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Reincarnated: Past Lives; What if There’s Proof?

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posted on Mar, 23 2014 @ 08:22 PM
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reply to post by Hoyden
 


You can't answer the question without invalidating your own dogma.

If you tell me that the soul lies dead/asleep in the grave until the end of time, waiting to be resurrected in a physical body, then Jesus is a liar. If you tell me that death is an illusion, the soul never dies, then reincarnation IS possible and probable, and a physical resurrection is superfluous.


The wind blows wherever it pleases. You hear its sound, but you cannot tell where it comes from or where it is going. So it is with everyone born of the Spirit."


So it is with everyone born of the spirit. That means me! I can go where ever I please after my body is dead and gone. This is what Jesus promised. Spiritual life and freedom. Not later, but NOW!

I can reincarnate if I so choose. If one is not born of spirit, one WILL reincarnate whether or not they choose to do so.



edit on 23-3-2014 by windword because: (no reason given)




posted on Mar, 23 2014 @ 08:25 PM
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as I said before - discussion is possible between the people of equal knowledge.

You lack the knowledge ( your questions proved that) and therefore the discussion is not possible.



posted on Mar, 23 2014 @ 08:27 PM
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reply to post by sled735
 


Excellent post, bro

=========================

To people who doubt about "reincarnation" or those who might think highly of themselves because they're born to be 'special' than others.... you might want to contemplate on these questions:
"Am I only given just this one chance to live as a frail human who only have a lifespan for 0.1 year to 160 years?"
"Am I only given just this one chance to live on this planet? Only one planet out of possible infinite numbers of earth-like planets in this universe?"

Excluding your Beliefs, Common Sense will tell you No.

Then contemplate on other people:
Why most people are destined to be 'poor', 'evil', etc. Why not You?
Why some people are destined to be 'rich', 'beautiful', etc. Why not You?

It is easy to blame The System for causing these differences... but it is too convenient for a reason, isn't it?
How about the children who are born in poor families... why can't they be born in rich families? Destiny?
Imagine you are one of those 'poor' children (If you consider yourself rich or at least live better than they are)

peace
edit on 23-3-2014 by dodol because: (no reason given)

edit on 23-3-2014 by dodol because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 23 2014 @ 08:27 PM
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Lets all remember the first to toss insults or character assassination is the loser of a debate

Carry on folks




posted on Mar, 23 2014 @ 08:28 PM
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Reisod
reply to post by Hoyden
 


I could post specific scripture in the NT that talks about reincarnation. Certainly, any reference's to reincarnation were removed from the bible so to keep the church in power over the people, and enforce the 'heaven and hell' concept.

I am too lazy at this moment, but shortly maybe I'll come back and post some of the references, especially the one that John the baptist is the reincarnation of Elijah.


No he is not.

There is no proof of reincarnation in the NT.

and if you are a follower of the gospel by Dan Brown - you will have plenty of likely minded people here


which does not make it correct even for a micron.



posted on Mar, 23 2014 @ 08:47 PM
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on 23-3-2014 by Akragon
lets review those then shall we?

39 This is the will of Him who sent Me, that of all that He has given Me I lose nothing, but raise it up on the last day. 40 For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who beholds the Son and believes in Him will have eternal life, and I Myself will raise him up on the last day.”

Spiritual resurrection... the body is dead... without the spirit the body has no life... Just as James said

there is no "spiritual resurrection" - the spirit can not "resurrect" - the spirit is eternal, immortal.the quote is about bodily resurrection only as only body can resurrect.

The body without the spirit is dead...

and is reunited with an immortal spirit in resurrection for the Last Judgement.

25 Truly, truly, I say to you, an hour is coming and now is, when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God, and those who hear will live. 26 For just as the Father has life in Himself, even so He gave to the Son also to have life in Himself; 27 and He gave Him authority to execute judgment, because He is [a]the Son of Man. 28 Do not marvel at this; for an hour is coming, in which all who are in the tombs will hear His voice, 29 and will come forth; those who did the good deeds to a resurrection of life, those who committed the evil deeds to a resurrection of judgment.

Already explained on the previous page... hes speaking of a spiritual resurrection

"spiritual resurrection" does not exist - it's nonsense - you can not "resurrect" something which is immortal, eternal and existing already.

On that day some Sadducees (who say there is no resurrection) came to Jesus and questioned Him, 24 asking, “Teacher, Moses said, ‘If a man dies having no children, his brother as next of kin shall marry his wife, and raise up children for his brother.’ 25 Now there were seven brothers with us; and the first married and died, and having no children left his wife to his brother; 26 so also the second, and the third, down to the seventh. 27 Last of all, the woman died. 28 In the resurrection, therefore, whose wife of the seven will she be? For they all had married her.”

29 But Jesus answered and said to them, “You are mistaken, not [a]understanding the Scriptures nor the power of God. 30 For in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels in heaven. 31 But regarding the resurrection of the dead, have you not read what was spoken to you by God: 32 ‘I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob’? He is not the God of the dead but of the living.” 33 When the crowds heard this, they were astonished at His teaching.

You err neither knowing the scriptures nor the power of God... we are like angels in the resurrection... Angels have no flesh, no physical body... again, spiritual resurrection

Looks like you do not know the Gospels at all.

AFTER the Judgement. Not before. Before - we ( as a soul) reunite with the resurrected body and undergo the Judgement. this is, most probably, done to make us all equal before the God - as there are going to be still LIVING people undergoing the Last Judgement, so in no way their bodies are of any angelic nature. After the Judgement the righteous ones - both still living and resurrected dead will undergo changing of them in order to become angel-like. But that will happen only after the Judgement. Before - everyone is going to be in their earthly body


24 Martha *said to Him, “I know that he will rise again in the resurrection on the last day.” 25 Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life; he who believes in Me will live even if he dies,

really has nothing to do with the topic at hand, but again we see him say.. the body dies, the spirit lives on...

sure, until the Last Judgement - when spirit reunites with the resurrected body for the Judgement

Spiritual resurrection... where the spirit is resurrected from the body when the body fails

there is no "spiritual resurrection" - it's nonsense. spirit can not "resurrect" it is already immortal.

so for the umteeth time.... there is NO bodily resurrection

for gizillionth time - there is only bodily resurrection
Jesus did not teach resurrection of the body... HE was the exception to the rule because he needed to show his followers life continues after the death of the body...

Yes, He did. It is only body which can resurrect. The spirit is immortal. He taught exactly about the resurrection of the body for the Last Judgement

ONLY he was resurrected in the body... and it had a purpose as I just explained...

Nope. Lazarus was also resurrected in his body. and some others ( the daughter of the soldier as I recall as well).
And all of our bodies will be resurrected for the Last Judgement - as He taught and us proven by all the above quotes


And lazurus of course... I guess I should add that... and look at the state of him after only a few days...

We are resurrected in the spirit... TO resurrect means to restore life... the spirit is restored to its former glory...

Nope. Spirit can not be resurrected - it is immortal. Body can and will. For the Last Judgement. And then it will be changed to fit the Heaven for those who will pass the Judgement.

[

edit on 23-3-2014 by Hoyden because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 23 2014 @ 08:59 PM
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reply to post by Hoyden
 


And again, none of what you just said is biblical... that is just a mish mash of bits and pieces of passages in the bible...

there is no resurrection of the body... the body dies... the spirit within the body is restored or resurrected... to its former glory

just as the angels in heaven...

29 Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God.

30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.

31 But as touching the resurrection of the dead, have ye not read that which was spoken unto you by God, saying,

32 I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.

Just as James said, the body without the spirit is dead... no spirit, NO LIFE...

More over HE said this...

24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth

IF God is a spirit... and you consider Jesus God as I know you do...

JESUS IS SPIRIT RIGHT NOW, NOT a physical entity

I feel slightly dirty quoting Paul... but none the less

5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:

6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

The flesh is weak, corrupt... Useless...

We will not return to it, but be restored to the likeness of angels, and again, angels have no physical body...

You can call it nonsense all you like... but again, Jesus did not teach resurrection of the body...

What is nonsense, and non biblical like I've said numerous times, is the idea that our bodies will suddenly come alive in the future...

That is straight out of a fantasy novel, NOT out of the bible...


edit on 23-3-2014 by Akragon because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 23 2014 @ 09:00 PM
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reply to post by Hoyden
 






for gizillionth time - there is only bodily resurrection


Right! And, it happens when dead matter is resurrected by the living spirit, and the spirit is reborn in a brand new shiny body. A new born baby with a clean slate and fresh start. What a gift!

There is no one time only resurrection of dead matter, a replica of an imperfect being, created simply for the purpose of judgement. Resurrection is continuous, never ending cycle of life, death and rebirth, happening all the time all around us.



posted on Mar, 23 2014 @ 09:11 PM
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windword
reply to post by Hoyden
 






for gizillionth time - there is only bodily resurrection


Right! And, it happens when dead matter is resurrected by the living spirit, and the spirit is reborn in a brand new shiny body. A new born baby with a clean slate and fresh start. What a gift!

There is no one time only resurrection of dead matter, a replica of an imperfect being, created simply for the purpose of judgement. Resurrection is continuous, never ending cycle of life, death and rebirth, happening all the time all around us.



nothing is reborn. The spirit is immortal after created by God.

earthly body is resurrected when reunited with it's immortal spirit for the last Judgement - and everybody present will be equal - the still living ones and the dead ones.



posted on Mar, 23 2014 @ 09:15 PM
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Akragon
reply to post by Hoyden
 


And again, none of what you just said is biblical...


and again - everything I said IS biblical as proven b y my quotes.

There is no "spiritual resurrection" as the spirit is immortal.
But there is a one-time resurrection of the body - for the Last Judgement, so all can be even before the Judge - the living and the dead.

Everything nicely described by Jesus Christ Himself - in the quotes I have provided.

Do you want some from the Epistles as well?


I can do that. Tomorrow.

But anyway even those Gospel quotes prove you are wrong and, most probably, do not know the Gospels ( Canonical ones) as they clearly talk about bodily resurrection.
Which is the only possible one as "spirit resurrection" is nonsense - the immortal entity can not "resurrect".
edit on 23-3-2014 by Hoyden because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 23 2014 @ 09:20 PM
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Hoyden

Akragon
reply to post by Hoyden
 


And again, none of what you just said is biblical...


and again - everything I said IS biblical as proven b y my quotes.

There is no "spiritual resurrection" as the spirit is immortal.
But there is a one-time resurrection of the body - for the Last Judgement, so all can be even before the Judge - the living and the dead.

Everything nicely described by Jesus Christ Himself - in the quotes I have provided.

Do you want some from the Epistles as well?


I can do that. Tomorrow.

But anyway even those Gospel quotes prove you are wrong and, most probably, do not know the Gospels ( Canonical ones) as they clearly talk about bodily resurrection.
Which is the only possible one as "spirit resurrection" is nonsense - the immortal entity can not "resurrect".
edit on 23-3-2014 by Hoyden because: (no reason given)


You didn't prove anything but the fact that you are hard headed and don't read what he said...

Here is the nail in the coffin... so to speak

You want epistles...

READ AND LEARN

42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:

43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:

44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

47 The first man is of the earth, earthy; the second man is the Lord from heaven.

48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.

49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

Game over... you lose, and you reinforce my points...

There is NO resurrection of the body... Jesus didn't teach it, neither did Paul or any of the other apostles




posted on Mar, 23 2014 @ 09:20 PM
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I will continue to debunk you nonsense on "spiritual resurrection" tomorrow as it is late and I need to sleep.

Good night - and remember - Jesus Christ taught about bodily Resurrection for the Last Judgement and it is in the center of His whole teachings



posted on Mar, 23 2014 @ 09:21 PM
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Hoyden
I will continue to debunk you nonsense on "spiritual resurrection" tomorrow as it is late and I need to sleep.

Good night - and remember - Jesus Christ taught about bodily Resurrection for the Last Judgement and it is in the center of His whole teachings


and at this point You are blatantly lying to those who are reading this

Good luck In your quest




posted on Mar, 23 2014 @ 09:32 PM
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I don't quite know if I believe in reincarnation or not but,

If I came from a past life I always thought that I died in the Vietnam war.

I can't explain it but I have always been hooked on the Vietnam conflict. The Uh-1 Huey is my favorite helicopter and as far back as I can remember I have been interested in that particular war.

Just wanted to share that after reading the thread.



posted on Mar, 23 2014 @ 09:52 PM
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reply to post by Hoyden
 






nothing is reborn.


Then why did Jesus say "You must be born again"?



The spirit is immortal after created by God.


On that we can agree!



posted on Mar, 23 2014 @ 10:43 PM
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reply to post by windword
 


Yes you must be born again, and again, and again.

If life is eternal and infinite, what is just one little life. PHAH, waste of time.

I tell you, John the baptist IS Elijah, who wherefor was to come.

LOOK IT UP, JOHN THE BAPTIST IS THE REINCARNATION OF ELIJAH, IT SAYS SO IN THE NEW TESTAMENT AT LEAST TWICE.



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 12:06 AM
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Reisod
reply to post by windword
 


Yes you must be born again, and again, and again.

If life is eternal and infinite, what is just one little life. PHAH, waste of time.

I tell you, John the baptist IS Elijah, who wherefor was to come.

LOOK IT UP, JOHN THE BAPTIST IS THE REINCARNATION OF ELIJAH, IT SAYS SO IN THE NEW TESTAMENT AT LEAST TWICE.


It means symbolically John is the reincarnation of Elijah, as they both played important roles and things in common.

Jesus states categorically in the Padgett Messages that there is no reincarnation. And when you understand the division that currently exists in the mansion world; the spirits believing in reincarnation continue to live in the mind mansion worlds awaiting their big day to reincarnate that never comes, whereas those who do their soul-healing with the Divine Love, ascend the mansion worlds into the Celestial spheres and beyond, never having any intention of coming back to Earth because it doesn't happen anyway, then you can see the folly of believing in such an erroneous belief.

To be born again, or born anew means to do your soul-healing with the Divine Love, heal all your childhood repression, end all your wrongness, heal being evil, and when you've done that and are living a Celestial level of truth, then you'll be as if you have been born again, or born anew, because you'll then be like a child again as in being pure and perfect, like how you were before your corruption.

The resurrection of spirit can apply to many things. Before Jesus came, when people died they want into a sort of unaware limbo state, waiting for the end of the current planetary age. When the next age came, all those people in limbo awoke - resurrected - into the mansion worlds there to carry on living their new lives as spirits. However with Jesus' coming, it mean everyone who died went straight into the mansion worlds, there no longer being any limbo state awaiting the roll-call at the end of the age.

It's all there in the Urantia Book and Padgett Messages and Speaking with Mary Magdalene and Jesus



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 01:07 AM
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reply to post by zuimon
 


you do realise that "the urantia" is the same as the any of the "messages from Jesus" that a few of our members always quote

channeled revelation is always suspicious... especially when they don't align with what Jesus actually said

and in many cases the urantia book is waaay off of what the gospels say

careful brother... don't believe everything you read

There are literally thousands of messages that are attributed to Jesus...




posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 01:15 AM
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Wasnt this debunked? Considering it connects to india beliefs system, just
like every other religion, they try to make up something to gain weight
for their religion.

Its like a game of "guess who" lot of people actually have a lot of
things in common. Their guess's are VERY VAGUE, they are mostly
lead on. Its almost as bad as those people who talk to spirits/dead;
cold reading
.

The way we dream makes us even more impressionable.



posted on Mar, 24 2014 @ 01:25 AM
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aerial
Wasnt this debunked? Considering it connects to india beliefs system, just
like every other religion, they try to make up something to gain weight
for their religion.

Its like a game of "guess who" lot of people actually have a lot of
things in common. Their guess's are VERY VAGUE, they are mostly
lead on. Its almost as bad as those people who talk to spirits/dead;
cold reading
.

The way we dream makes us even more impressionable.


You can't "debunk" what is... Almost Every religion save Christianity accepts reincarnation

The Jews even accepted it, and guess who were jews... All of the apostles, and even Jesus himself

The fact is, reincarnation and the teaching of was dismissed and removed because it gave people power over the church


edit on 24-3-2014 by Akragon because: (no reason given)



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