A Second Sphinx?

Originally posted by Marduk
er no
if youre claiming that channeled information is valid then youre more of a loony than cayce was
he clearly only did it for the money

Could be, but just perhaps for once he may have been right you never know until you actually look. It is probable that he was doing it for a paycheck. Quite possible. I have never said that Cayce was accurate in the least. Even an idiot can get something right every once and a while.

and BTW you don't have to get rude. we are all looking for the truth here.

Prince Tutmose had the dream recorded after the fact

Well yea, if he recorded his dream before hand it would have been a prediction, and it would have been quite difficult to put up the stela when the sphinx was buried in sand.

whenever you hear someone claim Cayce was credible you immediately know two things
1) they don't know much about Cayce's predictions and other claims
2) they don't know much about Egypt

And when I get flamed like that I immediately know I am on the right track with something. If it makes someone uncomfortable it may be getting close to the truth. Or like the other saying goes. If it burns you know its working.

I am not going to claim that I know everything about either subject. That would be pompous arrogant and a total lie from me. But some things I do know a little about.

Things like it does appear that the sphinx depicted in the dream stela are resting on top of some sort of building. and I do believe that typically there were two sphinx built. And the layout of the sphinx in location to the pyramid would suggest that a second sphinx should have existed.

If there is the possibility of something there, we have the duty to explore that possibility until that possibility is exhausted. Thats just human nature.

Cayce was a convicted criminal
most of his channeled evidence was nothing more than rehashed data from the works of Madame Blavatsky who's complete work was published after her death by the theosophical society. This was at the same time that Cayce was working in a bookshop
some of his other claims like the claim that Stonehenge was built by a tribe of dan fresh from the exodus in 1500bce have since been proved completely erroneous
this was a widely held belief at the time he was making predictions though
Madame Blavatsky also invented the idea of Akashic halls of records an idea which Cayce expanded on claiming there was one in Egypt and another in the Yukutan
he claimed to know this because he used to be a priest in Atlantis called RA TA

so if youre going to believe that there is a hall of records under the sphinx you also have to believe everything else he said was true
and thats not possible
there is no Egyptian source that says anything about the Hall of records and the area has been thouroughly checked by several groups looking for the hall of records including Cayces son who admitted that it was baloney when he couldn't find it

so
carry on please telling me that you don't know everything about it and coming up with theories based on a lack of evidence

Then why did Plato say the same things as Edgar Cayce and even talk about the spaceship parked under the pryamids?

Plato was an ancient pharo and found the atlantis crystal right where cayce said it would be in Bermuda.

Originally posted by Marduk
so if youre going to believe that there is a hall of records under the sphinx you also have to believe everything else he said was true

This isn't an all or nothing thing. I happen to agree that there is a hall of records underneath the sphinx based on the depiction on the dream stela. Not cause of a quack mentalist. And also to get back on topic a bit there may be two underground buildings and note I keep saying may it is entirely possible that I am completely incorrect about all of this but without a thorough investigation into the matter the subject is quite mute.

so
carry on please telling me that you don't know everything about it and coming up with theories based on a lack of evidence

Thank you I will Im glad I now have your permission.

Dr. Hawass: To date, there are only three known passages connected with the Sphinx. Two of these might have actually been made by treasure hunters long after the Sphinx was sculpted. In 1837 Howard Vyse created a crater just behind the head of the Sphinx, and Mark Lehner and myself explored this again in 1979. We also located a passage at the tail, under the restoration masonry. It is about 9 meters (27 feet) long and comes to a dead end. A vertical shaft descends down through the Sphinx body from the top of the waist. This is actually a widening of a large natural fissure that cuts through the entire site of the Sphinx. Before modern restorations, it opened more than two meters wide across the top of the back. Then there is the sealed recess on the north side of the Sphinx body which we've already discussed, and we expect to open this soon, but I don't expect to find anything in there.

Source

More than likely they will not find anything. But there is a chance that they may find an entrance to the hall of records. (actually I think calling it the hall of records is whats getting to you Marduk, Ill call it "a room" simple and unassuming) So they may find a room underneath the sphinx. It is true that just a little ways away from the sphinx the land falls away and an ancient harbor can be found. It is possible that the entrance to this room could be located near that harbor.

Originally posted by mythatsabigprobe
Then why did Plato say the same things as Edgar Cayce and even talk about the spaceship parked under the pryamids?

Plato was an ancient pharo and found the atlantis crystal right where cayce said it would be in Bermuda.

LMAO! omg... now THAT is funny! please post ONE shred of evidence where this is stated besides somewhere like "Atlantis Rising" or "the enterprise mission"

Pure lunacy. Well done!

Originally posted by whatukno
it is entirely possible that I am completely incorrect about all of this but without a thorough investigation into the matter the subject is quite mute.

there has been a thorough investigation
there have been several thorough investigations

touregypt.net (this is whats known as a credible source) has three pages on the subject
guess you didn't know that ?
www.touregypt.net...
www.touregypt.net...
www.touregypt.net...
now you do...................

Thank you for the links, they were quite helpful, They went a long way to explain that yes indeed there were quite unusual anomalies found underneath the sphinx and the great pyramid. In fact a subsequent drilling into one of these anomalies near the front of the Sphinx discovered a large cavity in the bedrock that was explained as a natural opening. There was a smaller crack that was found in another drilling nearby.

Also through this investigation they had determined that there are a number of unexplored rooms within the great pyramid that have not been opened because of lack of funding.

The team suggested that a small bore hole could be drilled down through the bedrock and a bore-scope camera inserted to determine whether the subterranean spaces could in fact be manmade chambers. The EAO even gave their permission for this investigation, but unfortunately, no funds were available for this work, and to our knowledge, the anomalies have never been further investigated. However, it should be pointed out that, while such new chambers would certainly be an amazing discovery, they are more likely natural formations. Surely one day we will find out one way or another.

These anomalies were found but were not properly investigated.

"There are two anomalies in front of the front paws of the Sphinx. The bedrock in front of the Sphinx is covered with Roman-era paving stones - and poor electrical contact between the paving stones and bedrock gave somewhat noisy resistivity traverses. However one anomaly occurs on a large electrode spacing, suggesting a cavity or shaft as much as 10m deep. The cavity, if present, is probably filled with rubble.

The resistivity anomalies we found around the Sphinx are not defined sufficiently to allow us any absolutely certain conclusions, and we fell that a more detailed survey should be conducted."

But what remains is this...

There is evidence of openings beneath the Sphinx and the Great Pyramid. These rooms and passageways are there, but without further non destructive means of scanning and investigating these rooms and passageways the Egyptian department of antiquities is going to be hard pressed to allow any other kind of exploratory investigation.

So perhaps (probably) there is no hall of records beneath the Sphinx. But what is still undetermined even through your own "credible" source is that there may be a chamber beneath the front paws of the sphinx.

What is also interesting and has not been accounted for is the possible second sphinx. Perhaps one that was created by means of masonry and not carved out of a rock outcropping. It does appear that sphinx are generally paired up. So what remains to be explained is if there was a second sphinx where did it go? and is there any evidence that remains of it's existence to begin with?

the idea of a second sphinx is linguistical in nature
thats what you get for using glyphs instead of words
you wouldn't for instance say that this letter "w"is really evidence of two "v's" once existing somewhere would you
the Egyptians were into symbolism in a big way
having just one sphinx on one side of an ideogram just isn't balanced enough.
the most accepted theory about the Akhet is that it represents the mountains of the Akhet (Horizon)
they are called Bakhu and Manu and appear frequently in the pyramid texts and later in the egytpian book of the dead
you can see the obvious connection
the sphinx made of bedrock equates to a mountain made of the same thing
both symbolize the gods
both were believed by the egyptians to be real things
so you have one symbolic object that symbolizes the gods balanced by another symbolic object that symbolizes the gods

the claim that sphinxes always appear in twos doesnt stand up to any scrutiny either
in the avenue of the sphinxes at luxor
one side of the avenue has the regular type of sphinx that you all know and love to speculate on


but the other side of the avenue is balanced by Gyro Sphinx

so the idea of two identical sphinx facing each other isnt as well attested as you may have thought
but heres a crazy idea
its long been established that the sphinx head was recarved
what do you think it was recarved from ?

Maybe Egyptian rules dont apply to this sphinx. It hasnt even been proven the egyptians are the people who carved the sphinx so why use egyptian rules.

And yes there has been an investigation for secret chambers and such, but thorough I dont think so. There are so many new elctronic equipment these days give me a break.
And look at how big the pyramid is and convince me there are no more chambers, galleries, tunnels ect.
Also show proof the Egyptians even built the great sphinx or great pyramid. I dont think anybody knows for sure until we investigate more. We need a more THOROUGH investigation using equipment that cost lots of money, then we will know more.

Originally posted by earth2
Maybe Egyptian rules dont apply to this sphinx. It hasnt even been proven the egyptians are the people who carved the sphinx so why use egyptian rules.

what apart from it being at an egyptian site and being carved in a well known egyptian method from a material used by the Egyptians and being a well known egyptian symbol you mean

Originally posted by earth2

Also show proof the Egyptians even built the great pyramid. I dont think anybody knows for sure until we investigate more.

what apart from it being at an egyptian site , being an egyptian designed building in the middle of a series of similar egyptian buildings and being carved in a well known egyptian method from a material used by the Egyptians from known egyptian quarries which are nearby and being carbon dated to the egyptian period and containing Hieroglyphs of Khufus name and having a temple right outside which is also carved with hieroglyphs saying that its Khufus monument you mean

problem with this kind of speculation is that you are doing it without knowing any of the facts


[edit on 24-6-2007 by Marduk]

Im saying its possible the Egyptians came after the fact and and imitated what was there. There really isnt any proof the Egyptians built either besides a little graffiti, which isnt hard evidence. Just saying its possible.

If that is rain damage on the sphinx that would make it much older making it possible there was an earlier civilization.

Im glad I dont know all the facts because then I might think I know it all.

Originally posted by earth2

Im saying its possible the Egyptians came after the fact and and imitated what was there. There really isnt any proof the Egyptians built either besides a little graffiti, which isnt hard evidence. Just saying its possible.

If that is rain damage on the sphinx that would make it much older making it possible there was an earlier civilization.

Im glad I dont know all the facts because then I might think I know it all.

its totally not possible that the egyptians came after the fact
Egyptology 101
Pharoah Djoser ruled 2630-2613 built a step pyramid at saqquara

Pharaoh Sneferu ruled 2613-2589 BCE built the maidum pyramid which collapsed halfway through construction

because of this the other pyramid he was working on had to have its design changed and so it is know known as the bent pyramid

then having learned from these mistakes he built the first true pyramid known as the red pyramid

in all Sneferu utilised more limestone than any other pharoah in his buiding program. he was succeeded by his son Khufu
Pharooh Khufu ruled 2589-2566 BCE built the great pyramid at Giza

after he died his brother Djedefre came to power he built the pyramid of Djedefre (2528 -- 2520 BCE) which because it was far away from Giza was not maintained properly so its all but ruins today

then the pyramid of Khafre, djedefres brother (2520 - 2494 BCE)

then the pyramid of menkaure Khafres son(2490 – 2472 BCE).

then came Shepseskaf (2472-2467 BCE)
now he because he was the last king of the fourth dynasty which had bankrupted itself building bigger and bigger monuments changed his mind about having a pyramid and had a mastaba (manufactured tomb) instead.

it seems that he realised that having a burial place that was so obvious was like clanging the dinner bell for tomb robbers
the next dynasty (family) of pharoahs did in some cases build more pyramids but they were never to the same scale as what had gone previously because they had learned from the mistakes of the previous dynasty
the whole point of having a pyramid as a tomb was that your body could lie undisturbed so that the spirit (Ka) could live on in heaven.
so after this point it was quite common for pharoahs to build a small pyramid and then have themsleves buried somewhere else hidden in a rock cut tomb
now there were earlier pyramids than those of the fourth dynasty but none of them survive to this day
you can read about them here
www.narmer.pl...
so for you to say that the Egyptians didn't do it is to ignore all the evidence
its nonsense really and I hope you can see that now


[edit on 24-6-2007 by Marduk]

[edit on 24-6-2007 by Marduk]

[edit on 24-6-2007 by Marduk]

Well the evidence Khufu built the Great pyramid is a little iffy to me but the Sphinx, which is the subject of this thread, has no evidence for owner. There is no evidence the Egyptains carved it.
It is possible the Egyptians copied the original Sphinx which could have been built many years ealier.

I read somewhere there is a dropoff in the stone in front of the Sphinx, like a cliff. I guess thats where the harber was. How incredible would that be if sand is sitting on top of all this just waiting. Why do they keep doing these digs that are not very interesting why not start moving all this sand so we can see the good stuff. And dont they have modern ground penatrating radar stuff that could just take a picture of the inside of these things? whats the deal. I know these big oil companys have them. Lets see whats inside the pyramid.

Well the evidence Khufu built the Great pyramid is a little iffy to me

we have already established that you know very little of the facts in that case so thats fine and acceptable. when you learn more your opinion will change

the sphinx is built out of the bedrock
it has been completely excavated
that flat ground in front of it in this picture is rock not sand

youre obviously a little out of date
heres what it used to look like


as for a harbour ?
are you on something
the Sphinx is built on the Giza plateau
do you understand what a plateau is

It seems that there is some geological evidence that the sphinx was originally carved a lot earlier than first thought. The fact is that the outer shell of the sphinx was added latter and the original monument is in fact a lot smaller. Yes it was a carving of a Gyro Sphinx as Marduk suggested.

There is evidence of some sort of subterranean cavern or room beneath the sphinx, and there is speculation of a cover up by the Egyptian government of just that structure.

Lost Secrets of the Sphinx

And we still have the possibility of a second Sphinx to the north of the first sphinx where I earlier marked on a satalite image. This area as far as I know has not been thoroughly excavated or investigated. This area may reveal a foundation for the second sphinx and perhaps a second chamber beneath it.

The Giza plateau is above a area that used to be near a waterway. This is evidenced in a ancient harbor that has been uncovered.

What is strange is that no real investigation has been carried out east of the sphinx in the area of the dock.

Im iffy because the controversy about the forged graffiti which is the evidence that Khufu built it. However ive heard there are writings in between large stones that prove Khufu built it but i have yet to see them.

And this is what im speaking about concerning the cliff in front of the Sphinx

Dr, Hawass: I believe that you are speaking of the harbor. Yes, we found evidence of a drop-off out in front of the Sphinx Temple, and evidence of the harbor in the tunnels under the approach ramps in front of the Khafre Valley Temple. But, as of yet, no Hall of Records.

Link

Originally posted by earth2
Im iffy because the controversy about the forged graffiti which is the evidence that Khufu built it. However ive heard there are writings in between large stones that prove Khufu built it but i have yet to see them.

the claim that they were forged was made by Zechariah Sitchin who in his next breath claimed that the Pyramid was built as a prison for the Alien God Bel Marduk
you want an expert opinion on that one ?

the Khafre valley temple is not the same as the sphinx


and it was connected to the Nile by a canal


[edit on 24-6-2007 by Marduk]

Seriously, second sphinx? anyone have any clue about this? My theory is that the second sphinx was just north of the existing one and it was dismantled and used in the construction of buildings around Giza.

The reason I am thinking this is because often the ancient Egyptians would pair up sphinx to flank some monument or temple. the way the sphinx is set leads one to think maybe there was a second one on the other side. This would make the middle pyramid much more central and it would make sense.

Just wondering, you know there are others out there that theorized about a second sphinx where it was and what happened to it.


The Second Sphinx

A Second Great Sphinx?

The Riddle of the Second Sphinx



[edit on 6/24/2007 by whatukno]

Cool links. I dont think there is enough evidence either way right now to say for sure that there isnt another one in the area your thinking unless it has been excavated already.

A second Sphinx sounds right.
I found this and found it intresting, thought it might be here too.

The Riddle of the Sphinx