It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Tymoshenko - "We Should Fire Nukes At Them!"

page: 3
11
<< 1  2    4 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 02:18 PM
link   


This discussion is about the situation in Ukraine, however.
reply to post by Wookiep
 


Indeed...I bring up the US's past history of overthrowing governments through covert means...such as they have done once again by illegally by supporting radical ultra nationalist Nazis in overthrowing a democratically elected government yet again...in the Ukraine.

They have manufactured this so called crisis in the Ukraine....just as they have done time and time again. Yet somehow Russia is to blame?? NONSENSE.




Russia is not on some "democracy" kick to free the world


Hahaha....and the US is??? Yeah....right....LOLZ




The ball really is in Putin's court.


Indeed. By my mind he has shown remarkable restraint...I hope the US learns from this example.

As for that ball that Putin has....you had best hope he doesn't decide to play it because there is no way that the US would survive it intact.




posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 02:19 PM
link   
reply to post by deadcalm
 





I stand corrected....they have had 1 compared to how many for the US??


And this isn't about the US now is it?

Actually they have had their hands in more than you think.


2008 invasion of Georgia by Russia
1979 invasion of Afghanistan by the Soviet Union
1956 invasion of Hungary by the Soviet Union
1950 invasion of South Korea by North Korea with Soviet support
1945 invasion of Japanese-controlled Manchuria and Korea by the Soviet Union
1945 invasion of Poland, Austria and Eastern Germany by the Soviet Union
1944 invasion of Bulgaria, Yugoslavia by the Soviet Union
1939 invasion of Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia by the Soviet Union


en.wikipedia.org...

Your right they have never invaded another country.
edit on 24-3-2014 by tsurfer2000h because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 02:20 PM
link   

demus
reply to post by Wookiep
 

I think you should watch that video about how borders have changed in just last 100 - 200 years.
new countries, unions and regions joining or separating every single year.


I don't doubt they have changed, a lot has happened in the last century. We are now talking about NATO and Russia possibly engaging in armed conflict over Russian expansion into established European regions. It kinda send out alarm bells, there's never been such a threat to the world since WWII. WWII would is a walk in the park compared to what could arise out of this..
edit on 24-3-2014 by Wookiep because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 02:24 PM
link   
reply to post by deadcalm
 


Ok, so the U.S. manufactured this whole mess by staging a coup and injecting evil Nazis into the elite Ukrainian government in order for it to establish a relationship with the EU. I get it, but -

#1 it still happened, on the same day Russia officially annexed Crimea. So their little incursion didn't help matters, did it?

#2 Can you honestly tell me that the previous Russian-backed Ukrainian president wasn't implanted by Russia to oversee it's interests? You seem to think their hands aren't dirty at all in this. You're wrong. There are influences from both sides, all big governments do it.
edit on 24-3-2014 by Wookiep because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 02:24 PM
link   


And this isn't about the US now is it?
reply to post by tsurfer2000h
 


How can it not be in part about the US? They started this by supporting a coup to overthrow a democratically elected leader.

They forced the Russians hand here....the blame for this lays squarely at the American Goverments feet.



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 02:26 PM
link   

Wookiep

demus
reply to post by Wookiep
 

I think you should watch that video about how borders have changed in just last 100 - 200 years.
new countries, unions and regions joining or separating every single year.


I don't doubt they have changed, a lot has happened in the last century. We are now talking about NATO and Russia possibly engaging in armed conflict over Russian expansion into established European regions. It kinds send out alarm bells, there's never been such a threat to the world since WWII. WWII would is a walk in the park compared to what could arise out of this..


Russian expansion to where?
For now, they have just secured their fleet, military, navy and military bases against any kind of influence from newly formed (not elected) government in Kiev.

very logical and natural thing to do.

What we see from Russia is just a reaction on expansion from the West.

so it just depends on what side you're on, USA is no better than Russia...



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 02:30 PM
link   


#1 it still happened, on the same say Russia officially annexed Crimea. So their little incursion didn't help matters, did it?
reply to post by Wookiep
 


The Russians had no choice but to act against US meddling in a country with strong historical ties to Russia, a large Russian population...as soon as the Ultra Nationalist fascists decided that their first act would be to ban the Russian language, they had to know that Russia would step in to protect it's people....not to mention military assets in the Crimea.




#2 Can you honestly tell me that the previous Russian-backed Ukrainian president wasn't implanted by Russia?


I can. He was democratically elected by the people of the Ukraine in a fair election. If you have any proof of Russian interference in that....by all means...I'd love to see it.



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 02:31 PM
link   
reply to post by tsurfer2000h
 


Those Russian forces were based in Crimea... they didn't cross the border or fall from the Sky!!!

But let's entertain that Western notion of invasion though...
International Law clearly states that an outside force can invade any country they like to protect their ethnic citizens without the invaded countries permission!!


Peace everybody!



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 02:32 PM
link   
reply to post by demus
 





Russian expansion to where?


That remains to be seen, I hope no-where.

I'm not taking the "side" of the U.S., the U.S. hasn't even barely intervened in this yet. Russia laughed at the sanctions. Let's hope it stays that way as well.

I will say that as corrupted as the U.S. is, and as much as I hope I'm alive when one day a revolution happens here.. I would choose here over Russia. Contrary to recent popular ATS belief, Russia is no utopia.



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 02:34 PM
link   
reply to post by deadcalm
 





How can it not be in part about the US? They started this by supporting a coup to overthrow a democratically elected leader.


What right does that give to Russia to takeover part of that country?

Did the US annex any part of that country?



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 02:36 PM
link   
reply to post by deadcalm
 


The Kiev protests proved the people did not approve of him whether influenced by the west or not, unless you believe there were enough CIA agents to fill the entire square. Interview after interview by Ukrainians independently recording proved what the people there wanted, and it wasn't their former president.



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 02:38 PM
link   


Actually they have had their hands in more than you think.
reply to post by tsurfer2000h
 


The list I posted were just countries that the US has started coups in....if you want to get into how many countries the US has invaded compared to Russia....so be it.

Since the US was formed they have invaded the following...




(1) American Indian nations (1776 onwards, American Indian Genocide; 1803, Louisiana Purchase; 1844, Indians banned from east of the Mississippi; 1861 onwards, California genocide; 1890, Lakota Indians massacre), (2) Mexico (1836-1846; 1913; 1914-1918; 1923), (3) Nicaragua (1856-1857; 1894; 1896; 1898; 1899; 1907; 1910; 1912-1933; 1981-1990), (4) American forces deployed against Americans (1861-1865, Civil War; 1892; 1894; 1898; 1899-1901; 1901; 1914; 1915; 1920-1921; 1932; 1943; 1967; 1968; 1970; 1973; 1992; 2001), (5), Argentina (1890), (6), Chile (1891; 1973), (7) Haiti (1891; 1914-1934; 1994; 2004-2005), (8) Hawaii (1893-), (9) China (1895-1895; 1898-1900; 1911-1941; 1922-1927; 1927-1934; 1948-1949; 1951-1953; 1958), (10) Korea (1894-1896; 1904-1905; 1951-1953), (11) Panama (1895; 1901-1914; 1908; 1912; 1918-1920; 1925; 1958; 1964; 1989-), (12) Philippines (1898-1910; 1948-1954; 1989; 2002-), (13) Cuba (1898-1902; 1906-1909; 1912; 1917-1933; 1961; 1962), (14) Puerto Rico (1898-; 1950; ); (15) Guam (1898-), (16) Samoa (1899-), (17) Honduras (1903; 1907; 1911; 1912; 1919; 1924-1925; 1983-1989), (18) Dominican Republic (1903-1904; 1914; 1916-1924; 1965-1966), (19) Germany (1917-1918; 1941-1945; 1948; 1961), (20) Russia (1918-1922), (21) Yugoslavia (1919; 1946; 1992-1994; 1999), (22) Guatemala (1920; 1954; 1966-1967), (23) Turkey (1922), (24) El Salvador (1932; 1981-1992), (25) Italy (1941-1945); (26) Morocco (1941-1945), (27) France (1941-1945), (28) Algeria (1941-1945), (29) Tunisia (1941-1945), (30) Libya (1941-1945; 1981; 1986; 1989; 2011), (31) Egypt (1941-1945; 1956; 1967; 1973; 2013), (32) India (1941-1945), (33) Burma (1941-1945), (34) Micronesia (1941-1945), (35) Papua New Guinea (1941-1945), (36) Vanuatu (1941-1945), (37) Austria (1941-1945), (38) Hungary (1941-1945), (39) Japan (1941-1945), (40) Iran (1946; 1953; 1980; 1984; 1987-1988; ), (41) Uruguay (1947), (42) Greece (1947-1949), (43) Vietnam (1954; 1960-1975), (44) Lebanon (1958; 1982-1984), (45) Iraq (1958; 1963; 1990-1991; 1990-2003; 1998; 2003-2011), (46) Laos (1962-), (47) Indonesia (1965), (48) Cambodia (1969-1975; 1975), (49) Oman (1970), (50) Laos (1971-1973), (51) Angola (1976-1992), (52) Grenada (1983-1984), (53) Bolivia (1986; ), (54) Virgin Islands (1989), (55) Liberia (1990; 1997; 2003), (56) Saudi Arabia (1990-1991), (57) Kuwait (1991), (58) Somalia (1992-1994; 2006), (59) Bosnia (1993-), (60) Zaire (Congo) (1996-1997), (61) Albania (1997), (62) Sudan (1998), (63) Afghanistan (1998; 2001-), (64) Yemen (2000; 2002-), (65) Macedonia (2001), (66) Colombia (2002-), (67) Pakistan (2005-), (68) Syria (2008; 2011-), (69) Uganda (2011), (70) Mali (2013), (71) Niger (2013).





The human cost of these US interventions has been horrendous.





Thus in the period 1950-2005 there have been 82 million avoidable deaths from deprivation (avoidable mortality, excess deaths, excess mortality , deaths that did not have to happen) associated with countries occupied by the US in the post-1945 era. However the US has subcontracted a huge amount of violence to nuclear terrorist, democracy-by-genocide


US carnage....here

Yep....best get after those big bad Russians before they cause anymore trouble eh?? The hypocrisy is staggering.



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 02:45 PM
link   
reply to post by CharlieSpeirs
 





Those Russian forces were based in Crimea... they didn't cross the border or fall from the Sky!!!

But let's entertain that Western notion of invasion though...
International Law clearly states that an outside force can invade any country they like to protect their ethnic citizens without the invaded countries permission!!


Again that doesn't give them free reign to takeover Crimea, and how do you know they were all from that base?

And you may want to read this as Russia is bound by a trilateral agreement that certain security assurances were given to Ukraine from not only Russia, but the US and England.


When the Soviet Union collapsed in 1991, the newly independent Ukraine had on its territory what was the third largest strategic nuclear weapons arsenal in the world. It was larger than those of Britain, France, and China combined. On June 1, 1996 Ukraine became a non-nuclear nation when it sent the last of its 1,900 strategic nuclear warheads to Russia for dismantling.[1] The first shipment of nuclear weapons from Ukraine to Russia (by train) was in March 1994.[2] In return for giving up its nuclear weapons, Ukraine, the United States of America, Russia, and the United Kingdom signed the 1994 Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances, pledging to respect Ukraine territorial integrity, a pledge that was arguably broken by Russia's 2014 invasion of Crimea.[3] However, there is a dispute whether Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances is anything more than a general statement of intent, lacking the rigor of an international treaty and accompanying ratification procedure.


en.wikipedia.org...

Plus there was nothing involving Crimea or anything happening to ethnic russians in Crimea before this incursion.



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 02:45 PM
link   


Ukrainians independently recording proved what the people there wanted, and it wasn't their former president.
reply to post by Wookiep
 


The Ukranian president did move up the elections to May in response to the protesters demands....but that didn't suit the US/NATO agenda....so they overthrew him through an illegal coup. Had the Ukranians waited until may...they could have voted him out. Without American interference there would be no "crisis" right now, and we'd be discussing something else.



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 02:48 PM
link   
reply to post by deadcalm
 





Since the US was formed they have invaded the following...


Since when did this become a thread about the US and it's history?

Nobody is denying what the US has done in the past, but this is about Ukraine try to keep it there or start a new thread and you can discuss the US there.



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 02:49 PM
link   


What right does that give to Russia to takeover part of that country?
reply to post by tsurfer2000h
 


The Crimean people voting to rejoin Russia gave them that right. It was what the people of Crimea wanted....or do they not have the right to self-determination?



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 02:54 PM
link   


Since when did this become a thread about the US and it's history?

Nobody is denying what the US has done in the past, but this is about Ukraine try to keep it there or start a new thread and you can discuss the US there.
reply to post by tsurfer2000h
 


How can this not have something to do with the US???....THEY STARTED THIS COUP IN THE UKRAINE. They are bound up in this whether you wish to acknowledge that fact or not.

The history of the US is very relevant to this discusiion given the western media spin that this is somehow Russia's fault and that they are the aggressors....when the US has a very long history of doing just what it has in the Ukraine.....which is to overthrow a government that they don't like and install a puppet regime.

This is not off topic at all....it has everything to do with what is happening in the Ukraine.

But if the MOD's see this as off topic....I'm sure they will remove it.



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 02:55 PM
link   
reply to post by deadcalm
 





The Crimean people voting to rejoin Russia gave them that right. It was what the people of Crimea wanted....or do they not have the right to self-determination?


Doesn't look as they had a choice...

www.huffingtonpost.com...



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 02:59 PM
link   
reply to post by deadcalm
 





How can this not have something to do with the US???....THEY STARTED THIS COUP IN THE UKRAINE. They are bound up in this whether you wish to acknowledge that fact or not.


Again did the US send troops on the ground anywhere near Ukraine?

Why didn't the Russians do this politically, why did they have to take over part of the country with their troops?



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 03:01 PM
link   

demus
This is interesting; leaked phone call between Nestor Shufrych and Yulia Tymoshenko.

Cannot be 100% sure about the translation but the video is interesting.


edit on 24-3-2014 by demus because: (no reason given)


S&F!!!
I hope this Thread gets back on track soon!!!

Peace demus!



new topics

top topics



 
11
<< 1  2    4 >>

log in

join