10 Poverty Myths, Busted

reply to post by hopenotfeariswhatweneed

yep "Mike Tyson " was born in the gutter worked his way out of poverty only then to become an ear biter....his vision was to beat he hoohah outa people and it worked for him....but it is unrealistic to believe that same opportunity exists for the masses as there simply is not enough coin for everyone to make it "rich" in this world

Awesome analogy....

reply to post by neo96


Ok, so I read it again. It is my opinion that there are no facts, and that is a fact.

poverty facts.

Take the economy with regards to jobs. There are almost no needless jobs today. Whether a plumber, trash man, store clerk, doctor, paramedic, janitor, etc.. EVERY job is vital to having a functioning first world society.

Now take the disgusting term -- working poor. --- the arrogant, pompous self back slappers answers are:

a. get a better job
b. get a second job
c. should have chosen a better job
d. go to college
e. should have went to college for something else
f. work harder

but SOMEONE has to do those low pay jobs. and the above mentioned group are like the most obedient dogs in a pack, willing to try and jump the highest for the dangling treat. Never noticing the hand holding the treat is MANIPULATING the entire endeavor. There isnt enough treat to go around, no matter how hard the dogs jump/push/fight over it. One dog will get the treat the others WON'T.

Now, the dog that gets it, prances or struts away and looks upon the others in self indignation all the while saying to itself " Im better, I worked harder and deserve it, they are lazy/worthless/deserving of not having the treat. They aren't as good as me. Maybe if they just jump harder"

the greedy rich at the top KNOW how to keep the dogs distracted from the SCAM, the rich KNOW the dogs will jump and jump every time they see the treat, forgetting EVERYTHING else around them, just focused on getting the treat.

But, do ALL dogs need food? YES. so, is the SOLUTION

a. keep fighting for ever smaller and lesser treats OR b. use a few brain cells and FORCE the HAND to GIVE MORE TREATS

reply to post by MasterOfTheDamned

Actually it's still that way now. I have seen it several times in the last 10 years, and you are making this an F VS M thing with every post i've read from you.

why are you butting in on a comment NOT even remotely directed to you or because of you? Couldn't find anyone else you thought stupid enough to pick on or for all your bssssss?

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan


I agree with you, we pay far too much in taxes, and get far too little in return.

I have another term for employer paid taxes that go on top of an employees wages. It is a hidden tax.

An employer can't hire a guy and pay his wages and the employer/hidden tax that must be paid in addition to the workers salary, unless the employee made enough money to cover both his wages, the hidden taxes, not to mention associated costs like facilities, and everything else the employer must pay out to keep that employee working. It is a symbiotic relationship, at least in a smaller business.

If employer paid taxes were counted the way they should be, as taxes on the worker, then the tax rate paid by the average worker would be recognized as being much higher than advertised, and that goes for the amount of money paid into FICA.

Our welfare system is set up the way the rich want it to be set up, so that their propagandist minions can blame all the problems of the country on the poor.

Bring the troops back home, stop spending huge amounts of money on supporting the corporate empire, and put the money back into rebuilding our economy.

We could all be working 20 hour weeks, and living much better, have everything we have now and more, and anyone who knows how much our productivity has increased knows this. Then we could be spending more time with our families, our loved ones and our friends.

Ok, some of us would like a large garage to do some R&D for ourselves.

aightism2
In England benefits total 5 billion a year... however corporate tax avoidance costs britian over 25 billion in lost revenue a year

The costs of benefits are much greater than just the amount paid to the scroungers. For example, housing benefit pushes up rents. So not only do a lot of my taxes go to keeping unemployed "poor" people in a nicer house than I live in, but I also spend twice as much in rent since the hand-outs distort the rental market. I can't buy a house because of the competition from people on "help-to-buy" benefits, etc.

However, corporate tax avoidance keeps my expenses down. We pay 25 billion pounds less than otherwise for goods and services, thanks to the tireless efforts of the heroic tax accountants in these firms. Plus, this amount can be doubled because it also means that the bureaucrats, tax creditors, housing parasites and so on have 25 billion fewer pounds to use against us.

reply to post by StormyStars


I am sorry I whined so much at you. I had even starred a few of your posts on the previous pages. After a few 12 hr. night shifts and little sleep because of all the yard mowing and chain saws and wood chippers cleaning up still from the last ice storm I get tired and sometimes cranky and other times more emotional than usual. I am sorry if I hurt you by saying you were mean and all.
I do however get sad that I didnt have kids and to see someone type that without kids , if your not a Dr., teacher, etc you are just wasting space, it hurt. Believe me in casual conversations when asked if I have kids and I say none of my own , people give you strange looks sometimes and sometimes I do feel like a loser because I don't have any with my own dna in them. It just struck me hard. My better half on here robin022 has two awesome boys from a previous marriage I wish were mine but they are grown and don't live here.
Anyway on topic, it is rough out there and I feel bad for so many people out of work or unable to work due to disability. I can see shame in many of their eyes and know that most of them would really love to have a job and are good hard workers. The pitiful amount of money I know for a fact goes to someone very close to me for disability is so very small. She is very independant minded and very smart and is embarassed for being on disability and would give anything to have her body work so she would not have to take anything from society.
I know there are some people out there who scam and it makes all the others who do need it look bad and feel bad about themselves.

I was a very small business owner and know from first hand how hard it is to pay all overhead and exspences and all the other things that an owner has to pay for their workers that many workers don't even know about or consider. I think they would pay more if they had less of a tax burden and restrictions on them. The big dogs though who have ceos and executives making many hundreds or thousands times more than the average employee in there company is a big problem.

Government is also way too big with way to many employees and redundant departments. The military spends way too much in too many conflicts that we have no business being in. There are too many ways our bloated government and the big banks and corps that sway or control them blow our money that is the big problem with our debt right now , not the poor and down trodden that need help.

If we could get rid of alot of our spying programs that spy on us citizens, the war instigators, the wasteful spenders in congress , and get the big big corps and the big banks to back off on the greed and spread the wealth around a bit , our poverty problem might be able to get fixed or at least alleviated greatly.

Sorry again for wearing my heart on my sleeve. Lets just all learn to converse with each other in constructive ways and not beat each other up. After all we are all the small fry on here and the elite richest of the rich just love when the dogs at the bottom of the pile fight each other over scraps.

2. Absent dads are the problem. Sixty percent of low-income dads see at least one of their children daily. Another 16 percent see their children weekly.* - See more at: www.abovetopsecret.com...

Seeing your children and supporting them financially are two different things. You can have a dozen kids and see them every day, but if you do not support them financially, then the taxpayers will have to.

ketsuko


This is part of the problem with kids going to college. Who in their right mind gets a degree in Women's Studies and expects to walk away with a high paying job? There are lots of "trash" degrees you can get at University where the professional fields you can expect to go into are very restrictive, so your odds of getting work in them are very poor (see OWS). Additionally, thanks to the unending hikes in college tuition, there are also very few college degrees that do offer immediate work in your degree field where you can expect to immediately make a good return on your investment.

In fact, most of the only really solid degree investments left are in the STEM fields these days, so if your son or daughter isn't going for one of those ... maybe you should explore other options for post high school training.

************************* Stars!


Here here!


I got my degree in Bio science and its opened many doors! In fcat too many door! There so much options open for me due to a good degree.

But I have friends who decided to get a degree in mumbo jumbo study's (cause it was easier) and then moan why they are still working in Mc Donalds!

Sorry not all degrees are the same. A Bsc in Mathematics will always trump a MA in social studies.

Want a Degree only get it in these areas.

Mathematics
Physics
Biology
Chemistry
Engineering
Medicine
Dentistry
Veterinary medicine
Law
History
English Literature.
Architecture

All grantee a job even if its just teaching which is still a job! And all of them can lead on to lucrative careers.

Don't waste your time or money on the other crap.

hammanderr
I love when someone complains that a corporation avoided taxes and insinuates that that's the same as a worthless layabout collecting benefits. Go to a crappy neighborhood and take a look at all the grown men hangin out in the middle of the day, doin nothin. It isn't the government or a corporations job to come down there and hire them, it's their job to fix their life. The way it's always been. 40 acres and a mule, your land to toil on, nothing more, no healthcare, no free money. No jobs in your area? Move, no money?, Be resourceful, bust your hump. Move to North Dakota and work in the booming oil industry. Move somewhere, do something.

Who in their right mind lays around and expects to be taken care of? I wake up every day early, before 5 often, I work. That's how you survive. If you're broke, work harder. Have kids? Figure something out, why is your life anyone else's problem?

40 acres along with a pet mule?? where do I apply??
oh they don't offer that anymore?? what a shame you could be very much more self sufficient if you had some fertile land to put to use instead of a just a tiny apartment in an apartment complex!
actually I am quite happy where I am now. got a nice garden spot with alot more land that could tilled and put to use along with more land for chickens!
oh I don't work at the moment and am up 4:30 everyday to get hubby off to work and manage to keep myself busy most of the day..

anybody ever sit back and just imagine what would happen if the gov't did cut all assistance programs??
Would employers suddenly find their employees and families sleeping in cars in their parking lot in the morning?
Wonder if they would have to lower their expectations? Ya know the idea that you have to have a doctor's excuse to call in sick a day... The need to be attached to a phone 24/7 so they can call you in at a moment's notice.. ect

If we dropped social security would we find our local taxes going up because all those senior volunteers working within our gov't finds that they can no longer provide free labor? not to mention the ones working in our hospitals and other areas?

would employers be forced to take from those who they have favor in over and over and provided raises year after year so that they could keep those easily replaceable warm bodies warm??

would landlords be forced to settle for less in rent??

or would we be faced with hungry mobs in the streets raiding and looting?

many of us has pointed out that society does have a need for those warm bodies to do what they do! and if americans don't have children then the only alternative is for the gov't to import more people which we have come to learn can be a security threat. I don't think there are many amoung us that would like to live in india and bath in their polluted rivers or china breathing their smog! And even if we could shield ourselves from that we wouldn't enjoy the atmosphere that that kind of proverty would create!
We found slavery as being distasteful and it was done away with leaving only women as the only viable replacement since they had men t o support them and then when women began to demand the same wages as men for the same work we had to find another solution welfare for the working poor and immigrants out the arse
all of these we are finding cause unforeseen problems
all because we can't find value in those warm easily replaceable bodies!

LucidLucinda
reply to post by soficrow

 

I would take a gander that most "poor" are the working poor. Sad that I work 40 hours a week and sometimes have to decide if I want to eat or pay my rent. Lots of corn out of the can for dinner, and I work full time.

Sorry to pick on you Lucinda, but I see some irony here. If you are forced to choose either rent or dinner out of a can, why do you have either internet service or the time to even be here?

reply to post by savagediver

Anyway on topic, it is rough out there and I feel bad for so many people out of work or unable to work due to disability. I can see shame in many of their eyes and know that most of them would really love to have a job and are good hard workers. The pitiful amount of money I know for a fact goes to someone very close to me for disability is so very small. She is very independant minded and very smart and is embarassed for being on disability and would give anything to have her body work so she would not have to take anything from society.
I know there are some people out there who scam and it makes all the others who do need it look bad and feel bad about themselves.

1st off you were not whiny, just hurt, I re read my replies to you & I WAS harsh on you.
I am not usually like that.
2ndly, my late parents had a huge family business, very huge.
It was only ever run by my late Dad or my late Mom or by me or all 3 of us at busy times like hunters, tourists, rodeos, etc......so I DO understand where you stand now.
The only times we were in the black just enough, was during those times otherwise we were usually in the red.
People not in businesses thought we were rich & would give them free anything.
We learned the hard way who were true friends.
It hurt.
When taxes came, it was Hel, when insurance were due, it was Hell...We paid 3 different taxes and 2 types of insurance.When I'd been a child and it was THEE, " Spot." it was not as bad but mainly, we just kept ourselves above water. We all worked other jobs to keep all stabe. our home was in the massive building & it seemed we got dinged at every corner. When my ate Dad HAD to retire due to his coingenital heart defect, he offered to just hand it over to me. I said no, that I wouldn't make my children to be raised the way I was. I told him to sell to the highest offer & move a town over where the Hospital is. I made the right choice as it is now a ghost town. My ex was mad about my decision till my Dad & I showed him all records and papers showing why we each had other jobs, & he found out he'd actually have to work he said, " F that!" I also managed or was supervisor for the places I did work away from home. Taxman bad lol! But I am now your friend, I mean the same as her...only I try others things from home as unless famous, authors barely get paid well. We have to pay more than we get till we get that # 1 to sellers list.....I feel like your friend as it was not our choices, certainly not mine at my age, being so off on the future. On the bright side, I will soon have my Ozone Therapy clinic. Well you're sort of a Dad maybe a Grandpa soon if not already.....teach them how to avoid poverty..... and I wish you blessings & many joys to come..... Heres to our golden years......Text Blue www.youtube.com...

reply to post by lynxpilot

LucidLucinda
reply to post by soficrow



I would take a gander that most "poor" are the working poor. Sad that I work 40 hours a week and sometimes have to decide if I want to eat or pay my rent. Lots of corn out of the can for dinner, and I work full time.


Sorry to pick on you Lucinda, but I see some irony here. If you are forced to choose either rent or dinner out of a can, why do you have either internet service or the time to even be here?

Rude much?
!stly, She said " Sometimes. "
2ndly, internet & having a computer is a great distraction, and a learning 1.
Did she say," Or pay the Cable or other luxury items?"
No.
Most likely does not have cable or maybe she acquired her computer during better times or a friend gave it to her.
Oh, & here's a thought, a lot of people get free internet b/c a friend or more gives her access to their WiFi.
Anyone working that hard, deserves at least one small luxury or maybe she does a lot of work on it to stay up one step on work.
You should know the facts before Judging. Pfft!

reply to post by StormyStars


Firstly, I didn't judge, I just brought up an irony. Nextly, I speak from the experience of not knowing where the next meal was coming from or if I could pay rent. That was while I was going through university to get a degree in a marketable field which was not one I was particularly interested in but was what I needed to be employed. And when I was employed, I was paying back student loans, so I wasn't much better off for several years. And I did without any luxury, because I didn't have the entitlement attitude and didn't feel particularly that I 'deserved' any.

reply to post by lynxpilot


That word again "deserve", like the need for food is a choice. I hope we all don't get what we really deserve. Letting innocent children in US go hungry in the guise of "we can't afford it, they deserve it". But we always find money for killing don't we? We deny medical care, food, shelter, we buy guns, jets, drones, technology and send them to foreign countries to kill each other.

Almost like it is a big deliberate design to turn all of human kind into murderers. No wonder serial killers are taking over the streets and the globe.

"There will be no one to save with the world in a grave".

Poverty is the lack of money to buy the basic needs. This is through the lack of a job.The lack of work could be through many things including a lack of education, and in some cases, just a lack of he will to work.

We need to get to the root of the problem, you have to get him OFF welfare and into circulation.

"Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day, teach a man to fish and you feed him for life." -

HanzHenry

Now take the disgusting term -- working poor. --- the arrogant, pompous self back slappers answers are:

I don't think many of these are correct....

a. get a better job
I agree with this, but this should be a life's goal to always improve yourself in skill and education so that each decade you do better.

b. get a second job
This gets you no where fast....this might be for a short time to overcome something, but this will stagnate and kill you in the end.

c. should have chosen a better job
Not good either, this goes with "a". Not too many people that are doing well today can say they never had a crappy job.

d. go to college
A big NO. This lie is not so much from the OPs targeted group, but from colleges themselves. Kids today are told by our own education system that all you need is a degree and life will be good. They forgot to tell those kids that unless the degree is marketable one..i.e. engineering and others like that, their degree can get them a job at Burger King.

e. should have went to college for something else.
Big YES, or better yet don't go to college at all, get a skill job. A large majority of people are not smart enough for real college so they go to a water down college and get a water down degree that relates to nothing in the working force.... The colleges say thank you, and slaps a 50k debt on them and they get nothing out of it in the end. Does anyone here not think that companies know what is a good degree and what is not worth the paper it is printed on?

I had a Plummer come to my house and he charged me $230 an hour, I make a lot less than that per hour and I have degrees and he didn't...Hmmmm

f. work harder
SHHHhhhh....Work smarter is the secret to it all....... When a person finally figures this out they do well in life.

but SOMEONE has to do those low pay jobs. and the above mentioned group are like the most obedient dogs in a pack, willing to try and jump the highest for the dangling treat. Never noticing the hand holding the treat is MANIPULATING the entire endeavor. There isnt enough treat to go around, no matter how hard the dogs jump/push/fight over it. One dog will get the treat the others WON'T.

Yes someone does, but people should not spend a life's career in a low paying job...One big problem is we are all consumers that want to live like a rock star. I agree that wages should be raised across the board some, but the big problem is people spend too much and live on credit that kills them.

I see too many making 25k a year but live a 40k lifestyle, or make 50k and live a 80k lifestyle, or make 100k and live a 150k lifestyle.... this is what is beat into everyone's heads....

Corporate welfare IS the problem.
(otherwise known as fascism)

What we need is a war on wealth since the war on poverty only produces more of the same.

reply to post by ketsuko


Ketsuko, I know this is a bounce off from your post, but it is directed to other readers, because I agree with you.

I say this, if people really want to see exactly what is going on, go visit public housing.

People that are cohabitating but have children together and one person is working, their income should be reported. Very often it is not and very often the other parent is receiving food stamps and welfare for children, even though the other parent's income is not reported.

That's called "playing the system".

While a vast majority of people who live on Social Security Disability are really disabled, being pregnant is not a disability. And if you are totally disabled, then you should not be able to work "under the table" and get a paycheck from the government.

That's called "playing the system".

Every state has its own cost of living index. California's poverty rate is different than Indiana's. But with the vast majority of illegal immigrants working in places that previously whites and blacks worked at and many illegal immigrants are working for businesses that do not report their status or take taxes out, then what is the incentive to hire whites or blacks who know how much they should be paid?

That's called "playing the system".

Yes, there are quite a lot of system players out there and just go to public housing in any city and you will see this is true. But also, in public housing, drug dealers certainly don't report their incomes while their children by different mothers aren't getting child support.

Do people even know how much money is in the drug trade?

That's called "playing the system".

I see this every day. People have even suggested to me how to play the system, because I am a disabled person who was forced by economic reasons to live in public housing. When I learned that there were fundamental differences in our mentalities, it makes me angry. And not only does it make me angry but also the elderly women who live here who worked all their adult lives and watch these young people use every excuse to play the system.

I worked, I was removed from the workforce because of an actual disability, not because I was pregnant, not because I am "bipolar" not because of "my back hurts but I won't see what's wrong, get pain meds from the doctor and then sell them". Then while you who are working and your taxes taken out to support me (but I paid into the system), you are also support scroungers. I see it every day.

I refused to get the free Obama phone. But you are paying people who sit at home all day and watch Spongebob Squarepants while you are working. That isn't fair to you. But you didn't pay me to sit around all day doing nothing, you pay for my housing and my medication, that I am responsible for taking and not selling. BTW, when you pay someone for their pain meds, then they sell their pain meds, they are getting more than double than what you paid for them. You are getting screwed by them.

But here is what I say, a girl under 18 years-old that has children should be getting help, but that help should also be in helping her achieve a good education. But let's stop encouraging young girls to have babies.

Real solutions:

Young men need to work.
Young women should be valued more.
Babies are not meal tickets.
No one gets pain meds without being required to seek medical help to fix their "sore backs". (How does a non-worker even get a sore back in the first place).
Even if you can't find a job you are skilled at, at least take lower jobs until you find a better one.
Stop the influx of illegal immigration.
Stop drug deals in public housing, stop buying drugs, period.
Report all income in your house.
Don't work under the table if you are supposed to be disabled, your working causes a person who needs a job not to be able to get one.
Have a work ethic.
Stop playing the system.

reply to post by supermouse

However, corporate tax avoidance keeps my expenses down. We pay 25 billion pounds less than otherwise for goods and services, thanks to the tireless efforts of the heroic tax accountants in these firms.

Heroic tax accountants? Heroic bean counters?

Do you really think those corporate tax beaks go into lower prices?

OR, to bigger bonuses?