NATO satellite photos show Russian military buildup near Ukraine

Phage
reply to post by TritonTaranis

 

The spy satellite of today are incredibly powerful as I'm sure you're well aware, they can zoom in to a bottle top on the ground,

No.
There are very real physical (as in physics) limitations to the resolution an orbital camera can provide and it doesn't approach anything like that.

cnx.org...

edit on 4/11/2014 by Phage because: (no reason given)

Really because I can see my shoes out in my back garden on goggle earth

I can also see that the cars in the car park are very real and not inflatables

reply to post by TritonTaranis

Really because I can see my shoes out in my back garden on goggle earth

I can't. But in any case, those would be aerial images. Not satellite images.

Phage
reply to post by TritonTaranis

 

Really because I can see my shoes out in my back garden on goggle earth

I can't. But in any case, those would be aerial images. Not satellite images.

edit on 4/11/2014 by Phage because: (no reason given)

Debatable considering they use both methods

Google doesn't use the best resolution sats, however

Since the early 1960s, super powerful spy satellites have been the stuff of the military and intelligence communities. Now two U.S. companies have launched commercial imaging satellites that offer the same sort of space-based images of the Earth to the public. One of these companies recently launched the highest-resolution commercial imaging satellite in the world.


From its vantage point of 425 miles in space, the 4,300-pound GeoEye-1 satellite orbits the Earth and focuses its powerful lens on the surface below, snapping electronic images that can resolve objects on the ground as small as 41 cm across (16 inches). That's approximately the size of home plate on a baseball diamond. These images are typically processed and sold to the military for mapping and to companies like Google, which makes them available to the public through its platform Google Earth. (Because of federal regulations, the publicly-available images are slightly lower resolution -- approximately 50 cm).

www.sciencedaily.com...

Since there has been quite a number of improved military grade launches

reply to post by TritonTaranis

Debatable considering they use both methods

Not debatable, as your quote shows.


16 inches is not a bottle cap and it isn't going to let you read the headlines on a newspaper either.

The figures on a license plate are about three inches (7.62cm) tall so in order to read those figures you would need a resolution of about 2 cm (3/4 inch) if you were going to be able to see anything but a featureless block for each figure.

The lowest practical orbit is at around 200km. Any lower than that and things tend to fall down pretty soon after being launched. Using the Rayleigh Criterion formula we find that in order to get 2cm resolution from 200km you would need to have a telescope mirror with a diameter of about 6 meters. To have a reasonable field of view you would need a focal length of something like 20 meters. We are talking about a very, very large satellite just to house the telescope (ignoring the camera itself and all the electronics). This is a 6 meter telescope:


Hubble has a 2.4 meter mirror and orbits at an altitude of 560km. It is clearly visible when it passes over my house. A satellite orbiting at 200km housing a 6 meter telescope would be...noticeable.

Phage
reply to post by TritonTaranis

 

Debatable considering they use both methods

Not debatable, as your quote shows.


16 inches is not a bottle cap and it isn't going to let you read the headlines on a newspaper either.

The figures on a license plate are about three inches (7.62cm) tall so in order to read those figures you would need a resolution of about 2 cm (3/4 inch) if you were going to be able to see anything but a featureless block for each figure.

The lowest practical orbit is at around 200km. Any lower than that and things tend to fall down pretty soon after being launched. Using the Rayleigh Criterion formula we find that in order to get 2cm resolution from 200km you would need to have a telescope mirror with a diameter of about 6 meters. To have a reasonable field of view you would need a focal length of something like 20 meters. We are talking about a very, very large satellite just to house the telescope (ignoring the camera itself and all the electronics). This is a 6 meter telescope:


Hubble has a 2.4 meter mirror and orbits at an altitude of 560km. It is clearly visible when it passes over my house. A satellite orbiting at 200km housing a 6 meter telescope would be...noticeable.

edit on 4/11/2014 by Phage because: (no reason given)

Ok but that's still enough to identify a decoy

Not forgetting military grade satellites pack a whole range of other censors and remain largely classified

My cousin who is a high ranking signals corps told me about the bottle cap, I can't prove with available information what was disclosed to me, but I have no reason to doubt him...

reply to post by TritonTaranis

TritonTaranis
Deceived in the past, by whom?

The only dilemma here is facts and paranoia

By officials of NATO member-states of course,

e.g. by Scharping and Bill Clinton regarding bombing raids of Operation Allied Force vs the former Federal Republik of Yugoslavia, by Donald Rumsfeld regarding Operation Enduring Freedom vs Afghanistan, and Colin Powell under Bush2 regarding The Case against Iraq, by John Kerry regarding Syria, and least by Turkey's Erdogan, also regarding Syria.

Again, it might well be that Putin is also deceiving us right now... but look who is pointing fingers at him.

A little paranoia is appropriate in a world full of deceit, don't you think?

reply to post by Phage


To be fair to TT's, I have seen the house numbers on main doors via Google Earth.

As to why the Sats could not differentiate objects as trash or debris is a big question mark. I am sure military Sats were also used in the search, given so many lives were at stake and lots of funds, resources and media attention is on this topic.

TritonTaranis

pookle

TritonTaranis

tommyjo

NATO DEFENDS ACCURACY OF SATELLITE IMAGES WITH ADDITIONAL PROOF
11 Apr 2014


Mons, BELGIUM - Supreme Headquarters Allied Powers Europe (SHAPE) defends the accuracy of the images (found below) that were released to media on Thursday, 10 April 2014. The dates of the images released by SHAPE were collected by the DigitalGlobe satellite 'Constellation' between late March and early April 2014. The images are unclassified and are commercially available in DigitalGlobe's public archive. SHAPE did not alter or edit the images in any way prior to release.

Russian officials are quoted in various media sources claiming that these images were from August 2013, and that they depict an exercise conducted at that time.

SHAPE is releasing additional images alongside those that were released earlier, in order to clearly show that the claims of Russian officials are categorically false. These images, also taken from the DigitalGlobe satellite and commercially available, show the same areas of interest prior to any military build-up. The photographs, some dating from 2013, and others from early 2014, show that these areas were unoccupied prior to March 2014. There is no evidence of any military activity in these areas in 2013 or early 2014.

When reviewed alongside images released by SHAPE earlier today, it is clear that the military build-up of forces occurred in early March 2014.

SHAPE stands firm in its assessment that Russian forces in the vicinity of the border with Ukraine number in the range of 35,000 to 40,000 troops and are equipped with infantry fighting vehicles, tanks, combat aircraft, logistics, and artillery. These forces are destabilizing to the region, which is why the North Atlantic Council has repeatedly called upon Russia to de-escalate the situation by withdrawing troops from the border with Ukraine.

Additional images have been published on the website.

www.aco.nato.int...

Well there you have it Russia yet again caught lying through its teeth, what a surprise

Let's see the sympathises disprove the claim

Tbh it's good to see NATO responding and making an arse of the comical kremlins propaganda

edit on 11-4-2014 by TritonTaranis because: (no reason given)

Plenty of hypocracy can be sent back the other way too.

Remember those Iraqis tanks lined up outside Kuwait? What bout those WMD's in Iraq?

What about Kosovo et al?

Remember those sanctions and costs Obama spouted? Then he fires back about Russia being evil when using the Gas debt by Ukraine to start pre payment?

The hypocracy in this whole thing is astounding.

edit on 11-4-2014 by pookle because: (no reason given)

Stay on topic please we're talking about NATO and Ukraine not the US and IRAQ where photos was never supplied, two totally different militaries/organisations not to be confused as the same

edit on 11-4-2014 by TritonTaranis because: (no reason given)

...I think you pretty much lost the debate with this post right here, dude.
PS...

reply to post by TritonTaranis

TritonTaranis
Ukraine has requested help from the international community, this is absolutely not a secret there are many international advisers in Ukraine working with the Ukrainian security forces to regain and bring about order, and stabilise the situation Russia is creating inside Ukraine

How can they be instigators lol

The Ukrainian Government has requested help?
The Government in Kiev is not even legitimized by the people yet, as for stabilizing the situation: that is a situation that must be rectified ASAP - for the sake of the Ukrainian people.

Regarding instigators:
I'd suggest you research some of the crucial elements that actively destabilized the situation in Ukraine in the first place, since (at least) the “Orange Revolution” in 2003-2004.
Specifically, the paramilitary arm of Prawyj Sektor, the UNA-UNSO, who are part and part of NATO's GLADIO (according to the US own intelligence btw). A covert operation, created by NATO, working in Ukraine since far before Maidan.

ColCurious
reply to post by TritonTaranis

 

TritonTaranis
Ukraine has requested help from the international community, this is absolutely not a secret there are many international advisers in Ukraine working with the Ukrainian security forces to regain and bring about order, and stabilise the situation Russia is creating inside Ukraine

How can they be instigators lol

The Ukrainian Government has requested help?
The Government in Kiev is not even legitimized by the people yet, as for stabilizing the situation: that is a situation that must be rectified ASAP - for the sake of the Ukrainian people.

There is an interim Ukrainian government as care taker stand in in Kiev, until elections are held and the people vote in there new one... Hope this helps

This does NOT mean they don't have the right to Stabilise the country

I'm sure there is a mountain of different news sources you can look at to see Ukraine appealed to the international community at the UN, and to the EU & the US

Russia has violated international law with an illegal invasion of Ukraine, a sovereign and independent state. And its planned annexation is an attempt to redraw international borders in Europe, upending the principle of respect for international agreements guaranteeing Ukraine's territorial integrity and the United Nations Charter. We are calling for America's help at this critical moment in our history. We need the diplomatic support of the United States to restrain the Kremlin from further aggression against Ukraine, and to persuade it to relinquish its illegal land grab. We also are asking for technical and financial assistance to stabilize the fragile situation in our country in the wake of a popular change of government.

reply to post by victor7

To be fair to TT's, I have seen the house numbers on main doors via Google Earth.

From a satellite image? No. Street View does not use satellite images.


I'm not doubting that the images we are seeing are valid. I am trying to clear up misconceptions about the capabilities of spy satellites. They certainly can provide better resolution that is available to the public, however they cannot see a bottle cap, they cannot read license plates.

Davian
This guy's a shill for the power elite. I suggest we all ignore the hell out of him and boycott this idiotic propaganda effort.
Go look through his posting history if you don't believe me.

This is the problem

You're assuming that Ukrainians are brainwashed by the elites, and using it to discredit Ukraine's cries for help, you also somehow think the Russian mafia is a better option, is there really a any wonder as to how and why you're getting it all wrong?

Let's please keep this OT and less of the accusations please

TritonTaranis

ressiv
?????? wat about the NATO rocketshield pointed to Russia through the years in every neighbore land at the russian borders.....
we just ignore it ?????

What you expect NATO not to have a shield when Russia has the largest stock pile of nukes on the planet?

Come on,

Let's also not forget Russia is the aggressor in Ukraine, Georgia, etc etc

PLEASE... Let's get back on topic guys

So accusing Russia of being the aggressor to Georgia is "on topic"? The same Georgia that was carrying out ethnic cleansing against ethnic Russians via artillery bombardment?

By the way, I wonder how many people know that Saakashvili was advising Svobida leadership?

reply to post by TritonTaranis

TritonTaranis
There is an interim Ukrainian government as care taker stand in in Kiev, until elections are held and the people vote in there new one... Hope this helps

This does NOT mean they don't have the right to Stabilise the country

Alright, who exactly has the right to stabilise the country, and on what legal basis?
The Ukraininan constitution?

TritonTaranis
I'm sure there is a mountain of different news sources you can look at to see Ukraine appealed to the international community at the UN, and to the EU & the US [...]

So the (as of now un-legitimized) Government in Kiev has appealed to the EU/US - because Russia violated Ukraine's territorial integrity... and the EU/US are clearly the best addressee, since they never violated international law or the territorial integrity of sovereign and independent state before?

You have to decide... either the Ukrainian constitution applies, or not. Same as international law.

This is the Second PSA in 2 pages.


You are free to attack theories, explanations, posts, etc. but not fellow members.


As well, let's try not to stray too far Off the specific Topic.


NATO satellite photos show Russian military buildup near Ukraine

TritonTaranis
Stop trolling the thread Vovin

Save the accusations for another thread, Anything regarding NATOs proof of Russia build up?

That's what I'm interested in seeing: proof of this buildup.

Truth is there is no real proof. If there was it would have came out already. Pictures of units at Russian military installations don't prove anything. Russia did not just suddenly start placing its military in its own bases just because of Ukraine.

And again I have to stress: there is a critical difference between an invasion force and a contingency force. The photos that I see show military units in existing bases. The units have the capability of moving into some of the Ukraine. But invasion? Invasion means total war. Russia has been a key player in total war many times. They know that logistical equipment would dwarf the actual weapon force. Where's all these logistic routes? Where's the ammo, gas, camp trucks? Where's the transport aircraft?

In fact, Russia is portraying a defensive posture. They even set up S-300 units right near the border of Ukraine to deter any hostile air strikes (and there have been combat craft flying over east Ukraine). From what I've seen, Russia's force near east Ukraine is a strike force in place to deter incursion by the Kiev junta. Even the east Ukrainians have accepted that Russian will not openly move in to back them, so they have been forming their own defense forces (which include many defectors from the junta security forces).

Russia has no reason to militarily invade Ukraine when it has already achieved an overwhelming cultural advantage.

reply to post by Vovin

Russia did not just suddenly start placing its military in its own bases just because of Ukraine.

You know this how?

Empty site near Belgorod before current military buildup - 7 March 2014

Mechanized Infantry Brigade/Motorized Rifle Regiment after military buildup near Belogorod - 26 March 2014

Empty site near Yeysk before military buildup - 14 January 2014

After Russian Military buildup at Yeysk - 22 March 2014

www.aco.nato.int...