China Doesn't Back Russia's Invasion Of Crimea — And That's A Big Problem For Putin Read more:

reply to post by rickynews


I agree. China/Japan conflict could start WW3 if any .... there's a lot of tension in the world right now but Russia is not the main problem. Just Middle East and Oceania pose a bigger threat to the world security than Eastern Europe.

There could be problem if Russia started to sell natural gas to China in Yens which is one of the options on the table. China will spend about 1.5 trillion USD in the next years just to make its economy 'greener' and Russian natural gas will do. Oil trade will add few hundred billions to it. Add trade with EU in euros and US dollar will lose a lot .. Russia can have a major effect on the US economy if it decides to do so ... But neither side is dumb enough to do that

Arnie123
reply to post by criticalhit

 

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Spot on post, Critical hit.
I couldn't agree more.

Thanks Arnie, others have said it in simpler ways even on this page, I could find a dozen more examples of why China absolutely does not want war with the west.

If you want to see a country willing and desirous of war look at us, even in rebuilding the world trade center we went for one building with a mainly empty top... Look at China, mega skyscrapers going up monthly, mostly is a geographical area the size of the north east of the USA, that's not a nation planning on having missiles shot at it's cities.

If there is ever a war, a real one beyond Naval dispute in Chinas own waters... it will be because we mistrusted them so much it was forced.

Truth even when I talk about their plans, I basically am encouraging of them, China is the reliable, sane nation for an economic shift, they are building cities to urbanize the poor, there is now way our economy can compete with 5x the number of workers, they are working us to death trying, we need discussion openness and acceptance of the numbers which are in China's favor as Americans quality of life is not dependent on being the number one economic power in the world any Northern European nation can tell you that. I'm not even sure where we get things like "trade imbalance" when the population numbers are vastly imbalanced of course they produce more to sell... they have 5x the workers

China is not a "great mystery" really very simple goals over there

baburak
reply to post by rickynews

 

I agree. China/Japan conflict could start WW3 if any .... there's a lot of tension in the world right now but Russia is not the main problem. Just Middle East and Oceania pose a bigger threat to the world security than Eastern Europe.

There could be problem if Russia started to sell natural gas to China in Yens which is one of the options on the table. China will spend about 1.5 trillion USD in the next years just to make its economy 'greener' and Russian natural gas will do. Oil trade will add few hundred billions to it. Add trade with EU in euros and US dollar will lose a lot .. Russia can have a major effect on the US economy if it decides to do so ... But neither side is dumb enough to do that

edit on 30-3-2014 by baburak because: (no reason given)

I don't think it will happen

realistically the only way it will is if we in the west and japan continue to buy the bs dished out by big energy companies, sure there is gas near the islands, but in regards to Japan you WANT China's population modernized consumers, the population of China is 1.5 Billion they can buy enough from you to keep Japan a wealthy nation with a 120 million population for centuries, meanwhile there will never or at least never has to be an energy crisis for Japan given the advances being made in alternative energy and none of that money from the gas actually will benefit the "people" of Japan, just some Billionaires... There is so much money to be made from Chinese consumerism it's ridiculous.

I mean realistically we have 2 choices... all of us.

Trust China, stop fighting psuedo energy wars with them, even here in the States we are independent by need our advances in alternatives and many other methods have us with our lights on for centuries to come. China needs the energy... it's a huge consumer population. By being friendly we can all have businesses again, we can have a middle class in America again... The other way, what we are doing is alienation for huge mega corps to get richer.

China will be the worlds no 1 economic power... it's inevitable anyway and I ask So What????? We wont even mess with North Korea one of the poorest nations in the world because they have 4 Nukes loaded onto rickshaws maybe lol... what will China ever do? attack us? and then block 3500 Nukes with ping pong skills? most of their urban population is in an area we can lay waste to with 5...

we need their tourism, we need them to open up enough for you and I to sell too, they need the energy 100x more than we do for that to happen.... jeez louise, it's just a country, we treat them like an invasion of aliens from outer space... they are more of a capitalist nation than we are at this point...

AreUKiddingMe

I'm not surprised that China isn't supporting him in this brazen takeover of Crimea and Putin's rush into Ukraine. Looking back over history everyone can see it for what it really is. The only problem is that the world mistakenly thought Putin wanted to be a player on the world stage under the same rules as everyone else. We let our guard down. Surprise!! Putin has shown his hand, and it's a flop.
It never ceases to surprise me, the number of english-speaking Russian boot-lickers you can find eager to take Putin's side when they REALLY know nothing about the situation.

Good post, but I'm curious... exactly what "rules" are those that everyone else plays by? The USA has done just as many heinous things for far longer than Putin has been in power. (Not that Russia hasn't pulled some heinous s#!t pre-Putin.)

The irony is that most Americans eat up the "Putin is a bad guy," and "Russia is so authoritarian." If anything the USA is slowly moving that direction, some argue already there in many respects.

When it comes to the world people always point to Putin's invasion of Georgia as "see he's doing it again." But no one bothers to remember the BS lies the USA used to go to Iraq in 1991, Afghanistan in 2002, and Iraq in 2003 (I won't even touch all the coups in the last several years). All while we are screaming "Go American!" and "we're spreading democracy."

I don't know what's worse - living under a known tyrant (never have, so don't know) or dealing with a sociopathic country being puppeteered by psychopathic corporations while the dumb-downed populace screams and yells for more like the world is nothing more than blood sport.

Thankfully Americans appear to be growing tired of war, but our "leadership" hasn't. The s#!t Putin is doing is nothing worse than the USA has done in the last 13 years.

That headline is very incorrect, Crimea voted to join russia. Infact Crimea is now part of russia.

Chine has played its hand very well, they are not upsetting Russia or the EU / America. Sitting on the fence keeps it business as usual fro china. As someone said, "Well played sir".

Dont expect russia to give back crimea to ukraine as most people that live in Crimea are formly Russian. Dont expect Russia to move onto Ukraine either, they have stated they will not. Also, just because the UN voted that giving crimea the vote is illegal that any army is going to march into crimea to enforce that... that is why the UN made it non binding.

I think the game has finally played out... Russia gets Crimea, Ukraine goes towards the EU.

Apart from the odd VISA BAN (which is not exactly going to cripple the russian economy), its business as usual.

On the subject of GAS

No country would turn down cheap GAS, as people comment on here so often its the lubrication that keeps countries moving and certainly china cannot get enough of it at the moment. I expect Ukraine will have to forgo its current discount it gets from Russia and considering they also got export dollars exporting this, they will be loosing out on this money stream as well.

reply to post by Reinmax


Good post. However:

I think West is using Ukraine to destabilize Russia. This is what is happening.

Mr Snowden has taken some very critical secrets with him, likely it contains the details of secret war against Russia.

Russians have suddenly become very very concerned and ready to take extreme actions.

It is true that game is far more than Crimea.

World war III, if it ever starts, will be started by the West or the Western Alliance.

Neither Russia nor China will start World War III. Note down this statement in your diaries and you will see.

Russia and China will merely respond to the events.

A strike on Iran by Israel/US can very well be the starting point of WWIII. We shall know when it happens. Events in Crimea is NOT the start of WWIII.

WCmutant

AreUKiddingMe

I'm not surprised that China isn't supporting him in this brazen takeover of Crimea and Putin's rush into Ukraine. Looking back over history everyone can see it for what it really is. The only problem is that the world mistakenly thought Putin wanted to be a player on the world stage under the same rules as everyone else. We let our guard down. Surprise!! Putin has shown his hand, and it's a flop.
It never ceases to surprise me, the number of english-speaking Russian boot-lickers you can find eager to take Putin's side when they REALLY know nothing about the situation.

Good post, but I'm curious... exactly what "rules" are those that everyone else plays by? The USA has done just as many heinous things for far longer than Putin has been in power. (Not that Russia hasn't pulled some heinous s#!t pre-Putin.)

The irony is that most Americans eat up the "Putin is a bad guy," and "Russia is so authoritarian." If anything the USA is slowly moving that direction, some argue already there in many respects.

When it comes to the world people always point to Putin's invasion of Georgia as "see he's doing it again." But no one bothers to remember the BS lies the USA used to go to Iraq in 1991, Afghanistan in 2002, and Iraq in 2003 (I won't even touch all the coups in the last several years). All while we are screaming "Go American!" and "we're spreading democracy." [color=Limegreen](Where were you right after 9/11?)

I don't know what's worse - living under a known tyrant (never have, so don't know) or dealing with a sociopathic country being puppeteered by psychopathic corporations while the dumb-downed populace screams and yells for more like the world is nothing more than blood sport.

Thankfully Americans appear to be growing tired of war, but our "leadership" hasn't. The s#!t Putin is doing is nothing worse than the USA has done in the last 13 years.

The accepted rules are that you don't go into neighboring countries with your military for territorial expansion. Which is exactly what Putin did in Crimea. Saddam was killing his own people in Iraq. Hitler was massacring the Jews. I don't necessarily agree with everything we've been involved in, but it has been Our boys who have fought for the rights of others to live in peace. I'm proud of the USA in that regard.

Yes we are tired of wars and being the policemen of the world. We have enough dead servicemen, and the suicide rate from the trauma of war is 22 per day. Twenty-two per day. We should be taking care of our boys we sent to fight.
But I guarantee you one thing. Right after 9/11 you didn't find anyone wanting to just stay home and turn the other cheek. And yes I know all the theories that have come out since then.

reply to post by Wookiep


To the OP and all those blindly buying into that nonsense about China and Putin...
I say only one thing...;
LEARN TO PLAY CHESS.!!!!!

And if you already know how to play chess, learn how to strategize in chess.

The other option is to simply learn how to think critically instead of just finding some literature put out by god knows who, which in any way slight or mighty way aligns with your limited perceptions of the situation.

I mean this case for example. Did you REALLY, Seriously, Honestly convince yourself that someone as smart as Putin has not AT LEAST considered the consequences of a close ally NOT backing this chess move?
Id go as far as to better believe that not only did Putin anticipate this, he had already partnered with China on such a move.

Think about it for just a moment... What good does it do China to publicly announce to the globe it is backing an invasion of a sovereign territory with pretenses which on the surface are similar to the US invasion of Iraq? (and trust me subsurface details will prove this is nothing like that invasion)
Well the answer is NONE! No good at all for China. In fact China is better off pretending NOT to back the invasion because a)Russia can handle this alone b)LMAO There is LITERALLY Nobdy that can forcefull stop Russia from taking over the entire Ukrain if it wanted and c)This takes the BRIC Alliance one step closer to showing the world the USA is no longer the dominant hand in the globe.

There wont be a world war 3 because america cannot afford it. Nope not literally, financially or even joinging forces with another super power (which I would bet my life nobody would back america for anything). America is spread so thin it only reminds me of the roman empire shortly before its collapse. And who else on this planet besides America has demonstrated enough evil and hate for others to start a WW3? Well, my fellow ATSrs... the answer to that one, is Nobody.

reply to post by AreUKiddingMe


"I don't necessarily agree with everything we've been involved in, but it has been Our boys who have fought for the rights of others to live in peace."


HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah

AhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhHahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaa

OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LOL LMBO!!!!!!!

GargIndia
World war III, if it ever starts, will be started by the West or the Western Alliance.

Neither Russia nor China will start World War III. Note down this statement in your diaries and you will see.

Russia and China will merely respond to the events.

A strike on Iran by Israel/US can very well be the starting point of WWIII. We shall know when it happens. Events in Crimea is NOT the start of WWIII.

The BRIC is the new Global Super Power. It just hasnt been announced yet. They are giving the USA war masters time to realize, acknowledge, cope, deal with and accept the reality. There wont be a WW3... The world is waking up and its only American glued to the TV that are still "plugged in".

BRIC = Brazil Russia India China Alliance. There is a small chance Venezuela might be able to join, but they are running out of time and the America evil is knee deep with claws inside that poor country trying everything in their power to destablize it ever since they were able to assasinate Chavez.

reply to post by Karlos


Sorry Pal, BRIC is no superpower and not at all in military sense.

Brazil: Antiquated military
Russia: under constant cuts and reductions for 23 years now. Bad training when compared to west.
India: Only adequate for its immediate needs, nothing beyond.
China: Added some hardware lately but nothing challenging. Still conscript based using old training methods.

Above all, the war fighting doctrines of all the BRICs is still infantry and armor based. 20th century concepts.

Karlos
reply to post by AreUKiddingMe

 

"I don't necessarily agree with everything we've been involved in, but it has been Our boys who have fought for the rights of others to live in peace."


HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah

AhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhHahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaa

OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LOL LMBO!!!!!!!

Typical response from someone who has no response. Yawn. Are all those Ha's hand typed or did you do some copying and pasting? Impressive work there, must be at least 50-75 ha's. And then we have the bonus OMG and LOL with the exclamation marks.

Trueman
reply to post by rigel4

 

China not supporting Russia is China supporting USA. China can change side once USA jumps in. I'm tired of this charade. Nobody with a clear position ruling the world, just a bunch of gossipy hypocrat puppets.

edit on 28-3-2014 by Trueman because: (no reason given)

Smoking mirrors.

IMO china will let Russia and Russia's Muslim buddies hit the USA, then china will strike.

I think Israel will be last on the menu.

Just thinking out loud

Just puppet politicians playing their role and responding to the string pullers. It's all political rhetoric, but if the bombs start dropping then you'll quickly see what side China is on...................China's.

Just like Russia will be on Russia's side, and the US will be on the US's side. But all sides are on the side of the string pullers. Seriously but, why do people keep falling for this ?

Why do we always take our eyes off the string pullers whenever THEIR puppets open their mouths ?
Why do we always focus on the puppets, yet ignore why they are puppets ?
Why ?

Karlos

GargIndia
World war III, if it ever starts, will be started by the West or the Western Alliance.

Neither Russia nor China will start World War III. Note down this statement in your diaries and you will see.

Russia and China will merely respond to the events.

A strike on Iran by Israel/US can very well be the starting point of WWIII. We shall know when it happens. Events in Crimea is NOT the start of WWIII.

The BRIC is the new Global Super Power. It just hasnt been announced yet. They are giving the USA war masters time to realize, acknowledge, cope, deal with and accept the reality. There wont be a WW3... The world is waking up and its only American glued to the TV that are still "plugged in".

BRIC = Brazil Russia India China Alliance. There is a small chance Venezuela might be able to join, but they are running out of time and the America evil is knee deep with claws inside that poor country trying everything in their power to destablize it ever since they were able to assasinate Chavez.

It is BRICS, South Africa joined in 2010.

reply to post by stirling


Bumpkins?


Meanwhile, back on the ranch, China are being opportunistic and nothing more. Putin is right and most of the people there have spoken. It looks like TPTB's little plan failed. They need to get over it and leave the Russians in peace. I know, I know, peace and the zio-US gov should never be uttered in the same sentence.

reply to post by rigel4


It wont matter what anyone thinks, The Russian Prime minister during his recent visit to Crimea, has signed off Pensions civil servants wages etc. to be paid at the normal Russian rate. Plus a restocking of hospital equipment to bring it up to the normal Russian standard. At this rate other areas will be wanting to join the Russian federation. The West has been outflanked.