Multiple shootings at Jewish Community Center in Overland Park, Kansas

reply to post by BuzzyWigs


Yup the Grandview Triangle is an interchange between 71, 435 and 470.

Originally I kind of thought this would be related to those shootings, but the more stuff I come across leads me to believe it's not. Just my opinion though.

PS- I use to go down to the Mo/Ark border to go on float trips, and you are right, there are a lot of those ideologies present down there.

reply to post by OatDelphi


Back when the wife and I lived over in Wichita I had to spend my Weekend Warrior (Marine Reserve) training over in Belton MO. that's just south of KC and a little East of Overland.

That whole south of---region is pretty heavily vested will all kinds of religious community service org's.
there's a number of homeless shelters, Vet housing and training, Heck I remember joking with one guy, that there more churches in that part of the world than there are fast food places.

The odd part of this, is in this part of KC at least. people there are a lot more tolerant than in other parts of the country.

reply to post by OatDelphi


Things like this are reasons why I am member of this: Jews For the Preservation of Firearms Ownership

Nyiah
An assisted living facility? Attacking the freaking elderly? REALLY? What the hell is wrong with people? I don't condone attacking anyone to begin with, but attacking kids and elders is a pretty universal "you're a cowardly sack of s***" line.

edit on 4/13/2014 by Nyiah because: (no reason given)

Yes, this is quite true. Evil people prefer to attack helpless people--the more helpless, the better. There is a reason why a sick F--K like Adam Lanza targeted an elementary school instead of the local police station. Same as this guy--he was such a coward and an evil person, he targeted the most helpless.

AreUKiddingMe

NthOther

Swills
reply to post by NthOther

 

This is clearly a hate crime, not a stupidy crime. You can fix stupid, but its hard to fix mentally ill.

Whats so sad is the rise of these mass killings. I wonder if the MSM is part to blame?

I don't buy the mentally ill argument anymore. We're all mentally ill, depending on who you ask.

Sad, yes. Surprising, no. And no one is to blame but ourselves. You and me.

Where did this p.o.s. get a firearm and ammunition to drive around with and shoot people up like a video game? Now THAT's disturbing.

He was a convicted felon and on several watch lists. The sad fact is that evil people will circumvent the law and find ways to hurt people.

reply to post by HardCorps


Yup the KC Metro area is multi-cultural region that is filled with great people who are in most parts very tolerant. We are like the center of a big wheel with our spokes pointing out in all directions of the nation and world.

vkey08
reply to post by Daedalus

 

No it wasn't said here, I questioned something to my superiors directly at one point and got severely reprimanded for "attempting to stir a hornet's nest"

that was close to ten years ago now, and I've been languishing in Civil Rights ever since....not that I mind, I love the people that come in for assistance, but man do I miss field work.. a LOT.....

not going to go into more than that.. sorry.

that just means you were close to something....too close...

the truth is out there, vkey.....after everything you've seen, why can't you believe?

reply to post by HardCorps

The odd part of this, is in this part of KC at least. people there are a lot more tolerant than in other parts of the country

You can't find friendlier, more honest and hardworking people anywhere. As friendly, sure, but not friendlier.
We do have thugs and nutters (this one in particular being a transient), but in general - it's pretty laid back.

Thanks for acknowledging that. This area gets a bad rap. (Nevermind the nutcases in Topeka commonly known as WBC. Ugh.)

Goteborg
I have some questions for people who live close to that area and are familiar with the local coverage, I've tried finding answers but have had no luck.

How does a man fire into a room full of Jews and fail to kill any Jews, but does kill two Methodists? Is this a case where the community center was hosting something for the entire community so most in the center at the time weren't Jewish?

It's a Jewish Community Center. There is a synagogue on site, but the Jewish Sabbath is Saturday. Most of the people were there for tryouts for some sort of talent contest. He didn't fire into a room, he was firing in the back parking lot of the center.

How did the cops find the suspect so fast? I haven't been able to find anything about how exactly they found him, did they get a tip?

How did the media get video of the suspect being placed in the back of the police cruiser? The cops were looking for a white Toyota, there has to be quite a few of those in the area and there had to be a lot of cops out searching. Was there a media presence with every single cruiser out looking for the suspect or did they just get there really quick? Or was there a re-enactment?

I don't want to sound conspiratorial and the story makes sense but in my experience the police just aren't this good.

An hour and 45 minutes from the first report to an arrest isn't all that fast, especially when the suspect is on foot, and at least two eyewitnesses could describe him. When something like this happens, the media are like a swarm of bees - they are everywhere. Someone was bound to get some footage, then they shared it out. The white Toyota in question was parked in the parking lot - that's probably how they figured out he was on foot, and had to be relatively nearby. A 73 year old man on foot probably couldn't cover much more than 2 or 3 miles in an hour and 3/4, especially with all that shooting he had to do. It narrowed the search grid considerably.

They've also got eyes in the sky. Four or five nights ago I was awakened at 2300 by the police helicopter flying orbits of my apartment, shining a search light in my window. Turned out there was a guy on the corner with a shotgun, and they were spotting him from the chopper. The light in my window was just incidental. That same chopper, or one very like it, has been flying orbits and patrolling the highway near one of the places I work, since it's evidently been involved in the highway shootings. That's just under 8 miles or so from the Community Center, which is just a minute or two by air. It probably didn't take long to divert it from patrol of the highway for the manhunt. I know it was on station at the highway at 0930 Sunday morning, because it flew an orbit around me as I was walking across an old shopping center parking field on my way to work, which was just a couple hundred yards off the highway.

Yeah, they're that good, and when crap goes down, they're on it.

nenothtu
The white Toyota in question was parked in the parking lot - that's probably how they figured out he was on foot, and had to be relatively nearby.

This is the problem I'm having. The reports I've read have reported that the vehicle was found in the parking lot of an elementary school and judging from the map I looked at the school wasn't close enough for the people at the crime scenes to see...so how did they know about the car? They had to have seen the car, which means the shooter wasn't on foot and also makes one wonder why he ended up parking in the lot of a school so close to the crime scene.

Was the vehicle not found in the school parking lot?

reply to post by Goteborg


As happens early on in any sensationalized story, there are conflicting reports. What I've been able to piece together that seems fairly likely is that he initiated the assault at around 1 PM at the Community Center, and a report was called in to 911 at 1:03 PM. Two people were shot there, both in the same car, a grandfather and his grandson. There are conflicting reports as to which died immediately and which died at the hospital.

At some point, he also shot at two other people, but missed them.

Some few minutes later, he shot a 53 year old woman in the parking lot of the retirement home, and was then apprehended at the elementary school.

The retirement home is 0.75 miles south of the community center, and the school is .37 miles (about 650 yards/ 600 m) west of the retirement home.

The most likely scenario at this point is that he made the shots at the community center, and when the police arrived, they got the description of the shooter and the car. The car was found in the parking lot of the retirement home according to Phyllis Cantor:

Phyllis Cantor, who is undergoing rehabilitation at Village Shalom, said she heard the sound of sirens. She said many police officers are at the scene and their focus appeared to be on a white car in the parking lot.

Source

Therefore, he probably drove the 3/4 miles to the retirement home, shot the woman there, and then fled from there on foot to the school, where he was apprehended. I regularly walk about twice that distance to work, and do it in around 12 minutes (sometimes 8 or 9 if I feel froggy), so he should have been able to make that distance in 8 minutes or under.

They likely found the car at the retirement home, and then apprehended him on descriptions by witnesses as he fled on foot. There are varying reports of the time of arrest, from 1:28 PM to 2:45 PM.

I hope that helps you make sense of the timeline.

Well, it's looks like Frazier Glenn Cross probably wasn't the Grandview Triangle shooter.

http://www.kansascity.com/news/

reply to post by nenothtu


OK, thanks. For some reason the reports I've been reading are saying the car was found in an elementary school parking lot north of the crime scenes and that didn't make any sense to me. Catching him on site makes the timeline make a lot more sense.