10 Poverty Myths, Busted

reply to post by ScreenBogey


A few things went wrong but I think the biggest issue was that people were trying to live beyond their means.

I know a few family members who thought that if they made 100.000 a year they can buy a 400.000 dollar house and some high end cars and not think about the future, now they are broke some with their kids had to move back home with their parent/grandparents and they have the balls to blame the government.

buster2010

ScreenBogey
The last time I was in the USA I went to NY. I was shocked at the homeless families walking around with suitcases. Richest country in the world. What went wrong?

We let the elite buy the government and throw our humanity out the door in favor of profit for the few.

Yeah, you're right. Greed is like alcoholism. They can't get enough money and become deluded. In the Victorian era, the wealthy convinced themselves the beggars on the street were faking it and had money. Only the poor helped them because they understood poverty is real. The rich do the same in Morocco now. They convince themselves that the people living in the streets in boxes have money really. Perhaps it's a mechanism to get round their conscience. After all, the most evil people like to think of themselves as good people. They alter their view of reality to justify their wickedness.

I wish the best to all of you who have compassion for our fellow creatures. Good luck to you.

soficrow
Great article and compilation with valid sources.

10. Handouts are bankrupting us. In 2012, total welfare funding was 0.47 percent of the federal budget.

I can't believe a so-called academic uses this lame trick - by isolating the figure to "welfare" (TANF) and "federal", it manages to miss the fact that TANF is only a relatively small component of the programs people obtain benefits from, and that many programs, while federally mandated, are funded by the "states" - so, saying, "See, federal spending on this one program is small" is true - but not very honest, either.

As I said, most non-working poor are beneficiaries of multiple systems, such as (with some estimates of spending):

SNAP - $89B
EITC Payments - $60B, plus many states also include their own EITC programs
Medicaid/CHIP - $431B, federal share, states pick up 1/4 to 1/3 of the cost
SSI - $54B
Low-income energy assistance $3B
Unemployment - $66B
Federal housing assistance - $270B, including $17B for Housing Choice Vouchers
Pell Grants - $35B
TANF - $16B
Disability - $144B

Not to mention the truly large elephants in the room, Social Security and Medicare. We spend over 60% of the budget on benefits programs - so, yeah, spare me stuff like "0.5%".

I'm not arguing the need for these programs (though I'm quite sure they're rife with fraud) - but spare me from people who say "We don't spend enough on the poor - no one's getting rich on $150/month in food stamps" - which is true, but people take advantage of multiple programs, like the woman on tv who had two kids, both of whom were classified as "disabled" because of "learning" difficulties - she was paid like a "nurse" to take care of her kids as well, so she was receiving over $4000/month in cash assistance, plus food stamps, Medicaid, some program where she could go to school, child care while she went to classes, and lived in a low-income single-family home - oh yeah, and she drove a Suburban.

Halfswede


Very true! However, I want to elaborate on some things you have said. Going to college is not necessary to get somewhere. It helps in a lot of fields and may be required for some, but there are a lot of good blue-collar jobs that pay more than many white collar jobs (plumber, electrician, etc.). The key is, you can't just lay there and expect some miracle to pick you up and give a life with money. If you screwed around in school and can't spell or do basic math, you NEED to fix that. You cannot sit there without the skills needed by the higher paying jobs and blame the world if you have not done what it takes to make yourself skilled. Hard work IS a must if you want to get somewhere and aren't born into it and sometimes that work is on yourself.

There are several things that can be done for free that will help improve one's chances for getting ahead. Some may disagree, but there are unwritten rules for things as simple as haircuts that can significantly lower you chances of having a good job if you choose no to follow them.

Here is my short list. Like it or not, these things will affect your chances and are choices, not big corporate america keeping you down.

Life is not that black and white.

1. Can't read/do math/didn't pay attention in school. Fix it. Anyone can learn anything on their own. A single misspelling in a resume can get it tossed.

50% of people have IQ less than 100 out of whom 34.1% are between 85 and 100, while 1 in 7 has an IQ between 70 and 85. Of course, many would say IQ does not matter, although up to certain point it does. To become a specialist in near to anything, one needs to have certain brain "processing" power or some other incredibly talent (musical, physical etc). A person with an IQ of 75 will possibly never be able to fully comprehend concepts of higher mathemathics. Their brains are simply too slow for it. They are able to live on their own, although they will probably need assistance from friends/family/significant other in making their taxes, bills etc. Getting to the top in near to anything will be near to impossible due to the very slow learning speed. It impossible to compete against people, who are able to think and pick up things really fast. In 6 hours, a high-IQ person might learn a thing, which for a low-IQ person might take a year, if they are ever able to grasp the concepts. I will not even go to decision-making processes. Bad decisions are very common among such people, if they are doing these on their own. Reaching even low-level management is near to impossible. A leader, even for a small group, needs to able to think fast, make smart decisions based on current data etc.

Also health-issues have to be considered in. Many very common diseases lead to exhaustedness as well as having really tough time taking initiative in anything or even concentrating on anything. Thyroid problems, adrenal gland issues, many physical disorders etc. Without being on medications, which can be very expensive, living like that can lead to lots of issues, especially job-wise and affect thinking process, which can lead to not recognising the problem. Expecting a person with an ADHD to focus the whole day on some process is not realistic.

2. Learn a trade or tradeable skill. All kinds of trades out there only require the will to learn and steady hands. Others may require learning to use Microsoft office instead of just Facebook

. The point is, you may have to work for it, but there are always new skills to be had. Even if you are currently just a receptionist or lower-tier employee, if you show you have the skills to do more and take the initiative to do more, you will find more opportunities.

Again the previous answer, there other things that matter also. Not everybody is given the talent to learn even Office-like program. Also time has to be considered. Many low-tier jobs require putting in overtime or getting a second job in order to get by, due to no living wage existing. When the workweeks are 50 or even more hours long, a person is probably very tired in the weekend, which leads to not having enough energy to anything but rest during the weekends.

3. Don't smoke. It's your choice, but the minute you smell up the office during your interview, it can be over. You are stacking the deck against you.
Having a dead end job, other issues in life lead to an overwhelming stress, which not people are able to deal with. For some it leads to severe depression, some find some way to deal with it. One thing that many might do is starting smoking. Smoking creates an illusion of stress relief... How one is able to deal with stress is largely dependent on previous experiences as well as their physical condition, hormonal levels. For example, cortisole, the stress hormone is the hormone which helps bodies dealing with extra stress. I can state it that every high-level employee has naturally good stress tolerance.

4. Piercings, weird hair, "cool " clothes/hats/shoes. Again, it is your choice, but the person who shows up wearing neat clothes, no crap stuck in their face, etc. will generally pass you by in any higher paying career. If you just have to have that neck tattoo, remember it is a choice that helps keep you in the "lower" class. Nothing is absolute, it just stacks the deck.

That is something I can not personally argue with, although there are many psychological factors as well, which explains one´s choice of clothing.

5. If you have money for coffee/data plan/tattoos/cable tv/xbox/new rims/quad/guns/cigs/beer/the movies (you get the point), then you HAVE money for rent, car insurance, good food, clothes for your kid, maybe money for college. If you smoke and can't afford clothes for your kid, you are just a bad parent who chooses some crap over their kid. Lots of people spend $100/mo or more on cigarettes or booze. You can't claim poor when you would have had $1200 in your hands at Christmas.

People with lower intelligence are more likely to do worse decisions and not understand the concept of compund effect. Small costs add up a lot in the long run... Although of course, many are just too comfy to make any changes in their lives.

Those are just a few things that can stack the deck against you. I know lots of people will say "I should be able to wear what I want and do what I want". You are right, you can. It is is a choice. Just can't claim that there is no way to get ahead unless you work hard to get the obstacles out of your way first. There are no guarantees, and some people just have hard lives, but you can't just fall down and lay there without trying to get back up.

I sincerely hope nobody felt like I was ranting about poor people. I have worked my way from nothing to a college degree/respectable income and career, so I know the process and I know what decisions I made that hurt and helped. I think some people just get stuck and lose the will to unstack the deck or even try, but that is still a choice.

I am glad for you. Although I would say, you should be happy that you have blessed with certain talents. If you had an IQ of 80 as well as some psychological disorder/physicial condition, I highly doubt you would have made it.Most people, who have become successful, take such things as granted. They believe it is only themselves who got to the top, that everybody has the same opportunities is simply naive. There are too many outside factors, which are able to influence people´s lives a lot without themselves even knowing it, especially genetical preconditions.

Here´s what Boris Johnson, mayor of London said about highly successful people he knows:

(1) They tend to be well above average, if not outstanding, in their powers of mathematical, scientific or at least logical reasoning. (2) They have a great deal of energy, confidence, risk-taking instinct and a desire to make money. (3) They have had the good fortune – by luck or birth – to be able to exploit these talents.

www.telegraph.co.uk...

Nearly every single one of these points is vastly determined by outside factors. 1) Genetic talent, as well as working on it. 2) Hormonal levels, as well as psychological factors affect these incredibly. 3) Just luck.

Everyone has been set certain potential with their genetical background. It is hard to admit, although for certain people the absolut top is set to below-average. Hard work can only realise the potential, although how high you can fly, is set by the nature.

A nice quote from Marcus Aurelius:

The man having the largest intelligence ought to be
very generous to the other. Being thankful that he has been blessed in so
many ways, he should do all in his power to enlighten his less favored
fellow, rather than be angry with him on account of his misfortune. Is he
not sufficiently punished in being denied the light?

reply to post by Halfswede


Just in addition to previous reply to you:

Of course there are many people, for whom your suggestions would work a lot, although there are just as many if not more, for whom there are other reasons that affect their lives, factors outside of their reach.

There are many lazy people out there, many free-loaders. Although most are not in reality.

Who is bigger leaches on the system the elites who can get away with anything while writing the laws to do it or the poor people who imo are the result of a broken system based on exploitation? I have looked at some number and concluded the elites level of corporate welfare far exceeds anything the poor get by a huge margin.

Greed has shipped jobs overseas and turned a nation of hard working people into depressed burger flippers or Wal-Mart employees. I am glad I was lucky enough to end up where I did and work for myself in a booming economy but I only imagine how crappy my life could be if I was born American.

In a modern civilized society a sensible welfare system is essential without one your country becomes a third world cesspit like Somalia.

Funny how those who condemn the welfare system never seem to jet off to live in a welfare free paradise like Sierra Leone anyone would think they are a bunch of spiteful, self serving, deluded, cretins

brianporter
In a modern civilized society a sensible welfare system is essential without one your country becomes a third world cesspit like Somalia.

Funny how those who condemn the welfare system never seem to jet off to live in a welfare free paradise like Sierra Leone anyone would think they are a bunch of spiteful, self serving, deluded, cretins

Could be right...

and people who desire ultra-welfare could go to havens like North Korea, Cuba, or China.

Maybe it's not a "political" problem to begin with ?

reply to post by buster2010

Looks like you are forgetting that the people that are working are also paying into the programs.

NO.

The cradle to the grave entitlement complex is well known for those who are paying attention.

From welfare, and food stamps, and that fabulous medicaid from their youth until they get to 'old age'.

Then start receiving social security, and medicare.

If they WERE PAYING IN TO THOSE PROGRAMS.

Employers would not be forced to match contributions.

Other people who hold investments would not be getting hit with 'alternative taxes'

OR medicare surtaxes on capital gains.

Which point blank is quadruple taxation.

But i forgot 'those people are paying in" !

They are not.

They get more out than they ever return in to that system to 'help' someone else..

Which is the leading cause of debt.

And which is why people have done nothing, but make those people who have been brainwashed in to thinking they can't 'survive' without 'government benevolence'.

Which is nothing more than fascism take something away from a minority to benefit the majority.

There are so many levels of stupidity here it is not even funny.

For all those supporters of 'welfare' it is time they actually put their money where there mouth is, and stop hiding behind government.

IF some people who claim to care about their fellow man so effing much.,

Start cutting a check to them personally instead of sitting back. and let government 'take care of it'.

What welfare supporters are doing is guaranteeing them 'evil' corporations income for life.

reply to post by StormyStars

And you ended up on Ats where now you will take your vengeance out on the male members.

Alas no Elvar, I respect MOST men & appreciate the hard work MOST men do, as well as I just flat out really like MOST men lol!
I've never been in love though, I was in an arranged marriage to the youngest son of an Anglican Minister, I found out how horrible & fastidious his wife & children were.
We married when I was 15, after 6 years of every kind of abuse you can think off was done to me by him, I never knew ANYONE could be like that.
But, when I had an awesome high paying construction job, I was going to move around with them till on a cattle run, became so ill, he told his niece I was pregnant.
I was mad at his niece for spreading around what I had thought was another of his tasteless jokes for I was so positive that that just could not be, I didn't know he, ' had a feeling I was going to walk.'
He'd messed with my birth control pills plus 2 other methods of prophylactic things I'd used to make sure that couldn't happen but I began being sick all day every day, I went from 90 lbs to 70 lbs & so I went to a Dr. & he confirmed I was pregnant.....I felt so defeated. So when my 2 girls were born, I tried my hardest to make it work and 1st got my Registered Nursing before constantly upping my medical training.
But when he began his non working er...self & start his sadistic behavior on our girls, I gained the strength to walk.
He tried to prevent the divorcee by not signing till I brought Policemen, Social services workers, 2 Dr. s, witnesses to his sadistic actions + ALL the women he'd tried to get & the ones he did, including a sadistic B who was only 18, had 5 little children, the baby she killed by sticking him in a tub of boiling water.
Which she was back home after 1 day of jail, then was released AND given respite care so she could go out & make more.
The Judge ordered him to sign, gave me 100% sole custody, & even ordered him no visitation at all, but I said that with supervised visitation, I wanted the girls to know their Dad.
So when he got out of jail he was able to visit the girls as long as there was a Cop or Social Worker with him.
His sisters did the same to their now ex-husbands as he'd done to me.
But my best friends from birth are 3 males & 1 female.
They say that in a lifetime, there are only true friends one can't count on 1 hand, usually 3. I'm fortunate to have 4, 3 of whom are males,
I was only attempting to get you to see both sides of the genders as none of it is as cut & dried as the OP's stats or what most people on this thread have been stating, except for the poor doggy avatar person y'all have picked on enough already.
If you can't see my points, then you are as bad as my ex, who I've been divorced from 21 years February 15th 2014. AND as bad as his sisters.
You've no idea the degrees I now have OR what I've seen going on during my active years, in which I would hand in up to 298 hours of work for a 2 week span until struck with MS.
The ex NEVER did pay a cent for our daughters yet tried to sue me for maintenance for leaving him so he wouldn't have to work, on the 5th Judge by then, the Judge laughed & threw it out with a threat if the ex tried any further games, he'd personally see him go to jail longer than the 2 years he was supposed to have served but with Mommy's money, was out in 6 months.
I did love his Father though who was one of the finest, most honorable man I'd ever had the pleasure of knowing who'd been of the same intellect as I was, may he & my parents now rest in peace......

The cradle to the grave entitlement complex is well known for those who are paying attention.

From welfare, and food stamps, and that fabulous medicaid from their youth until they get to 'old age'.

Then start receiving social security, and medicare.

You are just making up stuff. None of what you said is true....

The only time you get welfare is if you have children and even then most states today have a limit on the number of years you can receive welfare benefits.

If you are over 18 with no kids or all your children are grown - you don't get assistance.

And the only way you can get social security is if you worked for a number of years. If you didn't work, you don't get benefits.

This might be a well known rumor by upper middle class people but it's certainly not a fact.