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Judge: "Washington must find rooms for homeless families out in cold"

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posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 08:35 PM
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My son, who lived in Germany for many years, told me they don't have welfare like America.

In Germany ,they give you three years to get your stuff together if you are an unemployed parent with a child. During that time you get free housing , food and an education (if you have no job). They do everything possible to help a person become self-sufficient, and at the end of three years- if you still can't take care of yourself and child (children) they become a ward of the state.

He says it works better than our system does.




posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 08:36 PM
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reply to post by Quauhtli
 


Growing up in a family on welfare also harms that child, and results in generational welfare since the kids know they can grow up and get a check too...




Academic research in the past has shown that the children of families on welfare are more likely to grow up to be on welfare themselves.
But it isn't just poverty and poor health that are causing this.

A new NBER study by Gordon Dahl of UCSD, Andreas Kostol of the University of Bergen, and Magne Mogstad finds that a parent on welfare creates a culture within the family that makes their adult children more likely to accept welfare.



Read more: www.businessinsider.com...


Another article

And another

For black children, spending middle childhood in a heavily welfare-dependent as opposed to a welfare-free home was associated with roughly one-half year less schooling and a three times higher risk of teenage childbearing.

A child growing up in a family on welfare is actively having their future negatively impacted, further proving they should be removed.

Those empty homes you talk about are still someones property, whether it be a private owner or a bank. You arent actually advocating violating the rights of the property owner and forcing homeless people into them are you?
edit on 24-3-2014 by doubletap because: (no reason given)

edit on 24-3-2014 by doubletap because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 08:52 PM
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reply to post by nugget1
 


Agreed.

Having been homeless before, and having slept in shelters, I can tell you that while they really are horrid places, they also provide food and shelter when the weather is bad. We had various churches allow us to sleep overnight in their auditoriums. Grateful I was, and all we slept on were jailhouse mats and donated blankets.

I honestly can't see how this family can say the shelter endangered their kids more than sleeping out in the cold on the streets.



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 09:01 PM
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reply to post by nugget1
 


You're missing the point, no one should have to ask for private rooms, it should be a given right... You people have forgot what government is meant to be there for, they are meant to be just administrators, that's why they call themselves administrations, and they are supposed to administer equally the resources and protection available to its people..

It's 2014 and we are still so apathetic that we can not care for an individual who has nothing... And not even an individual in a far off land, this is your country, your streets, your glorious land of the free, that was founded to escape the crippling taxation of the English Monarch (which is all BS, but most of you buy it..) and what did you do? You set up your own tax system and now also argue that it shouldn't go towards those that need it most... Just like the Kings tax, you may as well have kept paying it... Absolute joke, very few threads on ATS actually disgust me but to think that you people also think you are progressive and 'awake', well I must still be in a coma....



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 09:04 PM
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reply to post by doubletap
 



Growing up on welfare can lead to an endless vicious cycle for some, sure. But that's not what we're talking about. There are surely cases where taking the children out of a neglectful home may benefit the children.




You arent actually advocating violating the rights of the property owner and forcing homeless people into them are you?


What I'm advocating is looking at the empty homes in a given city and trying to balance that against the homeless plague thats haunting us. What I see in all of these empty homes is wasted opportunity. Jobs that need to be created for people who need them, homes that need to be maintained by folks who need them. I could probably think of a few ways of putting these jobless, homeless people to work fixing up houses that need a little love while rehabilitating broken families.

Tearing apart the families only exacerbates the problem in my eyes.

Just a couple of decades ago, that was the norm. Down and out folks paid dirt cheap rent to fix up old houses that were going to fall apart.


The reason for my first response is that it's totally insane that we have this ass backwards situation where banks are throwing people out of perfectly good houses every day and letting the houses go to derelict because they think that the best place for you to be is up to your neck in debt.

I am sure that you have all the reason in the world to feel the way you do, but I think it's wrong to start talking about taking children away from their parents just because they find themselves out on the street all of the sudden. That is not the solution to a problem that has very complicated roots, and probably didn't even start with parental neglect in most cases.



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 09:19 PM
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doubletap
More unconstitutional lunacy from the judicial branch....



WASHINGTON (Reuters) - A judge on Monday ordered the District of Columbia to provide homeless families private rooms when temperatures drop below freezing instead of housing them in public recreation centers.

The ruling by District of Columbia Superior Court Judge Robert Okun came in response to a lawsuit filed by a group of homeless people who said the housing offered by the United States capital placed their children in danger.

Washington's financial burden is outweighed by the "psychological harm of the most vulnerable members of our society, the children of the homeless" if they are denied safe housing, the judge said.


How about removing those children from their parents so the taxpayers dont have to subsidize even more people?

100% unconstitutional and this needs to be appealed.


It is my understanding that since Washington DC is NOT a state, it is not bound to the U.S. Constitution for the United States of America.

(I may be incorrect but I'd think the Constitution would have to say it applies to territories. I don't know that it says that.. and i don't think it does because if that's the case Puerto Rico would fall under the Constitution as well) )

" Remove the children from the parents " - Er.. so now your going to penalize or criminalize these people for having hardships that happen to leave them homeless?

You ever had your kid taken away? Think about it.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I found this interesting

The District of Columbia is not a state, it is a federal district. When the Constitution of the United States was adopted in 1787, what is now the District of Columbia was a part of the state of Maryland. In 1791, the District was ceded to the federal government for the purpose of becoming the nation's capital, a district that was to be governed by Congress.

In 1973, the District of Columbia Home Rule Act provided the city with more control of local affairs, including the election of a mayor and a 13-member city council. Residents of the District of Columbia lack full democratic representation in the U. S. Senate or the U.S. House of Representatives. Representation in Congress is limited to a non-voting delegate to the House of Representatives and a shadow Senator. In recent years, District residents have been seeking Statehood to gain full voting rights. They have not yet been successful. Read more about DC Voting Rights.
dc.about.com...
edit on 24-3-2014 by JohnPhoenix because: sp



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 09:20 PM
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reply to post by Elijah23
 


Please stay in Scotland with your ridiculous notions of violating property rights and enforcing confiscatory tax rates so that parasites can leech off the system.



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 09:30 PM
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reply to post by Quauhtli
 


In what way would that situation be balanced? It's a lose-lose no matter what way its done. Either an unconstitutional expenditure by using public money to place homeless in those houses, or by violating the property rights of homeowners.

Now, an agreement could be made with the property owners that people would work a minimum number of hours a week improving those homes or something along those lines, but when a low number of people show up to do that because they dont want to work, or that agreement isnt fulfilled, then what? People will whine when they get kicked out of those homes.



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 09:31 PM
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Mature adults think with logic and intellect (aka their brains), and some think with emotion.

It seems you are part of that 2nd group.
reply to post by doubletap
 



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 09:35 PM
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reply to post by JohnPhoenix
 


Since DC isnt technically a state, it doesnt have a Constitution for itself like states do, therefore the U.S. Constitution is what DC abides by. That being said, states themselves can not pass laws that violate the federal Constitution.



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 09:35 PM
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You're missing the point, no one should have to ask for private rooms, it should be a given right
reply to post by Elijah23
 


No, I believe YOU are missing the point.

Nobody in America has THE RIGHT to a private room, THE RIGHT to free medical, food and housing. America was founded on the right to WORK for whatever you want.
We are no longer a' progressive' nation, we are now very regressive.
I have no objection to my tax dollars paying the way to provide for, and HELP those who are down on their luck, but they need to be identified from those who feel it is their RIGHT to have me provide for them.

Giving help to people who have no ambition to help themselves keeps them dependent, and you are truthfully taking away their future.
What ever happened to personal pride? Have you ever offered a panhandler $20.00 and a hot meal to to wash your car? They'll say 'no thanks'. They could make $100.00 by just standing there with their cardboard sign for an hour!

What is needed are programs to get the indigent who truly want a better life some help. Not another tax-funded handout!
If it's charity people want, then we need to set up a charity for people to donate to. Like United Way, where the CEO gets a salary of 1 million a year, plus an ungodly amount of perks.

Private room? That might make you feel better, but in the end it just enables people to stay at the bottom. There are plenty of vacant lots; give them a 'private' tent, and a heater!

I have been homeless, but I have something that is severely lacking in the younger generation; it's called 'pride'. I wasn't homeless by choice, but BY CHOICE I didn't stay that way one second longer than necessary. And I made it a 'vacation for the kids....turns out to be a great learning experience,too.

And,no; I didn't expose my children to the dangers of a shelter. There are far better options.....



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 09:45 PM
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That's a tough one because, yeah, many cities just don't have that kind of money to put families in private rooms... what is a private room? But you can't rip a family apart and furthermore... who pays for foster care anyway if you would do that? What kind of animal advocates tearing a family apart?

We really need to get better solutions to this. Why is there a homeless family in the first place? I think you'll find that homeless families are overwhelmingly single females with children. These are separate and different than the general homeless population that many of us see and think about when we see the word homeless.

You may also think why the heck doesn't he man get a job and blah blah blah. We're talking about mothers with young children with nowhere to go, no college education and no resources. I think there needs to be emergency family centers with small private rooms for these families...there also needs to be a comprehensive program that helps these families get more permanent housing, training and jobs. USA is failing when you look at it that way. We'd rather complain about welfare recipients and spend money on foreign wars.

When you rip families apart and force women and children to live like animals, it gets you in the end in the cost of prisons and long term welfare and police costs and court costs and on and on and on. We need to get this problem in the early stages. You hear a lot about our welfare nation but you don't here much about how to get us away from it. Where is the compassion?
edit on 24-3-2014 by amazing because: (no reason given)


So now you know why we have an abortion problem as well. What's a young woman with no options and no resources who's made some mistakes supposed to do?
edit on 24-3-2014 by amazing because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 09:46 PM
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How about removing those children from their parents so the taxpayers dont have to subsidize even more people?
reply to post by doubletap
 


It never ceases to amaze me that Americans will pay trillions (5 TRILLION in the last 12 years) to kill brown people that never meant them any harm, without so much as a peep...but go out of their minds when their government spends money actually helping American citizens in need.

The government can shovel 16 TRILLION of YOUR tax dollars to bail out foreign banks and corporations....and not a peep out of you. They can give 3.2 BILLION to Israel in weapons...but don't you dare try and help American families....instead...you want to take these kids away from their parents...UNREAL.

Really goes to show where your priorities are.




posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 09:49 PM
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doubletap
reply to post by JohnPhoenix
 


Since DC isnt technically a state, it doesnt have a Constitution for itself like states do, therefore the U.S. Constitution is what DC abides by. That being said, states themselves can not pass laws that violate the federal Constitution.


Ya know.. this is the second time you mentioned this "Federal Constitution" I cannot find a copy of this document. Got a link?

Surly you don't mean the same document as we call The Constitution of (or for) The United States of America?
edit on 24-3-2014 by JohnPhoenix because: addition



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 09:56 PM
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deadcalm



How about removing those children from their parents so the taxpayers dont have to subsidize even more people?
reply to post by doubletap
 


It never ceases to amaze me that Americans will pay trillions (5 TRILLION in the last 12 years) to kill brown people that never meant them any harm, without so much as a peep...but go out of their minds when their government spends money actually helping American citizens in need.

The government can shovel 16 TRILLION of YOUR tax dollars to bail out foreign banks and corporations....and not a peep out of you. They can give 3.2 BILLION to Israel in weapons...but don't you dare try and help American families....instead...you want to take these kids away from their parents...UNREAL.

Really goes to show where your priorities are.



The United States has spent $20 trillion on the welfare state so far.



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 10:00 PM
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reply to post by amazing
 


Compassion is like religion: It has no place in public policy and is best practiced ONLY in your personal life.

I find it funny how many people choose to be compassionate when it comes to spending other peoples money.



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 10:03 PM
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nobody should freeze to death in modern society. or starve. not one person. that they do, is madness for sure.



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 10:04 PM
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reply to post by JohnPhoenix
 



The U.S. Constitution has also been called the federal Constitution since the states met to ratify it.

You are out of your league here kid.

edit on 24-3-2014 by doubletap because: (no reason given)

edit on 24-3-2014 by doubletap because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 10:05 PM
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RoScoLaz
nobody should freeze to death in modern society. or starve. not one person. that they do, is madness for sure.


So we can send them all to your house and you will financially subsidize their existence?

Each and every one of them?

Sounds good.



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 10:05 PM
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Housing the homeless is often cheaper than the alternatives...

Colorado Proves Housing The Homeless Is Cheaper Than Leaving Them On The Streets (thinkprogress.org)

Canada Homelessness: Housing Homeless Is Cheaper Than Patchwork Services, Study Says (huffingtonpost.ca)

Utah Is Ending Homelessness By Giving People Homes (trueactivist.com)

Apartment rents cheaper than stays in homeless shelters (usatoday.com)
edit on 24-3-2014 by Elton because: (no reason given)



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