating use of nuclear weapons, but at the same time, incinuations or suggestions that the U.S. Is anything like North Korea is flat out ridiculous.

Right, right the benevolent USA nuked two cities to save millions. I know, victors don't write history and as always truth prevails.....

To all the non russian/americans... If said hypothetical war were to happen, who would you be supporting/wanting to win? I have friends on both sides, but part of me would like to see america get slapped back to reality... But of course I would rather no war at all. Besides it would no doubt turn into a world war anyway so my country or origin will get involved.

Just thought the question could rouse a lively debate haha...

For the record I love the american people I know, but I do have a problem with american gov... As I do my own...

originally posted by: beezzer

originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter

originally posted by: benrl

“Appear weak when you are strong, and strong when you are weak.”
― Sun Tzu, The Art of War


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Yeah, clearly Im impressed with the Presidents diplomatic prowess, perhaps someone should send him a copy.

If an Republican was in charge we would be in World War by now.

If a republican were in charge, Putin may have never attempted the takeover.

Take over of what? A nation where the people voted to join Russia? Besides had Romney won we would be busy starting a war with Iran.

200Plus:

Hearts and minds are not something you win they are something you aim at.

What an utterly imbecilic and juvenile statement to make! It describes succinctly why America has never won a war on its own. Hearts and minds are what take you to war, winning hearts and minds tells you when you have won the war. Here though is the importance of winning hearts and minds. Not only do you have to win the hearts and minds of your enemy's civilians, you also need to have the continued trust and confidence of the hearts and minds of your own people. War is more than shooting guns and dropping bombs, it isn't just about subjugation. America has never gone up against an opponent with similar weaponry.

In Iraq and Afghanistan, American helicopters strafed the ground with almost impunity killing friend, foe and neutrals alike, without discrimination, but with full on prejudice. Russia would have attack helicopters returning equal fire in equal measure. WW2 was a (moral) war that fought against an evil seeking to dominate the world; Nazi Germany in Europe, and Japan in the Pacific. Since WW2 no war has been fought solely to resist evil with the same moral intention, but more for American hegemonic ambitions, helped along by 'poodle' Western governments. America has always avoided war with Russia for good reasons, and if America was to get into a war with Russia today, the 417,000 American lives lost in WW2 would be quickly reached and surpassed in one battle alone, because Russia is more than capable of sinking American fleets.

If I was Putin and under attack by America, I would make damn sure that the people in America experienced the war at first hand by attacking the cities. The American people would no longer be able to witness war simply on the TV safe and secure many thousands of miles away. This is what the American people need to experience up close and personal, just like the Vietnamese, just like the Koreans, just like the Iraqis. Only then will the current American population come to understand the pain of the death and destruction their military has brought to other sovereign countries simply to fulfil the hegemonic ambitions of its government's policies.

If Obama was truly confident of America's military might he would put his money where his mouth is and walk into Moscow...the world is waiting, and it has been waiting since the end of WW2. Fact is, America doesn't fancy taking on Russia, but will talk as if it does, just to maintain the delusion for the American people that they are invincible, which of course, they are not!

Putin would only need to hit the electricity generating hubs and America would fall into chaos. This is exactly what would happen if it went nuclear. A few nuke air bursts above the American land mass and you're back in the stone age. Is that what you really want, just so you can have bragging rights about who has the biggest and the best?

originally posted by: rickynews

originally posted by: Rosinitiate

originally posted by: Skorpy
a reply to: 200Plus

The U.S. has been working on deterring Russia/china nukes for a very very long time. You just have to call their bluff, ask them would they rather live in a nuclear waste land of a world or would you want to grow into the universe and leave our petty squabbles about resources and religion/race behind, as we move forward with exploiting space. Endless resources for the taking.

And Russia/China could say the same. It's called M.A.D. Mutually Assured Destruction. If an all out nuclear war broke out no one would be spared. The difference is America appears to be the only nation craziest enough to do it, followed closely by North Korea....

America's use of an atomic weapon against Japan ended the 2nd World War. Countless lives (well into the millions no doubt) were spared, and we haven't had a World War since. This is the Historical fact. I'm not advocating use of nuclear weapons, but at the same time, incinuations or suggestions that the U.S. Is anything like North Korea is flat out ridiculous.

You are wrong if we really wanted to end the war all we had to do was accept the offer of peace that Japan had been offering the whole summer before we dropped the bombs. In fact the command staff was against using them and after they were dropped spoke out against the president for using them.

In some ways America is becoming like North Korea. NK starves many of it's poor look at how many people that is starving in America in NK a small select group controls the nation it is the same way in America. It is disgusting the way America has declined since the 70's. And both the Republicans and Democrats are responsible for this because the same people own both parties.

a reply to: elysiumfire

His post was not imbecilic. I know some of you don't want to acknowledge what war really is but he's got it right, you're wrong. What he's saying is once you've gone to war you need to commit. He's right, that's reality.

originally posted by: GreenMtnBoys
The United States hasn't fought a real enemy in decades. Beating up on 3rd world militaries and goat herders with AKs' and IED's is nothing. Russia actually has one of the most sophisticated miiltaries in the world. Of course it's not at the level or on the same scale as the US as they spend probably 1/6 of what we do per year on their military. Can we say MiGs, S400s, P-800 anti ship missiles? Obama and Biden are a disgrace and so are any Americans that are supporting this current administration. If send troops to Ukraine and engage Russia it will be a bloody war that America has no stomach for. The Russians are tough people and will be fighting to protect their homeland, economy, etc. What will the US troops be fighting for? Another government overthrow?

I like this guy! Here's a star.