Petrodollar Alert: Putin Prepares To Announce "Holy Grail" Gas Deal With China

reply to post by Patriotsrevenge

Putin can play his games all he wants.

Putin is the only one that is acting level headed. Have you heard the straight out hypocrisy coming from the mouths of these US politicians? Saying things like, "You don't invade a foreign sovereign conutry." Why the hell was nobody speaking up for the last 10 years that the US has bombed/invaded/imposed its will on other sovereign states.

Cut off Russia's oil exports to everyone but China, Pakistan and India. That will pucker him up. The Saudis, Iraq and opec do not need Russia for jack.

And how is the US going to "stop" Russia from exporting oil to other countries? All Russia has to do is accept another form of payment for it. That's why these sanctions are going to backfire on Obama and hasten the death of the petrodollar.

We hold the trump card sitting on the worlds largest oil and gas reserves. The FED just always makes people think we are running out of oil to keep the price up

The Fed does not set the price of oil. The Fed sets monetary policy not energy.

that is how they make their money to loan us for whatever we need and that is why we do not really care about the debt owed.

Wow, do you even know how the federal reserve works? I'm guessing no from this post.

And believe it or not, there are many Americans like myself that are very concerned about the national debt and the US monetary policy. Not all of us are deniers to the extent that you seem to be.

Thank you elysiumfire and Darkbake....so far at least 2 people get it .....now if you two good chaps could go and get 2 other people each, and the 4 go and get 2 people each, and those 8 people get 2 people each.....to just understand....this is NOT about borders, this is about YOU and YOURS.....and there's NOTHING we can do about what is coming except to prepare the best we can and stay safe.

I sincerely hope I'm wrong, but the elastic is about to snap and pants are going to fall around our ankles.

Rainbows
Jane

One thing I would like to dispel is the thinking that Putin wants to create a post-communist Soviet Union again. He doesn't, because he knows that to do so would weaken the emerging Russian market. Of course, he will seek to protect the interests and welfare of Russians in neighbouring countries, but to invade any of them would be economically suicidal.

The fall of the Soviet Union was the best thing to happen to Russia...it couldn't afford it, economically or militarily. Britain couldn't afford its empire, because empires overstretch the mother country militarily and economically. America's hegemonic empire is over-stretched to its breaking point. Look at its cost and how affective that cost is upon the American economy. The only reason why the American economy still has a beating heart is because of the petrodollar. America will sometime in the near future experience the same fall as the Soviet Union, shockingly devastating but ultimately the best thing for it. There is no turning back. America's slice of the world's pie will be drastically reduced, and larger portions will be sliced up for the emerging markets.

reply to post by angelchemuel

The devil is in the details. The RMB is tied to the dollar, so its value will essentially remain fixed. The ruble floats, and will likely inflate as Russia's economy goes south. If Putin is desperate enough for a deal (which he is) he will agree to denominate the trade in rubles, at a pre-arranged price for a certain period of time. As the value of the ruble spirals out of control, China will be paying less and less for Russian gas. If I were Xi Jinping, I would definitely take that deal.

elysiumfire...However, what many Americans fail to take on board is that their wealth and level of lifestyle is paid for by the rest of the world whilst it uses the American dollar as the world's reserve currency...

I wish I could star you more for this, this is just the thing isn't it? The US has had decades of supremacy, upholding standards they aren't able to commit themselves.

As a European I astonished how the overall American thinks its okay to live in a credit(debt ) based society. Heck I want a big ol' pick up truck, I still have to pay the electricity bill but F it, i'l just get an extra credit card.

Overall people like to blame their government, this is a common thing, yet they don't realize that they are part of it. I'l let "them" fix it first, but in the meanwhile i'l just keep doing what i'm doing.

We are living in an upside down world, where a country that is run by KGB is proving to be more diplomatic then overall the west.
Russia and China are preparing for the storm that is or is about to hit the west.

Think about this for a second : If China and Russia have a reserve currency in mind and the dollar implodes, who would care about debt? IF the country's that trade with China and Russia can change instantly to that currency they won't be effected by the disaster. And that's what we are seeing today, there are country's coming out the shadows openly supporting Russia.

DJW001:

The devil is in the details. The RMB is tied to the dollar, so its value will essentially remain fixed. The ruble floats, and will likely inflate as Russia's economy goes south. If Putin is desperate enough for a deal (which he is) he will agree to denominate the trade in rubles, at a pre-arranged price for a certain period of time. As the value of the ruble spirals out of control, China will be paying less and less for Russian gas. If I were Xi Jinping, I would definitely take that deal.

Incredible! This is the form of denial I am seeing constantly. Currencies can detach from the dollar in the blink of an eye, and they will do so if it provides a profitability in some way. It doesn't have to be a fiscal profitability, it can be a commercial and goods profitability. The Russian economy is not going to go south, why should they float the ruble if they believe it would inflate. The fact is, any currency detachment from the dollar instantly inflates the dollar, because the dollar's illusory value is tied to the currencies attached to it.

Watch the video provided by Jane...it states it in a nutshell. America...the richness of your economy is illusory! Once you accept that, you will see the real picture.

angelchemuel
Thank you elysiumfire and Darkbake....so far at least 2 people get it

.....now if you two good chaps could go and get 2 other people each, and the 4 go and get 2 people each, and those 8 people get 2 people each.....to just understand....this is NOT about borders, this is about YOU and YOURS.....and there's NOTHING we can do about what is coming except to prepare the best we can and stay safe.

I sincerely hope I'm wrong, but the elastic is about to snap and pants are going to fall around our ankles.

Rainbows
Jane

But, despite all the rants we get here on ATS the people that run our countries are not all idiots. They may have ideological opinions that are wrong (which we only find out about when they try it) but when it comes to global situations do you really think we here on ATS are the only ones seeing an inevitable outcome? A single leader on their own can be an idiot, a group of people e.g. the EU cannot all be idiots. So I suspect the group of western leaders have already weighed up many options and outcomes. You can bet they have something up their sleeve to counteract a run on the petrodollar. Don't forget that China is heavily dependent on the west for its manufacturing output and payment! in dollars ! It holds trillions of dollars. The last thing China wants is a deflated dollar.

Remember China needs energy to run it's economy that produces goods bought by (predominantly) the west. If the energy deal with Russia kills the western economies then China's manufacturing collapses and it will no longer need the energy from Russia. Da Dah!

reply to post by elysiumfire

Incredible! This is the form of denial I am seeing constantly. Currencies can detach from the dollar in the blink of an eye, and they will do so if it provides a profitability in some way.

Exactly! And as I have pointed out, it is in China's favor to keep the RMB coupled to the dollar. If you think that the Russian economy is going anywhere but south, you are the one who is in denial.

reply to post by angelchemuel

angelchemuel
[...]this is NOT about borders, this is about YOU and YOURS.....and there's NOTHING we can do about what is coming except to prepare the best we can and stay safe.

This is a good thread, Jane, and I agree with most of what you posted, but here I have to disagree.
See, for us over here within the €Z it is very much about borders, because in order "to prepare and stay safe" we HAVE to have souvereign fiscal power. We need to be independent to adapt to the paradigm shift and the coming correction.
Fortunately, unlike many of our neighbours, we still have "hard values" (I'm sorry, I don't know the english translation for that term). We managed to maintain a strong industrial base and a good workforce over the years, and after the change it will once more all come down to those values.
The truth is, we cannot carry the weight of the €Z... and if we stay tied to it, we will go down with it.

As if China didn't already have enough advantages to lure business there. If they get cheap oil from Russia the few manufacturers who haven't already left will find it hard to resist and the companies already there will greatly increase their competitiveness and profits. On the plus side goods will probably get even cheaper for consumers to buy, for those still with jobs anyway and until China decides to float their currency of course.

I dont think for one minute America gives a damn about its debt. Lets say that China, Russia, Europe and the Commonwealth of Great Britain buy American debt, they finance a war machine that will annhiliate anyone who asks for the money back...suckers.

I have read a few books lately which really put America in a bad light, the latest isBlackwater, The Rise of the World most powerful Mercinery Army, yes, the private security company.

The kicker...it is one of the most scary books I have ever read and the freaky bits have nothing at all to do with Blackwater, all to do with your government.

After reading it, your country is disgraceful, you are murderers, you are the most racist country that exists and your greed will be your downfall, see where I started, your greed and you borrow money to pay your debt, when the times comes to pay, your sick government will drop the bomb(s) and your 1% will survive...

reply to post by yorkshirelad


Please see my post previous to the one you posted.
Rainbows
Jane

reply to post by DJW001


There is evidence China is planning to break from the USD eventually though. Recently they increased the trading band of their currency and have been increasing the number nations they do direct trade with using their currency. New Zealand was added to the list just a few days ago when their PM visited China.

abcnews.go.com...

john452
reply to post by DJW001

 

There is evidence China is planning to break from the USD eventually though. Recently they increased the trading band of their currency and have been increasing the number nations they do direct trade with using their currency. New Zealand was added to the list just a few days ago when their PM visited China.

abcnews.go.com...

Yes, in effect they are no longer demanding to be paid in US dollars, which will allow them to trade more freely with nations that do not keep dollars as a reserve currency. However, as the article you cite says:

Incredible! This is the form of denial I am seeing constantly. Currencies can detach from the dollar in the blink of an eye, and they will do so if it provides a profitability in some way.

In other words, they will continue to keep the RMB pegged to the dollar.

I forgot to add...

In My Opinon......

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallujah_killings_of_April_2003

US Murderers

and

en.wikipedia.org...

Murderer

upload.wikimedia.org...

Murderer

SirDrinksalot
I forgot to add...

In My Opinon......

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallujah_killings_of_April_2003

US Murderers

and

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Bremer

Murderer

upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d4/George-W-Bush.jpeg

Murderer

This way off topic, but hopefully it will remind people that Russia stands to pay a terrible price for Putin's egomania.

yorkshirelad:

China needs energy to run it's economy that produces goods bought by (predominantly) the west. If the energy deal with Russia kills the western economies then China's manufacturing collapses and it will no longer need the energy from Russia. Da Dah!

There would seem wisdom in your perception, but it is only 'seems'. Why is China in with Russia on an energy deal? Is it to crash the western economies? No, not really, it is to source an alternative avenue of energy, but it will have knock on effects, more for the petrodollar than western economies as a whole. The emerging Eastern markets will use the petrodollar in some payments, but not exclusively. The American economy is large, not because it is muscular, but because it is obese, it may look fit and healthy, but it only seems so, like the wisdom in your post. The emerging eastern markets will use other currencies, because that is what keeps other countries economies healthy. No one economy will dominate, because to do so, as the American economy does, is to place stringent policies on the growth of potential customers, which restricts the size of the market and the number of customers who can afford to shop in the market.

All my argument is based on how the dollar is going to be affected. You don't have to touch or crash economies to reduce the dollar's illusory value, and thus reduce the American economy. The American economy is not the global economy, it just tries to control it, and that control is slowly being wrested out of America's fat grubby mitts. Time will tell one way or another.

reply to post by elysiumfire

Why is China in with Russia on an energy deal? Is it to crash the western economies?

No,it is because Putin has created a 'buyer's market' for Russian gas. Iran has the same problem.

Putin can play his games all he wants.

Cancerwarrior
Putin is the only one that is acting level headed. Have you heard the straight out hypocrisy coming from the mouths of these US politicians? Saying things like, "You don't invade a foreign sovereign conutry." Why the hell was nobody speaking up for the last 10 years that the US has bombed/invaded/imposed its will on other sovereign states.

The only real threat to the US ... or the world .... is the federal government. A new iron curtain dropped on the media and civil liberties post-9/11 and the world is victim.

How is it that the international community is silent on the US government's drone murders of civilians? Why aren't we seeing legal actions and protests daily here at home? Somehow, there has been a giant disconnect and our people simply don't get it. What these f# criminals are doing overseas today, they will be doing here tomorrow.

If we fail to stop these m a s s i v e crimes against humanity, we will absolutely deserve what's coming.

DJW001

This way off topic, but hopefully it will remind people that Russia stands to pay a terrible price for Putin's egomania.

You miss the point..America's egomania is far far worse.

I dont want to live under Russian rule, but America is fast becoming an even worse joke than Communism.

You cant call it Democracy, do you believe that people with an American passport live in a democracy? Its some form of existence, but its a big joke.