Croatian Constitutional Court Upholds Mandatory Child Vaccination

I have 3 kids and after a lengthy discussion with our doctor we decided to get most of the vaccines. We opted out of the chicken pox and flu vaccines but the other vaccines we just felt were the right thing to do. The whole ordeal caused me quite a great deal of stress but after much time has passed and my kids seem healthy I think we made the right choice.

For all I am a conspiracy theorists type person I do admire the progress medicine has made in eliminating a lot of things that killed us so easily not to long ago.

reply to post by FriedBabelBroccoli

A body rejected by the WHO is producing vaccines for decades and you are okay with that?

I never said I was or wasn't.

You do realize this is the same government running the facility in partnership with private interests that just declared the mandatory vaccination schedule after its corporation couldn't find enough investors?

That is what the articles say.

I am curious if you are aware of the current WHO license status of these other vaccine producers?

I haven't looked into it. Aside from trying to find out if there was another manufacturer in Croatia. I do know China has 36 vaccine manufacturers that produce 49 types of vaccines against 27 diseases which last I read they were eligible to apply for WHO pre-qualification.

If so, why not produce your source and set a good example?

You are talking about each country for their own I am guessing?? It may have something to do with vaccine shortages that I have read about or maybe not all countries have the facilities to make their own. I did read that they exported to countries including Argentina, Burkina Faso, Egypt, Mexico, the Philippines and Vietnam. After doing a search I didn't get any hits for vaccine manufacturers in those countries for the vaccines that were made in Croatia. It may be a combination of reasons one of which is the 7.156 billion people on earth(and counting) so as you can see the demand is high.

This map shows the world divided into 7 sections (each with a distinct color) with each section containing 1 billion people.

reply to post by Grimpachi


So you don't know where these mandatory vaccines are being manufactured or by who and yet your are applauding the mandate?

Now you are switching the subject to China which is entirely off topic?

For what purpose are you drastically changing course now?

Deny ignorance.

-FBB

reply to post by FriedBabelBroccoli


This has been an unedifying display from you. Caught in what appears to be a lie, you've responded with aggression and insinuations that the people discussing with you are saying things they patently are not.

It doesn't inspire much confidence in your self-described expertise.

reply to post by Leonidas

ATS is a better place than this and will be a better place again when behaviour and decorum makes a return to it's rightful place as a guiding principle.

Yes great advise, one should listen to ones own advise.

Have you ever heard of the saying don't throw stones when you live in a glass house?
There is another,
First remove the plank in your own eye before removing the splinter in someone else's.

Really, just

Sorry if I hurt your feelings. I would be happy to apologize for any perceived slights.

7.156 billion people on earth(and counting) so as you can see the demand is high.

reply to post by Grimpachi



I can not see where you supplied any supporting evidence to this very ridiculous claim of yours above.

Demand is high, Ha.

Don't you mean the deliberate assault is being pushed by many over enthusiastic power hungry nut jobs who disregard the peoples right to choose what they put in their bodies?

reply to post by Leonidas


No, my feelings are fine.

One thing I'd like to ask you, do you have an alert bell to your user name being replied to?

Just asking because that was fast

The general public is essentially unaware of the true number of people -- mostly children -- who have been permanently damaged or killed by vaccines. In fact, most parents would be surprised to learn that the government has a secret computer database filled with several thousand names of disabled and dead babies, children who were healthy and alive just prior to receiving the vaccines. Of course, the medical establishment and federal government don't readily disclose this information because they know it's likely to frighten parents into seeking other ways to protect their children. In other words, parents just might think this issue through on their own and decide to reject the shots.

A deeper look into Individual vaccines


The above link is Individual Vaccines: Click on the link to investigate specific vaccines. A summary of pertinent information, including a description of the disease, plus uncensored vaccine safety and efficacy data.

Secret government information vaccines damaging children link

The link above is Secret Government Database
of Vaccine-Damaged Children

And so much more.

! ! E N O U G H ! !

The bickering, accusations of lying or fabricating facts WILL STOP RIGHT HERE.

The suggestions that another member cannot read or cannot grasp something WILL STOP RIGHT HERE.

We've been patient and we've tried to avoid turning attention to acting in the hopes it would settle.

It Hasn't.

The next post on this thread that references another member and does so in a negative way to degrade, ridicule or otherwise insult them will result in an immediate post ban. For the record, there are not set times on post bans. There never have been.

Review these links and the policies they explain. It will help avoid ongoing problems.

No more scoffing and ridicule...

YOU are responsible for your posts.

Courtesy Is Mandatory

Go after the ball, NOT the Player

Please continue with the debate. It's always an interesting one and I'm not alone in watching this one for interest, not action or working it. I'd like to see how the points play out for discussion. If people can drop the personal nature of it, there is no reason that can't run it's course.

Thank you for your attention.

-Wrabbit2000

reply to post by FriedBabelBroccoli

So you don't know where these mandatory vaccines are being manufactured or by who

I have not come across an srticle which has given that information if you have it would be pertinent to post. Considering the articles have stated the manufacturer in Croatia has been authorised to start manufacturing some vaccines that probably means they are having to look outside their country to supplement their supply. Would you agree?

and yet your are applauding the mandate?

Have I?

Now you are switching the subject to China which is entirely off topic?

For what purpose are you drastically changing course now?

You asked the question of:

I am curious if you are aware of the current WHO license status of these other vaccine producers? www.abovetopsecret.com...

Since I looked up if the countries they export vaccines to seem to be lacking in their own manufacturing of vaccines the idea that Croatia may be supplementing their vaccine stocks with ones from China is possible so no I do not think it is off topic at all to give you the information on their WHO license status in line with your question. That being said it is not an attempt to switch the subject to China.

In fact why are you switching the subject from Croation mandated vaccines to vaccine manufacturers? Isn't this thread about the ruling?

Since 1999, Croatia has had compulsory nationwide inoculations, which have found great success. According to government estimates, "No occurrences of diphtheria, whooping cough (pertussis), measles, parotitis and poliomyelitis often called polio or infantile paralysis have been registered in recent years, while tetanus rates have been reduced by 97%, tuberculosis by 93% and hepatitis B, with mandatory vaccination against this disease introduced in 1999, by 65%."....................................................................................................................................
The ruling: Now the court has put that argument to rest by ruling that these private concerns don't supersede public safety. "The child's right to health is more than the rights of parents to the (wrong) choice," the court wrote in its ruling. All children must now receive shots for DPT (diphtheria, pertussis, tetanus), polio, haemophilus influenza B, MMR (measles, mumps and rubella) and tuberculosis.

This could seem like some kind of communist-based instance of a nanny-state government taking away parental controls, but there's a perfectly logical explanation: vaccines are really only effective when there's "herd immunity," or an overwhelming majority of a population that is inoculated. Because vaccines are not 100% effective, there is always a small risk of infection even after a person receives a shot. But that risk shrinks more and more as other people are also vaccinated, since the chances of a chain infection decrease to a very low probability. policymic

A Croatian court has decreed that all children born in the country will be vaccinated against a suite of diseases, including hepatitis, measles, pertussis (whooping cough), and diphtheria, according to an announcement made yesterday (March 26) in the Croatian newspaper Večernji list. “The child’s right to health is more than the rights of parents to the (wrong) choice,” according to a Google Translate version of the article.

Mandatory vaccination for these diseases began as early as 1999, and the country has seen a dramatic drop in disease, with zero reported cases of diphtheria, pertussis, and measles in recent years, and drastic reductions in the occurrence of tetanus, tuberculosis, and hepatitis B.

But in recent years the anti-vaccine movement led to increased numbers of Croatian children not being vaccinated. Twenty-eight were not vaccinated in 2012, and 143 in 2013, prompting some 10,000 people to sign a petition stating that “the vaccination of healthy children poses a threat to their health,” according to The Hairpin.

With the court’s decision to uphold the mandate, “Croatia is setting the global standard for intelligent, evidence-based public health,” infectious-disease specialist Kent Sepkowitz of the Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer Center wrote on The Daily Beast.TheScientist

Not to go off topic but Croatia is not the only country that has mandatory vaccinations.

In Slovenia
Slovenia’s got one of the most advanced vaccination programs in the world. Babies must get immunized against nine of the deadliest infectious diseases in their first year of life.
People can’t skip shots just because they don’t agree with the policy, and anyone who dodges the law has to pay a fine. As a result, 95% of Slovenians comply with the mandatory vaccination law, making the program a major success.

Read more at www.ryot.org...

reply to post by Trollsmustdie

I can not see where you supplied any supporting evidence to this very ridiculous claim of yours above.

Demand is high, Ha.

Manufacturing problems have created shortages of a variety of vaccines around the world. Now GlaxoSmithKline ($GSK) is warning that problems at a plant in Belgium will cause a shortage of two chickenpox vaccines in the countries where they are sold. The vaccines are not sold in the U.S.

Read more: UPDATED: GSK blames chickenpox vaccine shortage on plant problems - FiercePharma Manufacturing www.fiercepharmamanufacturing.com...
Subscribe at FiercePharma Manufacturing

British travellers heading for the tropics could be halted by a worldwide shortage of vaccine against yellow fever, a disease found in destinations including Brazil and Kenya.

The Independant

The increased concern about two deadly strains of the flu virus could lead to a shortage of vaccines this year in B.C., health officials have confirmed.CBC News

Products Affected - Description

Rabies Vaccine

Reason for the Shortage

Sanofi Pasteur stated the reason for the shortage was increased demand and manufacturing delay.
Novartis could not provide a reason for this shortage.ASHP

90 countries face vaccine shortage

I am sure there are more articles, but I think you can look up the rest.

reply to post by Grimpachi


Demand for food is high, this I can work out easy enough, but who is the high demand for vaccines for, who's ordering?

I don't see 7+ billion people demanding vaccine's.

How safe is the chickenpox vaccine? The Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS), the federal organization established by Congress in 1986 to document adverse reactions to vaccines, received nearly 10,000 reports involving the chickenpox vaccine between the months of March 1995 and December 1999, a period of less than five years. The FDA and CDC studied 6,574 of these reports -- those filed between March 17, 1995 and July 25, 1998 -- and published their findings in the Journal of the American Medical Association.(19) Here is a summary of their findings: Adverse reactions in recipients of the chickenpox vaccine occurred at a rate of 67.5 reports per 100,000 doses sold. Approximately four percent of reports described "serious" adverse reactions. By FDA definition, "serious" reactions refer to deaths, life-threatening events, hospitalizations, persistent or significant disabilities, and other incidents of medical importance. For example, the data analyzed in this report included numerous cases of neurological disorders, immune system damage, blood disorders, brain inflammation, seizures, and death (Figure 1). These figures do not take into account the FDA's own admission that "potentially substantial under-reporting" made the figures "highly variable fractions of actual event numbers."(20) Nor do these figures take into account that "doses sold" (about 9.7 million through July 1998) is a CDC "projection" for which no reliable documentation can be found. Authors of the study based their figures on "oral" and private "unpublished data" from the CDC.(21,22) In some parts of the country vaccination rates are below 10 percent.(23,24) If the CDC inflated the actual number of doses sold, the true rate of adverse reactions following administration of the chickenpox vaccine is much higher. Link

For the folks who seem to think they caught me in a lie, they ought to go ahead and read through the report cited here. I shouldn't have to skim through it to select the exact paragraph for you or link to the actual document as it is simple enough to locate.

New report on corruption in health
www.who.int...

I guess I really shouldn't bother attempting to educate the folks in this thread.

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make them drink.

Deny ignorance.

-FBB

Grimpachi
Since I looked up if the countries they export vaccines to seem to be lacking in their own manufacturing of vaccines the idea that Croatia may be supplementing their vaccine stocks with ones from China is possible so no I do not think it is off topic at all to give you the information on their WHO license status in line with your question. That being said it is not an attempt to switch the subject to China.

In fact why are you switching the subject from Croation mandated vaccines to vaccine manufacturers? Isn't this thread about the ruling?

So you don't care where the vaccines come from?

Maybe the next time you go get your flu vaccine you make sure to locate one produced by a clinic that does not have World Health Organization licensing?

-FBB

I'm with you OP I agree mass vaccinations save people in the long run.
The more people that don't get their kids done harms society as a whole.

reply to post by Trollsmustdie

Demand for food is high, this I can work out easy enough, but who is the high demand for vaccines for, who's ordering?

I don't see 7+ billion people demanding vaccine's.

OK I think I see the misunderstanding.

I was not implying each and every person in the world is demanding to be vaccinated. Even from the OP there is a quote saying

The child's right to health is more than the rights of parents to the (wrong) choice.

That was said in the Croation court. So it is implied that some people wish to not vaccinate even if the choice they wish to make is the wrong one.

As you can see from the links I provided there is indeed a demand to where there are shortages.

reply to post by FriedBabelBroccoli

So you don't care where the vaccines come from?

Did I say that?

Maybe the next time you go get your flu vaccine you make sure to locate one produced by a clinic that does not have World Health Organization licensing?

To be quite honest I have never looked to see what the labels said. I get my Flu shot at the VA. I have never had the flu and I am not paranoid about what they are giving me in the shots.

No no no, where a child has been damaged or worse, killed after having any shot, the accountability should lie with the parents for neglecting their duty to investigate all avenues before consenting to such actions.

It's a backwards way of thinking To assume parents must vaccinate children.

Must is a tricky word.

Immunisation laws

FriedBabelBroccoli
For the folks who seem to think they caught me in a lie, they ought to go ahead and read through the report cited here. I shouldn't have to skim through it to select the exact paragraph for you or link to the actual document as it is simple enough to locate.

New report on corruption in health
www.who.int...

I guess I really shouldn't bother attempting to educate the folks in this thread.

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make them drink.

Deny ignorance.

-FBB

edit on 29-3-2014 by FriedBabelBroccoli because: 101

WOW that was a long interesting article on the corruption in the health industry, but I have no idea what it is supposed to corroborate. It must be from much earlier in the thread maybe I missed that post.

I think there is a legitimate concern for the things mentioned such as.

“Quantifying corruption in medicine is especially difficult because so many possible cases, like billing for unnecessary procedures, could also be put down to clinical error, or a simple mistake. There are also grey areas, such as the hospitality and funding many doctors receive from the pharmaceutical industry that may or may not be considered corruption,” Rodríguez said.