Watchtower: God WANTS to be called JEHOVAH!

reply to post by TiedDestructor


It's actually my bad for going off on a tangent. Sorry.

there is total agreement that "Jehovah" (an English translation, of a German word, made up of the vowels of one Hebrew word and the consonants of another, and only appearing thousands of years after the fact) is NOT the way it was pronounced.

reply to post by chr0naut



According to Merriam Webster

Je·ho·vah noun \ji-ˈhō-və\ —used as the name of God in the Old Testament of the Bible

English pronunciation

Jehovah


Jehovah's Witnesses view of the Divine Name:

Since certainty of pronunciation is not now attainable, there seems to be no reason for abandoning in English the well-known form “Jehovah” in favor of some other suggested pronunciation. If such a change were made, then, to be consistent, changes should be made in the spelling and pronunciation of a host of other names found in the Scriptures: Jeremiah would be changed to Yir·meyah′, Isaiah would become Yeshaʽ·ya′hu, and Jesus would be either Yehoh·shu′aʽ (as in Hebrew) or I·e·sous′ (as in Greek). The purpose of words is to transmit thoughts; in English the name Jehovah identifies the true God, transmitting this thought more satisfactorily today than any of the suggested substitutes

If Jehovah is changed then many other bible names including Jesus would need to be changed.

The result would be that many people would not be able to understand who is being referred to.

Further explanation.......

=23b666ac-28b1-4adb-92e8-a93a5284efad&insig ht[search_result_index]=0]The Tetragrammation of the Divine Name

reply to post by borntowatch


The traditional orthodox Jewish faith prohibits anyone from writing or uttering or trying to utter it in any shape or form. Also, some extend that to the word G-d. It is never to be erased. Therefore it is never written. As men are all sinful then to utter such a name would defile it, thus coming close to blasphemy. Now this interpretation is not held by all Abrahamic faiths. And I am not saying one is better than the other. I guess its all a matter of interpretation. I choose to not write these things for the reason stated, although I will write I Am as it holds a power I find inspiring and it was given to Moses as a name which is for us to know Him by. I will say "G-d" however and have said Y-hweh in conversation although I have began to refrain from doing so out of respect. I don't use His name in curses though or in frivolous speech. It is to honor Him I find most holy Who has provided me with my breath and life through which I came to know Him. Without this I would surely have perished. As a substitute, many people use Adonai, which means my Lord. Or just Lord. I don't think there is any law in the Bible holding you to this. I think it is a personal preference. It probably doesn't matter when your heart is on fire.

reply to post by TiedDestructor


You are really taking Isaiah out of context and applying meanings that are not present in the text to support your dislike for "organized religion". If one is to read Isaiah from front to back, they would see this is not the correct interpretation. What Isaiah was referencing was the people of Israel at the time were incorporating different beliefs from other gods into their religion. So when they would congregate to hold these multi-relligious celebrations it was an abomination to their G-d. In choosing to follow things that were outside of the teaching of Adonai, they were sinning gravely by doing so. This is the substance of Isaiah, not organized religion is bad. As a true christian as you have named yourself, you should know these things. Be careful not to add on or subtract, it's very dangerous for a believer. You are held to a higher standard.

As far as burning incense and congregating in worship, there are instructions in the Bible on how to do so. This is not seen as bad. The temple of Solomon was built in order to provide a place for G-d to be among such congregations. There was most definitely worship being done by many people and incense alters would have been burning. This by definition is organized religion. It was constructed at the behest of G-d Himself. I myself have seen organized religion as bad in the past, and thankfully Adonai has shown me my error. It can be very good indeed if done the right way.

reply to post by Maigret

TextThere is a promise in the Bible that 'Whosever calls upon the name of the LORD, shall have salvation' (Romans 10:13), but how can you obtain this promise, if don't know his name to call upon Him? Christians would call upon the name of Jesus, but this quote is from Joel 2:32 where in the original it is 'YHWH'. - See more at: www.abovetopsecret.com...

What happens to all of the JW's who used the KJV bible before your 1961 NWT. Are they screwed out of salvation for those 90 years? Just wondering.

I don't see what the big deal is. I personally think it's better to call God by his name rather than just LORD, since Jesus is also called Lord. Jesus has a name that he is called by. Jehovah should to.

Seede
reply to post by Maigret

 

TextThere is a promise in the Bible that 'Whosever calls upon the name of the LORD, shall have salvation' (Romans 10:13), but how can you obtain this promise, if don't know his name to call upon Him? Christians would call upon the name of Jesus, but this quote is from Joel 2:32 where in the original it is 'YHWH'. - See more at: www.abovetopsecret.com...

What happens to all of the JW's who used the KJV bible before your 1961 NWT. Are they screwed out of salvation for those 90 years? Just wondering.

the KJV uses Jehovah 4 times. Exodus 6:3 being one of them.
"And I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob, by the name of God Almighty, but by my name JEHOVAH was I not known to them."
Also, the name Jehovah's Witness already existed.

Seede
reply to post by Maigret

 

TextThere is a promise in the Bible that 'Whosever calls upon the name of the LORD, shall have salvation' (Romans 10:13), but how can you obtain this promise, if don't know his name to call upon Him? Christians would call upon the name of Jesus, but this quote is from Joel 2:32 where in the original it is 'YHWH'. - See more at: www.abovetopsecret.com...

What happens to all of the JW's who used the KJV bible before your 1961 NWT. Are they screwed out of salvation for those 90 years? Just wondering.

Not only the JW's for a mere 90 years, but anyone who believes and trusts in the name 'Jesus'.

As John 6:45 says, "It is written in the prophets, And they shall all be taught of God. Every one that hath heard from the Father, and hath learned, cometh unto me."

Men lead men to Jesus. It takes God to lead you to Yeshua. His name has only been revealed in the last 20 years or so, because it's previously been hidden, from misuse and abuse. Only one generation - this one! - has the opportunity to take up their crosses, to follow the Son, to refuse to worship the Beast/Antichrist, refuse his mark, etc. etc. Only this generation has the chance to be deemed worthy of the sacrifice of the Lamb of God.

Enoch 62:7 For from the beginning the Son of Man was hidden, And the Most High preserved him in the presence of His might, And revealed him to the elect.

P.S. I use the RAV.

TiedDestructor

brazenalderpadrescorpio
reply to post by Maigret

 

I'm not claiming that anybody knows how the names were originally pronounced. It's a, shall we say, mystery.

I believe when the heart of men cries out God hasn't but a choice to hear.

Quoting Psalm 34:17-18

The righteous cry, and the LORD hears And delivers them out of all their troubles. The LORD is near to the brokenhearted And saves those who are crushed in spirit.…

The great "I am" is so fitting.

And as I understand it, that is His Name - Yah / I am! As in HalleluYah! See Psalm 68:4 RAV '...by His Name Yah...' And if you pronounce the name of Yeshua, which means 'The LORD saves' in a certain way you get 'Yah' as the end syllable! (Remember Hebrew is back to front, or right to left.)

deeezbeats

Seede
reply to post by Maigret

 

TextThere is a promise in the Bible that 'Whosever calls upon the name of the LORD, shall have salvation' (Romans 10:13), but how can you obtain this promise, if don't know his name to call upon Him? Christians would call upon the name of Jesus, but this quote is from Joel 2:32 where in the original it is 'YHWH'. - See more at: www.abovetopsecret.com...

What happens to all of the JW's who used the KJV bible before your 1961 NWT. Are they screwed out of salvation for those 90 years? Just wondering.

the KJV uses Jehovah 4 times. Exodus 6:3 being one of them.
"And I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob, by the name of God Almighty, but by my name JEHOVAH was I not known to them."
Also, the name Jehovah's Witness already existed.

edit on 30-3-2014 by deeezbeats because: (no reason given)

First off, let me say that I know some JW's and they are really good people. I have nothing against them or any other Christian religion personally... but I do know that they have all been seriously misled!

The KJV uses Jehovah, but there is no 'J' in the Hebrew alphabet... and the OT came to us in Hebrew; so you work it out.

The RAV uses LORD, and as it says in the preface to this Bible, LORD, all in capital letters, stands in place of the Covenant name of God.

Maigret

Seede
reply to post by Maigret

 

TextThere is a promise in the Bible that 'Whosever calls upon the name of the LORD, shall have salvation' (Romans 10:13), but how can you obtain this promise, if don't know his name to call upon Him? Christians would call upon the name of Jesus, but this quote is from Joel 2:32 where in the original it is 'YHWH'. - See more at: www.abovetopsecret.com...

What happens to all of the JW's who used the KJV bible before your 1961 NWT. Are they screwed out of salvation for those 90 years? Just wondering.

Not only the JW's for a mere 90 years, but anyone who believes and trusts in the name 'Jesus'.

As John 6:45 says, "It is written in the prophets, And they shall all be taught of God. Every one that hath heard from the Father, and hath learned, cometh unto me."

Men lead men to Jesus. It takes God to lead you to Yeshua. His name has only been revealed in the last 20 years or so, because it's previously been hidden, from misuse and abuse. Only one generation - this one! - has the opportunity to take up their crosses, to follow the Son, to refuse to worship the Beast/Antichrist, refuse his mark, etc. etc. Only this generation has the chance to be deemed worthy of the sacrifice of the Lamb of God.

Enoch 62:7 For from the beginning the Son of Man was hidden, And the Most High preserved him in the presence of His might, And revealed him to the elect.

P.S. I use the RAV.

P.P.S. The 'gospel' that will be preached in the whole world as a witness to all the [religious] nations, and which signifies the end, is that they will hand you over to TRIBULATION and kill you, and you will be hated on account of / because of / for the sake of MY NAME'. Matthew 24:9 & 14 paraphrased.

dusty1

there is total agreement that "Jehovah" (an English translation, of a German word, made up of the vowels of one Hebrew word and the consonants of another, and only appearing thousands of years after the fact) is NOT the way it was pronounced.

reply to post by chr0naut

 

According to Merriam Webster

Je·ho·vah noun \ji-ˈhō-və\ —used as the name of God in the Old Testament of the Bible

English pronunciation

Jehovah


Jehovah's Witnesses view of the Divine Name:

Since certainty of pronunciation is not now attainable, there seems to be no reason for abandoning in English the well-known form “Jehovah” in favor of some other suggested pronunciation. If such a change were made, then, to be consistent, changes should be made in the spelling and pronunciation of a host of other names found in the Scriptures: Jeremiah would be changed to Yir·meyah′, Isaiah would become Yeshaʽ·ya′hu, and Jesus would be either Yehoh·shu′aʽ (as in Hebrew) or I·e·sous′ (as in Greek). The purpose of words is to transmit thoughts; in English the name Jehovah identifies the true God, transmitting this thought more satisfactorily today than any of the suggested substitutes

If Jehovah is changed then many other bible names including Jesus would need to be changed.

The result would be that many people would not be able to understand who is being referred to.

Further explanation.......

=23b666ac-28b1-4adb-92e8-a93a5284efad&insig ht[search_result_index]=0]The Tetragrammation of the Divine Name

This idea seems very reasonable among men, but it isn't up to men to decide these things. For starters, I read once that if you translate Jehovah back into Hebrew, it means god is evil. Whether this is true or not, I have no way of knowing but it made me extremely nervous about taking seemingly very good ideas as being right or true.

Only two names are vitally important to know and to get right and to change if necessary to the correct usage, and they are the names of the Father and the Son!

Maigret

deeezbeats

Seede
reply to post by Maigret

 

TextThere is a promise in the Bible that 'Whosever calls upon the name of the LORD, shall have salvation' (Romans 10:13), but how can you obtain this promise, if don't know his name to call upon Him? Christians would call upon the name of Jesus, but this quote is from Joel 2:32 where in the original it is 'YHWH'. - See more at: www.abovetopsecret.com...

What happens to all of the JW's who used the KJV bible before your 1961 NWT. Are they screwed out of salvation for those 90 years? Just wondering.

the KJV uses Jehovah 4 times. Exodus 6:3 being one of them.
"And I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob, by the name of God Almighty, but by my name JEHOVAH was I not known to them."
Also, the name Jehovah's Witness already existed.

edit on 30-3-2014 by deeezbeats because: (no reason given)

First off, let me say that I know some JW's and they are really good people. I have nothing against them or any other Christian religion personally... but I do know that they have all been seriously misled!

The KJV uses Jehovah, but there is no 'J' in the Hebrew alphabet... and the OT came to us in Hebrew; so you work it out.

The RAV uses LORD, and as it says in the preface to this Bible, LORD, all in capital letters, stands in place of the Covenant name of God.

JW's are already aware that Jehovah is the English rendering. No one will tell you that it is the original. But the majority of names with Y are rendered with a J in every bible.
Yeroboam(Jeroboam)
Y'hudah(Juduh)
Yehosophat(Jehosophat)
Eliyahu(Elijah)
Yehoshua(Jesus)
Iesous(Greek version of Jesus name)
Yerusalem(Jerusalem)
Yehoiakim(Jehoiakim)
Yoshiyahu(Josiah)
Yermiyahu(Jeremiah)
Yahakov(Jacob)
There's many more names but this is just to touch up. Jehovah is God's name just as much as Jesus is Yeshuas name.
I don't see how changing a letter through translation is any different than replacing the actual name with LORD. Except I prefer bible's with some form tpofnthe divine name being used.

The name that God gave Abraham was "El Shaddai". He said this:

"I am El Shaddai - God almighty; walk before me faithfully and be blameless." - Genesis 17:1

Later, when God introduced himself to Moses he said this:

"I AM WHO I AM (EHYH ASHR EHYH). This is what you are to say to the Israelites: 'I AM (EHYEH) has sent me to you.'" - Exodus 3:14

and a few chapters later...

"I appeared to Abraham, to Isaac and to Jacob as El Shaddai - God Almighty, but by my name The Lord - YHVH I did not make myself fully known to them. " - Exodus 6:3

EHYH means "I AM", El Shaddai means "The Almighty God", YHVH means "He who is".

"Ehyeh" is how you pronounce "I AM" in Hebrew.

"Yahweh" is how you pronounce "He who is" in Hebrew.



Jesus called God "Abba" which means "Father" (Mark 14:36), and we are told to call him 'our father' also (Matthew 6:9).

"And do not call anyone on earth 'father,' for you have one Father, and he is in heaven." - Matthew 23:9

arpgme
The name that God gave Abraham was "El Shaddai". He said this:

"I am El Shaddai - God almighty; walk before me faithfully and be blameless." - Genesis 17:1

Later, when God introduced himself to Moses he said this:

"I AM WHO I AM (EHYH ASHR EHYH). This is what you are to say to the Israelites: 'I AM (EHYEH) has sent me to you.'" - Exodus 3:14

and a few chapters later...

"I appeared to Abraham, to Isaac and to Jacob as El Shaddai - God Almighty, but by my name The Lord - YHVH I did not make myself fully known to them. " - Exodus 6:3

EHYH means "I AM", El Shaddai means "The Almighty God", YHVH means "He who is".

"Ehyeh" is how you pronounce "I AM" in Hebrew.

"Yahweh" is how you pronounce "He who is" in Hebrew.



Jesus called God "Abba" which means "Father" (Mark 14:36), and we are told to call him 'our father' also (Matthew 6:9).

"And do not call anyone on earth 'father,' for you have one Father, and he is in heaven." - Matthew 23:9

Abraham knew God by his name
Genesis 22:14 And Abraham named that place YWHW-ji′reh.* This is why it is still said today: “In the mountain of YHWH it will be provided.”
biblehub.com...
Ehyeh Esher ehyeh Literally Translates I Will Be What I Will Be. I Am Who I Am is only a non-literal english translation. Ehyeh esher Ehyeh was only a meaning of what Jehovah means. Before Abraham, No one knew of Jehovah as Ehyeh Esher Ehyeh.

The premise of calling on the the creator God by his name with the "correct" pronunciation is a magical "spiritual"connection is not truel.Yes the creator God has a name and many names.The all enveloping "name" is the tetragrammaton....
אֶהְיֶה אֲשֶׁר אֶהְיֶה (Ehyeh Asher Ehye)

usually transliterated more correctly into English as Yahweh...and means "I will be what I will be" .Knowing the name does not mean knowing how to pronounce it.....the many ways to "say" a name vary. A name is the nature and character of the thing or person named.That's what "knowing" someones name is.Not how to spell or pronounce it.The pronunciation is not the perennial thing.In its inception only Aaron the high priest was allowed to say the name .

The name of the creator God is usually said as a title.Lord, Adonai, God etc etc....If you want to say it as a name my suggestion is to say it in Hebrew since that is how it was communicated to Moses.That leaves no confusion to who it means.There is no "power" in saying or knowing the pronunciation as some believe. Saying the creator Gods name is not a mystical"spiritual" incantation that causes a blessing...or anything.That is superstition at it's worse.

On that note...the point is "knowing" the nature and character of the thing or person.Jesus is the transliteration to English of a Latin transliteration(Iesus) of a Greek translation(Iesous) of the Hebrew name Yahoshua(itself a transliteration).So the Greek is not trying to "sound" like Hebrew but it is very probable many of the Greeks called him Iesous because all of the New Testament is written in Greek.

Yahoshua's disciples and fellow Jews would have called him Yahoshua(transliteration of Hebrew).The way to say his name is not the supreme importance. Even though it not the most significant aspect of his name it is important how to say it because it is attention and acknowledgement and a witness to truth.For example....My neighbors name is Jose.That's what he told me his name is so out of acknowledgement of respect as knowing him as a friend I call him Jose not "Joe" just because he is IN the USA! His preference of his name is the priority.It is who he is(in a much lesser degree than Yahoshua's name).In one sense it's proof that I know him.

The meaning of the name Yahoshua(Yehoshua or Yahshua or Yeshua) is Yahweh is the deliverer/salvation.The unfortunate irony is the majority of Christians don't "believe" in that name.They pay lip service and "say" they believe he is the savor...of THEM.....and everyone who believes as they do.....and that doctrine of belief can vary from small to quite large degrees.However the vast majority do no believe Yahoshua is the deliverer/savor of ALL mankind and therefore cannot know his name because they believe only THEY(and like believing believers) will be saved...which is false.That is NOT knowing the name of Yahoshua.

Fortunately what they believe is not fact.To believe in Yahoshua (God's salvation) is to know the creator Gods nature and character and that the creator God can ONLY save EVERYONE!That is the creator Gods "nature" and character.It would be impossible any other way or they wouldn't be the creator God.It is not a condition of salvation to believe or know the name of Yahoshua or no one would be saved.(and no that is not what Paul said)

That is the real rotten core of the whole ball of wax of Christianity.....They do not believe in the creator God and do not know neither the Son nor the Father. They can't as long as they believe the doctrine of the eternal punishment of hell.They have annulled who the creator God is and made him in their image.The delivering/salvation of mankind is the most dramatic act committed by anyone and God alone is the decider /cause not man.Man is completely incapable of saving themselves in any manner.That means belief also. This means everything is 100% in the creator Gods control.To believe anything less is to not believe or far more importantly ...know God.That is not condemnation it is fact.

Deliverance/salvation is a process not an event.The 1st thing anyone will be saved/delivered from(which is called forgiveness, which is not pardon from guilt but freedom from bondage,) is their faith in their "Belief System" of "their" religion.When someone is freed from bondage of their Belief System religion is destroyed.That is the gate at the end of the wide road..the gate of destruction.It destroys mans religion. That's why Paul wrote the last thing to be destroyed is death.....religion is the first to be destroyed because it's at the core of all death.When your religion is destroyed you enter onto the narrow path that leads to the narrow gate which is the finality of death to enter the infinite green pasture.Physical death is not the crossover.That is not the "freedom from bondage" for many.

Those that commit the blasphemy of the Holy Spirit are not "forgiven" (freed from bondage of their religion) in this age NOR the next.Aeon is mostly translated as eternal or eternity or world but it means age.Whatever it is .....it is beyond "physical" death that is THIS age(the valley of the shadow of death).

An age isn't a specific period of time like 7,000 or 6,000 years like the Christians like to break it up to fit their agenda of HOW you must be saved.By believing in the name of "Jesus".However this is exactly what Yahoshua said would happen they just don't believe he is speaking of them however it is unmistakable.There has never been any large group (the many) that has lived that fit the description to a tee.

"In that day (period of an age) MANY will come IN my NAME saying I am christ and will deceive many".


They are the many(2 billion presently) that are the deceived. They have deceived themselves with their "religion" and attempt to "convert" others to believe as they do...however...Yahoshua is not sanctioning ANY religion...PERIOD...that is completely unreasonable and history has proven it so.Religions are the most deceptive institutions in existence.They are so flawed it blinds all those who believe it completely.

Anyone fortunate enough to escape it(more accurately extracted from it) should thank the lucky heathen star they wished on...because it wasn't them that extracted themselves from the spiders lair of false religion...it was the creator God..Consider yourselves very,very fortunate fate has shined on you!There seems to be no rhyme or reason for who and why and how religion effects different people.However it is evident it eats them from the inside until their belief swallows them whole.It is a most unfortunate condition.I wouldn't wish it on anyone and I have great empathy and sympathy for them. Fortunately everyone will be freed from the bondage of their religion then of course death.That is the meaning of Yahoshua...Yahweh IS deliverance/salvation.To know the Son is to know the Father...and That's the good news of the name.

God speaks all languages. Variation of a Hebrew language I doubt means much since it isn't the first language.

deeezbeats
I don't see what the big deal is. I personally think it's better to call God by his name rather than just LORD, since Jesus is also called Lord. Jesus has a name that he is called by. Jehovah should to.

edit on 30-3-2014 by deeezbeats because: (no reason given)

I call Him Father, that's still ok, isn't it?

The point is this, as God simply means spirit, God isn't His name. But He does have a begotten son, whom He said to call Emmanuel but also Jesus. I wondered about that and came to the conclusion that Emmanuel must be His name in heaven, but for on earth, it is Jesus. However Jesus is pronounced in a language, just say it in your language, He knows who you are talking to.

WarminIndy

deeezbeats
I don't see what the big deal is. I personally think it's better to call God by his name rather than just LORD, since Jesus is also called Lord. Jesus has a name that he is called by. Jehovah should to.

edit on 30-3-2014 by deeezbeats because: (no reason given)

I call Him Father, that's still ok, isn't it?

The point is this, as God simply means spirit, God isn't His name. But He does have a begotten son, whom He said to call Emmanuel but also Jesus. I wondered about that and came to the conclusion that Emmanuel must be His name in heaven, but for on earth, it is Jesus. However Jesus is pronounced in a language, just say it in your language, He knows who you are talking to.

Most people in the bible have names because they hold meanings. The angel told them to name The Child Immanuel because it means "God is with us". In Heaven, the angels are always with God so it couldn't be Immanuel. His name later became Jesus Which means Salvation, because he was to save mankind from all sins.

deeezbeats

WarminIndy

deeezbeats
I don't see what the big deal is. I personally think it's better to call God by his name rather than just LORD, since Jesus is also called Lord. Jesus has a name that he is called by. Jehovah should to.

edit on 30-3-2014 by deeezbeats because: (no reason given)

I call Him Father, that's still ok, isn't it?

The point is this, as God simply means spirit, God isn't His name. But He does have a begotten son, whom He said to call Emmanuel but also Jesus. I wondered about that and came to the conclusion that Emmanuel must be His name in heaven, but for on earth, it is Jesus. However Jesus is pronounced in a language, just say it in your language, He knows who you are talking to.

Most people in the bible have names because they hold meanings. The angel told them to name The Child Immanuel because it means "God is with us". In Heaven, the angels are always with God so it couldn't be Immanuel. His name later became Jesus Which means Salvation, because he was to save mankind from all sins.

edit on 1-4-2014 by deeezbeats because: (no reason given)

Deeezbeats, please don't think I'm knocking you personally, it's just your posts give me such a valuable opportunity to get knowledge and the truth out there! Thank you!

With the name, Immanuel', remember it is because of the Son and his sacrifice that 'God is with us'!

The name Yeshua in Hebrew does mean 'The LORD saves' and every time we say this name, we also proclaim this fact! The name 'Jesus' doesn't actually have any inherent meaning.

And just some extra food for thought...

Quote: 'The word “God” found its way into English-language Christianity through such translations as the King James Bible of 1611. But its origins are decidedly both racial and “pagan.” '
Source: www.globalresearch.ca...