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Why Is the ATS Community Pro-Nationalist?

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posted on Apr, 12 2014 @ 11:01 PM
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reply to post by brazenalderpadrescorpio
 


I do not think that anyone

WHO HAS studied the topic and issues very significantly

really puts ANY trust in ANY INSTALLED traitors-in-chief in the White House or any other part of the FEDeral bureaucracy.

All of us studying globalism for any serious length of time at all realize that it's all been in the works for a very long time.

Certainly the Biblical predictions for the global government to arise in the same era in which Israel became a nation again is being walked out incrementally--and has been--lo these 6 decades since.

Many experts say the rot goes back at least 400 years. Others say all the way to Rome.

Certainly the king of hell has been scheming toward such for thousands of years.

Anyway--here's plenty of quotes of the globalists in their own words if you seriously doubt their existence.

.

twoday.net...

Ignorance of the facts is no longer remotely justifiable, imho.

Willfully blind Eloi shuffling off into the caverns of the Morlachs to be the main course for dinner is not my idea of good reality testing.
.




posted on Apr, 12 2014 @ 11:02 PM
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brazenalderpadrescorpio
reply to post by bobs_uruncle
 


So are you saying that the government answers to private corps? If that's true, then the gov't is just as guilty. They are aiding and abetting.


Private corporations, economists and of course international bankers control governments. This world is predatory, it's all about exploitation and extortion. You have to remember that recent developments have shown the perceived "power" of money, specifically fiat currency and what happens when a bank is cut-off from the common fiat currency pool. Russia is a good example using the recent Obama edict. In addition, when natural resources are redirected, because they have inherent real value it's even easier to start wars. Look at how Japan was pulled into the second world war and that is how Russia will be pulled into the third. Right now there is a looming problem with NatGas, Europe will be exploited and Russia will do the extorting and in doing this, Europe will have to pick sides, lest they lose their NatGas shipments. I expect the UN will also turn on the US in a way that will be surprising.

Look at inflation as well, it is a hidden tax on the economy just like structured excise taxes similar to those found on gasoline that benefit only the government, so they allow inflation and increases in resource costs, it doesn't hurt them at all, it helps them because every time resource prices go up, so do the amount of the taxes, yet no additional benefit is seen when you pay at the pump or heat your home. In Canada, the UN through ECLEI (an Agenda 21 NGO) and then through the AMO (another NGO) extort and exploit municipalities, buying off local governments with usurped tax credits that actually come out of the gasoline excise taxes. One town I lived in had a budget of 5.47 million dollars but only had a municipal tax base of 1.49 million dollars, the rest came from grants from the provincial and federal government which we all pay for one way or another. So the government is using our own tax dollars to extort and exploit us, this applies to the US as well although the terms and organizations may change.

NAFTA, the TAP and the TPP are also bitches of treaties, they legitimize sending all of a country's or colony's real wealth building business offshore. You know, those jobs that keep everyone busy, paying their bills, working at a pension plan and paying taxes. Once these treaties strip countries of their middle class earner positions, it becomes very difficult for a government to generate tax revenue, so they have two choices, increase taxes or run a deficit. Deficits are the general choice but that plays into the hands of the international bankers and gives them decision making control over governments by using the threat of calling loans or forcing currency value changes or raping natural resources, there's your extortion and exploitation again ;-)

Now let's look at fiat currency, that's a fun one and we'll use Canada as an example because like the US it has a central bank. Canada is hugely resource rich which drives the real value of our currency through the roof. Right now the CDN dollar should be between $1.60 and $2.10 US but we are running below par, why is that? Well, it is the government allowing corporations to profit by keeping the CDN dollar artificially depressed. And how do they do that in a way that makes sense to the international community of banksters and financial fraudsters? It's easy, print/issue more money, because printing/issuing more fiat money devalues a currency and drives inflation. It's win-win for the government and international business! The big question is, who is getting the excess printed/issued money, because it sure as hell isn't in circulation.

What needs to be done with governments and people in general is the limiting of wealth and power. There is more than enough to go around and be used equitably by everyone. I am not saying that communism or socialism is the answer because it isn't, but at present, predatory capitalism without the threat of accountability is definitely not the answer. It puts treasonous scumbags into government that provide NO representation for the people through an election system that the government pretends is real, when we all know it's all pure fraud. Governments at present are simply rabid in their spending and their infringements, consequently they either need to be reigned in or put down.

Cheers - Dave
edit on 4/12.2014 by bobs_uruncle because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 12 2014 @ 11:13 PM
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reply to post by BO XIAN
 


So that said, do you consider yourself a patriot? I would imagine that you would say, "Yeah. Of God's Kingdom."



posted on Apr, 12 2014 @ 11:27 PM
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reply to post by bobs_uruncle
 


Thanks. That's a lot to absorb. I skimmed it, but I'll read it later when I have more time.



posted on Apr, 12 2014 @ 11:54 PM
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reply to post by brazenalderpadrescorpio
 


Certainly I try to put God and His will and Kingdom first above all else.

However, I consider myself a very patriotic American who served in the Navy in behalf of the Constitution and our founding documents and values.

Not the globalists among our founding fathers and THEIR values . . . but the Judeo/Christian values evident in the founding documents.

And . . . yes, I CAN identify with a kind of ideal of generic patriotism in terms of what's best for the populace of a nation. When I lived in China, I felt a definite kind of "patriotism" in behalf of China--at least in terms of the national populace, the culture . . . not necessarily the ruling elite in Beijing.

And, in Taipei, I felt the same sort of thing toward and regarding the Taiwanese and their geography and culture.

Nevertheless, I was still a strong supporter of all the best about the USA. I was not a supporter of the evils perpetrated in the name of the USA.

I know that there are souls who are fiercely in behalf of the USA regardless of the evil deeds they are called on to do--connected thereto. I'm not that sort of person.



posted on Apr, 13 2014 @ 12:55 AM
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brazenalderpadrescorpio
I'm singling out ATS, but it seems that people who believe in conspiracy theories in general tend to have a patriotic fervor that I can't understand. I can't understand it because of the tendency that conspiracy theorists tend to have of distrusting the government. 

My idea is that this tends to be the case here in the US, more so. My theory is that it has to do with the political climate of the US. For example, it seems that conspiracy theorists tend to be libertarian. Libertarians tend to be conservative, and conservatives, tend to be patriotic.

However, this seems to not make sense for different reasons. Let's just say that for argument's sake that the Illuminati did worm their way into Freemasonry early on. Undoubtedly, at least a few of the Founding Father's were Masons. So many of the ideals that your country was founded upon were ideals that run contrary to what you have faith in.

So, as a conspiracy theorist that hates the idea of a New World Order (or Illuminati elite), why do you feel patriotic? And I realize that I may run across an idea that I do not like.


Hello there Brazenalder*,

All of your viewpoints have the telltale signs of successfully having a propagandized perception of our cultural and political environment, just to name a couple..

For one, there is no such thing as "people who believe in conspiracy theories" This is what those who wield the power of the press call those who suspect politicians (who wield power over the people who own the press), of committing crimes and improprieties. It is a matter of convenience and finances to manipulate public perception into seeing the world just like you are now seeing it.

For example:

I suspect several politicians of crimes based on several facts already publicly well known to be true. This automatically makes me a "conspiracy theorist" when I publicly state the crimes they have done. See how nicely this works? Now the media, (if they are told to support this politician), will make me out to be "just a conspiracy theorist"
rather than someone presenting evidence against Joe Schmoe politician.

Now no one will believe it and might just laugh about what I said, in the media news rooms.

A conspiracy theorist, as you think of them, are really people who have stepped past the average person, and have unplugged themselves from the constant propaganda of the press, and the lies of our leaders. They have created a perfect environment for themselves to support their unabashed corruption with the help of the press/media, and have made it so the average person thinks their nation's leaders are all on the up and up and are not committing felonies almost daily. Some of them actually are, or have.

People against government corruption are called "Anti-Government" when they they call out those politicians that have criminal intent and have abused their positions for financial gain, or for the gain of others.
I remember 2 years ago in the media, they used the term "anti government" 27 times in a 1 hour period on ABC news.

This conditions people to link those with a story about someone to be labeled something (pick one of yours).
See how excellent this dispels suspicion from them onto a bunch of crazy anti-government conspiracy theorists?

The reason people step away from this mold that our powers that be want to cast us in, is because we have decided to start rebelling against the corruption.

Distrusting the government was what one of our responsibilities were as an Americans, and still are. That is, before it was carefully crafted out of the picture by corrupt people. It has been a responsibility of all Americans since the signing of that dreaded document the constitution and bill of rights. Many people have eluded this effort to vacate the attitudes of distrust in government, and they just call people who are not trusting them anti-government, or some other deflecting label.

These documents are also a very big threat to these wealthy and powerful and very devious and corrupt people we have currently running things (into the ground).

The patriotic fervor you refer to is simply the attitudes of good citizens who have said "no more" It should be considered a good thing to have people that care about the integrity of the country, and not some terrorist action like some of our leaders call them, wouldn't you agree?

It is a very sordid affair of constant lies, kick backs, organized crime on a scale much larger than the Al Capone days, felonious congress and senate deals made to get rich off of taxpayers, plus election fraud, bribery, trillion dollar cook the books and then lose the books deals. (you know, really messed up stuff). (Worse than Somalia even)

"Just name the crime, and one of our officials should be doing the time" Hey that's a catchy little phrase there


I hope you can see these things for what they are, and stop drinking the koolaid being handed to you. It is better to suspect, investigate, and be wrong, than to not suspect and give everyone a free pass like they badly want.

So being this way doesn't hurt anyone except the garbage that we find ourselves being oppressed by, who only want to take away freedoms.
When they are in fact gone, the ak47's and the AR15's used against EVERYONE will not give a hoot what label or what political party people belong to. It will be long past that.

Just ask those survivors of Chairman Mao from the cultural revolution in China about it.

And stop being a victim of this guy:

He is the one who oversees the propaganda being fed to the masses and the media corporations for orderly dispersal.
edit on 13-4-2014 by alienreality because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 13 2014 @ 01:09 AM
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seeker1963

brazenalderpadrescorpio
reply to post by seeker1963
 


Which nationality do you believe is trying to change the laws of this country, and how are they trying to change them?



By your question, and my responses to your thread I am guessing you are a US citizen???

To answer your question, have you been paying attention to how our immigration laws are not being enforced by the current administration?

Sorry to be off topic!!! But I was just answering your question!


what? we have deported over 2 million people which is a record number of deportations. How exactly are they not enforcing it?



posted on Apr, 13 2014 @ 01:41 AM
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brazenalderpadrescorpio
reply to post by Goteborg
 


I probably should've responded sequentially. But like I said in my last post, isn't it more complex than that? Isn't the theory that these various governments are just fake organizations that are really being led by the NWO elite that is not the NWO, yet?



Yep, that's the theory but I don't see anything complicated about it. I also don't believe it. There are obviously people who want to see a global government and their various groups are out there trying to make it happen and the only way to make it happen is by law. Right now national governments are the highest authorities who could make that happen so of course the focus is on them hence the appearance that the conspiracy theorists are nationalists, because they are.



posted on Apr, 13 2014 @ 01:54 AM
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brazenalderpadrescorpio
reply to post by seeker1963
 


I won't answer your last question since that is not the point of this thread.

But if a country were founded upon occultist ideas that you don't agree with, wouldn't that irk you? I personally don't have any problem with occult ideas, necessarily. It would be the motive of those occult ideas that would bother me.



You do know the word 'occult' simply means 'hidden' right? Juust checking.

In the case of the USA, otherwise occluded 'ideas' were only hidden in light of the British threat and when independence was declared those views were put into the DOI and so, no longer 'hidden' at all.


Rosha



posted on Apr, 13 2014 @ 06:31 AM
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reply to post by brazenalderpadrescorpio
 


I actually think you have it the other way around, libertarians tend to be conspiracy theorists... If that makes sense.

The victim effect.

PS I say this with a lot of respect, I am a huge Ron Paul and Ventura fan as an outsider, but some of the time, some people join the libertarian movement as people who just tend to blame everyone else, always someone elses fault.
edit on 13-4-2014 by kykweer because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 13 2014 @ 06:36 AM
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Never feel patriotic...but I am not a american.



posted on Apr, 13 2014 @ 07:40 AM
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reply to post by brazenalderpadrescorpio
 


I think its more an anti globalist stance than a pro-nationalist. There is nothing wrong with wanting to see your country, laws, and sovereignty preserved, as well as the people who created it. Who does flooding the country with foreigners who have no loyalty to their host country serve? I think people are waking up to the fact that this whole bill of goods we have been sold over the past few decades, that globalism creates jobs, multiculturalism is good, we are a global village, etc, are just ploys to serve a globalist agenda. Although there are some aspects of multiculturalism that are positive, they arent positive if they are designed to supplant your culture with a non unified soup of different groups hostile to each other. Also, many of us have served in the military or lost family serving in the military to the United states. We all swore an oath to preserve this country.
edit on 13-4-2014 by openminded2011 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 13 2014 @ 10:21 AM
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reply to post by brazenalderpadrescorpio
 


I'm a liberal and hold no nationalistic tendencies. Borders are imaginary and tribalistic.

Conspiracy theories however are a staple of right-wing politics. So naturally you're going to see more nationalistic right-wingers here.

From the John Birchers of the 60s to today's paranoid right-wing media that has a new conspiracy theory every day of the week you're guaranteed to see more conservatives here with nationalistic ideas than you are liberals with none.

I'm here because I've seen UFOs and I do not believe that conspiracy exists from a right or left political agenda.
edit on 13-4-2014 by Frith because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 13 2014 @ 10:31 AM
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Anyone willing to stand by and let the Internationalist tear down and destroy the foundation of their own country is a traitor and has no business talking about other people being Nationalists. I am American and i want a country that I can be proud of, not one in which we are forced to make excuses to explain our abhorrent behavior. With each despicable act our leaders undertake, the more Nationalist and Protectionist I become. If you want the peoples support then you need to act in the interest of the people. The fact that it has been allowed to go on for so long is a huge indictment on the American people.



posted on Apr, 13 2014 @ 10:34 AM
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reply to post by brazenalderpadrescorpio
 


I totally get your point any real informed conspiracy theorist that has done his homework and knows the real truth would not be a nationalist, patriotism based on false pretense is laughable, one who closely examines or spends any honest amount of research concerning the conspiracies about the "New Atlantis" and secret doctrines which the true foundations and purposes of the nation are , there is an irony of sorts involved and one has to wonder.

The colonists as we have been told wanted to get from under the thumb of the monarchy, taxes and oppression, but many prisoners were sent here also well guess what, those prisoners and colonists at least as far as I know were not trying to be more British, they changed their entire identity, lost the accents everything, but here we have the oppressed and ones that cry fowl trying to be more American and part of what they seem to complain, but again if they understand the foundation they think their individual freedom is derived is a farce it would be a no brainer , to sever your ties the exact opposite of nationalism is anarchism or globalism which that my friends is one world government.

The sheeple once again are confused and those pesky Babylonian religion followers have succeeded in their efforts.



posted on Apr, 13 2014 @ 10:54 AM
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reply to post by Frith
 


Hmmmmmm . . . Sooooooooooo what is it that leaves you disbelieving the globalists in their own words?


twoday.net...

. . . folks like JFK [who tried hard to throw a wrench into their plans--resulting in his death], Kissinger, the Rockefellers, Jacques Cousteau, Robert McNamara, Ted Turner, The Clintons, Bertrand Russell, FDR, Woodrow Wilson, Winston Churchill . . .


e.g.





5. JFK ...high office of Pres has been used ... to destroy to destroy America's freedoms ... I must inform the citizen of this plight. 10 days before Dallas death.
.

6. Congressman Larry McDonald . . . one world government combining super capitalism and communism under one tent...long planned . . . killed Korean airlings 747 shot down by Soviets .
.

7. Brock Adams Dir UN Health Org ... it is necessary to remove from the minds of men their individualism, loyalty to family traditions, national patriotism, and religious dogmas
.

8. Arthur Schlesinger "We are not going to achieve a New World Order without paying for it in blood as well as in words and money."
.

9. James Callaway 1917 Congrressman ... [elite] took control of media by buying 25 leading newspapers... my summary
.

10. Woodrow Wilson President ...a power so ...interlocked, so complete, so pervasive, ...dare not speak of it above their breath...
.

11. Christian Science Monitor "...the existence of a secret conspiracy, throughout the world, for the destruction of organized government and the letting loose of evil."
.

12. Winston Churchill This conspiracy played a definite recognizable role in the tragedy of the French revolution. It has been the mainspring of every subversive movement during the 19th century. ...
.

13. FDR's son in law--FDR did not originate his stuff ... powerful one world revolutionaries ...hungry for profit and power...now acquired full control...
.

14. FDR: ...that a financial element in the larger centers has owned the Government ever since the days of Andrew Jackson...
.

15. Senator William Jenner 1954 We have operating within our government and political system, another body representing another form of government - a bureaucratic elite
.

16. Barry Goldwater Senator "...As managers and creators of the system ,they will rule the future."
.

17. Professor Carroll Quigley ...made possible a centralization of world economic control and use of this power for the direct benefit of financiers and the indirect injury of all other economic groups... Bill Clinton's mentor
.

18. Harpers 1958: ...What they strive for would inevitably lead to dictatorship and loss of freedoms by the people. The CFR was founded for "the purpose of promoting disarmament and submergence of U.S. sovereignty and national independence into an all-powerful one-world government.
.

19. H.G. WELLS Countless people ... will hate the new world order ... and will die protesting against it....
.

20. Richard Salant, former President of CBS News "Our job is to give people not what they want, but what we decide they ought to have."
.

21. Rockefeller: proud his family involved in a conspiracy toward NWO
.

22. Benjamin Disraeli Bristish Prime Minister July 14, 1856 speech in the House of Commons ...secret societies in control toward an end of current ownership and ecclesiastical entities...



129."It's terrible to have to say this. World population must be stabilized and to do that we must eliminate 350,000 people per day" Jacques-Yves Cousteau, oceanographer and humanist, The UNESCO Courier, Nov. 1991, page 13

.

130."The commitment of government to deal with the population issue is of course essential...There are many ways to make the death rate Increase." Robert McNamara, Secretary of Defense, New Solidarity, March 30, 1981

.

131.The First and Second World Wars were wars designed to kill millions were not successful enough hence the new methods outlined in the Global 2000 Report...The world is populated with too many redundant people who must not be allowed to procreate and consume scarce natural resources...The Committee of 300 (Illuminati) commissioned Cyrus Vance to write a paper on this subject of how to bring about such genocide. The paper was produced under the title 'Global 2000 Report' and was accepted and approved for action by former President James Earl Carter, and Edwin Muskie, then Secretary of States, for and on behalf of the US Government." Dr. John Coleman, former intelligence agent of British MI6, from his report, Global 2000: A Blueprint For Global Genocide, written in 1992 concerning the depopulation agenda of the Club of Rome

.

132."Military men are dumb, stupid animals to be used as pawns for foreign policy." Henry Kissinger, quoted by Bob Woodward in The Final Days, 1976

.

133."The illegal we do immediately. The unconstitutional takes a little longer." Henry Kissinger

.

134."The Brady Bill's only effect will be to desensitize the public to regulation of weapons in preparation for their ultimate confiscation." Charles Krauthammer, Washington Post, April 5, 1996

.

135."The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subject race to possess arms. History shows that all conquerors who have allowed their subjects to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by so doing."Adolph Hitler, Chancellor of Germany 1933-1945

.

136."God bless the America we are trying to create." Hillary Clinton, former first lady

.

137. "Our government has kept us in a perpetual state of fear - kept us in a continuous stampede of patriotic fervor - with the cry of grave national emergency. Always there has been some terrible evil at home or some monstrous foreign power that was going to gobble us up if we did not blindly rally behind it..." General Douglas MacArthur, 1957



edit on 13/4/2014 by BO XIAN because: plural typo



posted on Apr, 13 2014 @ 11:08 AM
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reply to post by BO XIAN
 


WOW you are a student of the conspiracy school sir, I applaud your reply , the globalists created the chessboard so any piece on the board cannot move on it's own, but the only way the game is possible is that you must have black and white and two opposing forces that want to win.



posted on Apr, 13 2014 @ 11:10 AM
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reply to post by BO XIAN
 


This thread is about why conspiracy theorists are more often than not nationalists. Not about an actual conspiracy theory like the Illuminati or NWO.

If we're going to derail the subject at hand I'll issue my response to NWO conspiracy theories: they're not true. Why? Because a global government could not wage war with itself for the benefit of the individual wealthy. Borders are IMO necessary for war and our continued subjugation to our governments. Anybody who clings to their imaginary borders is clinging onto a system that forever subjugates them to the whims of the rich and powerful. Its all imaginary division that lets people fear and hate others and only the elite benefit from that.
edit on 13-4-2014 by Frith because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 13 2014 @ 11:11 AM
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My biggest problem with many nationalists, is that the most passionate among them have the tendency to let their sense of pride and love for themselves manifest into fear and hatred for others.

I'm a Spanish America, my loyalties are with America, but I identify as Spanish and have a strong love for my heritage and culture. I think it's a beautiful thing, and I'll be damned if anyone tells me I can't hold on to it. What happened to live and let live? I don't force it on to anyone, it's just something I value personally.

It's a lot like the issue of ethnic pride. I don't care if you feel Celtic pride, Black pride, or Brown pride. Self empowerment and keeping your culture alive is cool with me, feel good about yourself all you want, but it rarely ends with a sense of love for self, and that's where the problems come in.



posted on Apr, 13 2014 @ 11:42 AM
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The United States was founded on good principles with the best of intentions. True Masons played a key role in setting up the Constitution, Bill of Rights and most of the original architecture of the government. They also knew that times would change so they allowed amenability.
What they did not allow for was a time when a large percentage of the population expected and received hand outs. Even laws and legislation for legitimate causes get corrupted for personal gain by corporations, private citizens and foreign interest.
Most agencies and government programs started out for good reason, what they have been corrupted into is the real issue.
Voting is a joke now, it did not seem to change anything. When a politician takes office they all get sucked into party politics, lobbyist and other groups agendas(no matter what they intended to do).
The current president has proved me wrong countless times by pushing his own agenda right on through no matter what the long or short term consequences happen to be. In the past politicians usually feared the backlash of the public if food stamps or other hand out programs were in harms way. Funny how the hand out programs got the most attention.

Though our government has become a Hydra, cut off one head and two replace it. Most Americans just feed the monster and hope it does not attack them at this point, not wanting the situation to get any worse.
Law enforcement is a needed thing, but it is clearly out of control. We have so many different agencies, they have no clue what the other is doing…How can the public possibly know? Most all Politicians have a shelf life with terms in office and usually very little clearance to know what the some agencies are actually doing. If the Illuminati still exist…It is a government agency funded with tax dollars.
Even though I do not like the current state of affairs, the good ole USA is my home, I still have reasons to be proud. Knowing the founding fathers gave the people the right to change things means there is still hope.



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