Humans and saber-toothed tiger met in Germany 300,000 years ago!

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posted on Apr, 5 2014 @ 05:44 PM
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I came across this article and when I read that ancient men defended themselves against sabretooth tigers with spears. I immediately wanted to see the spears which were not shown in the first article, so I researched further. I envisioned large razor sharp knapped flint spearheads, what I found surprised me.




Scientists of the Lower Saxony Heritage Authority and of the University of Tübingen excavating at the Schöningen open-cast coal mine in north-central Germany have discovered the remains of a saber-toothed cat preserved in a layer some 300,000 years old -- the same stratum in which wooden spears were found, indicating that early humans also inhabited the area, which at that time was the bank of a shallow lake.





The discovery sheds new light on the relationship between early humans and beasts of prey. It is highly likely that humans were confronted by saber-toothed cats at the Schöningen lakeside. In that case, all the human could do was grab his up to 2.3m long spear and defend himself. In this context, the Schöningen spears must be regarded as weapons for defense as well as hunting -- a vital tool for human survival in Europe 300,000 years ago.


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Now for the spears information:




The year is 1994, the place- a lignite opencast mine in northern Germany , a town called Schöningen. Here, the Bodendenkmalpflege, Hannover, Office for the Preservation of Historical Monuments conducted archaeological investigations of the mine. As of 2000, the oldest Pleistocene strata at this site are of the Elster Glaciation (Thieme). While working in the Quaternary layers, they discovered 400,000 year old, wooden hunting tools!

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It is a worldwide sensation! Since the discovery of the Schöningen Spears the history of mankind is being rewritten. Based on the findings from the worldwide unique archaeological complex around the 300,000 year old spears, we have a better understanding today of how our predecessors of Homo heidelbergensis lived. They open a window into the Palaeolithic Age and answer the significant question: "Where do we come from?" The Schöningen Spears are among the ten most important palaeolithic findings of humankind. The paläon reflects the surroundings in its outer skin.



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Being an amateur bowyer I found the tapering of this spear quite interesting, I have always wondered where the idea to make bows originated from.


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posted on Apr, 5 2014 @ 05:48 PM
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I would not want to be up against a wall trying to defend myself against the quintessential predator with a glorified, over-sized toothpick.




posted on Apr, 5 2014 @ 05:57 PM
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reply to post by cosmikDebris
 


I think I might want at least a couple of such spears.

And a couple for each of my closer 8-12 companions.

And maybe a good strong net.

And maybe 2-3 strong bolo's.

I guess there wouldn't be any South American poison dart frogs around . . . but there might be a substitute.



posted on Apr, 5 2014 @ 06:08 PM
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I thought I had read a few years back that sabertoothed tigers did not really exist. That it was all some kind of mixup, and what they thought was a huge tooth was not from the tigers. Did I dream that up?


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posted on Apr, 5 2014 @ 06:10 PM
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Going at a large cat with a spear...


Just stop and think,

every generation of your ancestor,

The level of bad ass it took.

To place you here, on ATS in front of a computer...


Im going to go cook a steak over a roaring fire or do something rugged to make me feel better.



posted on Apr, 5 2014 @ 06:23 PM
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But wait, the Bible says the earth is at most less than ten thousand years old! Someone is lying.


benrl
Im going to go cook a steak over a roaring fire or do something rugged to make me feel better.


Lol.

No, first you must face and slay the raging bull with a spear, and carve it with a stone rock, to prove you are worthy to eat it. Raw.



posted on Apr, 5 2014 @ 06:28 PM
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TrueAmerican
But wait, the Bible says the earth is at most less than ten thousand years old! Someone is lying.


benrl
Im going to go cook a steak over a roaring fire or do something rugged to make me feel better.


Lol.

No, first you must face and slay the raging bull with a spear, and carve it with a stone rock, to prove you are worthy to eat it. Raw.


*looks down at his SW500 and forged knife set*

Well... only if you will allow that a hand gun is simply a modern projector of pointy kinetic force equivalent and akin to a modern wooden spear...

I mean it could be argued the important tool in the encounter is the mind of the hunter... so yea um...

That means a Gun is the modern spear, and forged tools modern stone knife...


I mean, where the hell am I supposed to get a spear in the first place? Id probably need a permit or something...
edit on 5-4-2014 by benrl because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 5 2014 @ 06:28 PM
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Mein Gott! Vot big teeth zey haf! Or maybe it's a tusk...? Anyvay, I vunder vot vud heppen if I try to touch it...

ETA /poor attempt at German accent for the sake of comedy=off

Mein Gott, wat eine grote tanden haben zie....

Is probably more Dutch than German. Comes with the territory I guess. Anyway, interesting article, I love it when time flies backwards.
edit on 5/4/14 by LightSpeedDriver because: ETA



posted on Apr, 5 2014 @ 06:42 PM
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benrl
Going at a large cat with a spear...


Just stop and think,

every generation of your ancestor,

The level of bad ass it took.

To place you here, on ATS in front of a computer...

Im going to go cook a steak over a roaring fire or do something rugged to make me feel better.


With that in mind. I look at the sleeping cat in my lap, and wonder what he is dreaming.

I don't need no steenkin' spear. With a mere finger pressed on the button of my electric can opener, I can turn him into a quivering mass of begging beast.

Des



posted on Apr, 5 2014 @ 06:46 PM
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So... 400 000 and 300 000 years old wooden spears, or tools, remain "woody" in Germany?

No petrification? No rotting? No nothing but good ole wood?

Cavemen must have known the best lubricant ever then?... Or what?...



posted on Apr, 5 2014 @ 07:12 PM
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There is an ancient site near where I live. It was made into a bunch of campgrounds as a way to protect it (no digging at all allowed). I saw some spears they pulled from there - only 10,000 years old though. They were skinnier than I would have guessed. Hard to imagine it would do much harm without perfect aim, close contact (of course), and a super slow death by the animal. I'm going to guess they went everywhere in teams.

As hard as life was for them I bet it was fulfilling - out in the brisk air with grave challenges on a daily basis - appreciating every bite of their food - valuing each other due to the uncertainties. What would think of us today.



posted on Apr, 5 2014 @ 07:14 PM
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reply to post by benrl
 


Lately, some of the archery hunters that regressed from compound to recurve to longbow to self bow have went further to hunt with spears thrown with an atlatyl. There are states that have changed their game laws to allow it.
So there are people out there ready to sell you a spear.
There was once a great white hunter that threw an assegai (African spear) into an adult Cape Buffalo... But he had a backup on hand with a rifle ... To whom he subsequently owed his life.
edit on b000000302014-04-05T19:17:30-05:0007America/ChicagoSat, 05 Apr 2014 19:17:30 -0500700000014 by butcherguy because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 5 2014 @ 07:18 PM
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benrl
Going at a large cat with a spear...


Just stop and think,

every generation of your ancestor,

The level of bad ass it took.

To place you here, on ATS in front of a computer...


Im going to go cook a steak over a roaring fire or do something rugged to make me feel better.


I am grilling ribs this beautiful saturday, gathered by the wife on her grocery store trip. lol

The extent which man has come is something i dwell upon daily, to go from there to here. Something unnatural happened along the way to mankind, perhaps supernatural.

Just cant fathom how we lived for tens of thousands of years, then all of the sudden within a hundred or so we have all this tech,



posted on Apr, 5 2014 @ 07:23 PM
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reply to post by butcherguy
 


I made an atlatl and used it for salmon spearing, amazing how much energy they have. Good Fun!



posted on Apr, 5 2014 @ 07:26 PM
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TKDRL
I thought I had read a few years back that sabertoothed tigers did not really exist. That it was all some kind of mixup, and what they thought was a huge tooth was not from the tigers. Did I dream that up?



I found this which may be related to the article you read:


They are called saber toothed cats, not tigers. They're much more closely related to a modern bobcat than they are to tigers, and belong to the Felis genus, along with domestic cats and most of the little wild cats, as opposed to Panthera, which is the family that tigers, lions, and panthers are in.



posted on Apr, 5 2014 @ 07:31 PM
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I don't know how I missed hearing about this one, great stuff.

Our ancestors knew how to kick some butt, I don't see myself challenging any big cats with a sharp stick anytime soon. It does make you wonder what our jobs would be in the tribe if adopted. Definitely doing some manly stuff for the rest of the weekend. Need to go barehand some fish and build a fire.

400,000 thousand years ago is a long time ago, our civilization is probably on it second go around since then.



posted on Apr, 5 2014 @ 07:48 PM
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HanzHenry


I am grilling ribs this beautiful saturday, gathered by the wife on her grocery store trip. lol

The extent which man has come is something i dwell upon daily, to go from there to here. Something unnatural happened along the way to mankind, perhaps supernatural.

Just cant fathom how we lived for tens of thousands of years, then all of the sudden within a hundred or so we have all this tech,


Man is so disconnected from nature, I don't know if its anything supernatural, perhaps it was simply the disconnect from philosophy that the modern era brought.

Speaking nothing of religion, philosophy often marched hand in hand with science.

Its why medicine is the way it is, they where inseparable among the greeks, arguably the founders of modern thought.

Yet around the Renaissance and following years there is this animosity that arises between Religion and Science that seems to have marched man away from Philosophy and Science as well.

Seeming to remove the moral and ethical quandaries from even being a question for pure "thought".

What ever the "Cost" it certainly lent efficiency to the advancement process, taking some of the Morality of science, removes blocks we place in front of it.

Of course, we try to balance, no ones being Joseph Mengala now, and it brings so much benefits.

I just ponder if we neglect the cost of it all sometimes.



posted on Apr, 5 2014 @ 08:17 PM
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I know they think the human life span then was shorter but I wonder if an ancestor of this magnitude was able to pop into our world if they would choose to stay. I think the conveniences would be too much to pass up but that is my way of thinking. I know when I'm in nature it is the most rewarding feeling - it's grounding and something more I can't describe (relaxing maybe/freeing). If they did stay - they would be wise to limit the way of life they adopt to not lose that.



posted on Apr, 5 2014 @ 08:41 PM
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reply to post by AlaskanDad
 


I am going to save face and say, yep that must be it lol. Although in my defense, I am not really a big dino buff. I think fossils are really cool though, I got a few of those. Megalodon tooth is the coolest



posted on Apr, 5 2014 @ 08:46 PM
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reply to post by benrl
 


You nailed it there! We have disconnected ourselves so much from our ancestors it's ridiculous. I believe that science is what a lot of people fail to realize, it's all around us and in everything we do and not just a belief.

I was teaching my kids some survival things yesterday and had to explain about the science thing, they never thought of it as being like that.





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