reply to post by Xcathdra
I also see no definitive proof of this so called meeting to plan any invasion. One of the main issues that seems most probable to me is the pushing
for Ukraine to join NATO back since 2008. That is a non-starter as far as Russia is concerned and I can't blame them for that.
Also the stench of western interference causing this whole mess to begin with can't be setting well with Putin. They may as well just walked up to
him and slapped him in the face.
Ukraine is sovereign and as such can choose whoever they want to ally themselves with.
NATO expansion east would not have been needed had Eastern Europe not been occupied by Soviet Union for 50 years.
Ukraine might not have considered NATO had Russia not illegally invaded Georgia.
With Putin now calling the collapse of the Soviet Union unlawful while channeling Charlemagne his actions are only going to push non aligned states
that were former SSR's farther into the EU / West / NATO realm.
As for interference from the west there was none. The manner in which Ukraine removed the former President was valid / lawful, A fact Russia is
desperately trying to portray as something its not. here is the basis from a post of mine In another thread. It uses Russian sources.
The agreement signed by the former President and the parliament, in addition to calling for new elections, immediately reverted back the 2004
Constitution (and by immediate, it means just that. There was no time frame for it and there was no law needed. It became effective once the
agreement was signed).
Under the 2004 Constitution, it allowed for impeachment using the existing language as well as a streamlined process, which is the part that people
are not familiar with.
Voice of Russia - Constitutional
reform may downgrade Yanukovych to figurehead president -
Ukraine’s MPs are due to take up drafts constitutional reform today, the drafts that have been prepared by the Batkivshchina and UDAR party
factions. The opposition insists on a return to the constitution of 2004 and on setting limits on presidential powers. Meanwhile, the EU Foreign
Ministers are due to meet in Brussels this Monday to discuss the situation in Ukraine. Sweden and Poland will come up with their proposals on changing
the stand on Ukraine.
Besides a return to the old constitution, the drafts provide for a simplified system of impeachment and voting, and also deprive the President
of any role to play in the Constitutional Court lineup. The opposition feels the Court should be formed by the MPs and a congress of Ukraine’s
judges. Unlike the constitution of 2004, which restricted presidential powers, the currently presented draft actually turns Yanukovych into a
figurehead President, says the Director of the Institute for Strategic Planning, Alexander Gusev, and elaborates.
“The changes under discussion will largely trim the presidential powers, reducing his function to receiving credentials from foreign Ambassadors.
The President’s duties will boil down to representing Ukraine during receptions. He will de facto stop being Head of State, with all powers due to
be transferred to Parliament”.
How do we know the 2004 return and simplified impeachment is valid?
Voice of Russia - Ukraine: Yanukovych signs deal
on ending crisis, Rada reinstates 2004 Constitution
The following is the text of the agreement signed by Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovych and opposition leaders in the presence of EU envoys to
end the ex-Soviet country's three-month crisis.
1. Within 48 hours of the signing of this agreement, a special law will be adopted, signed and promulgated, which will restore the Constitution of
2004 including amendments passed until now. Signatories declare their intention to create a coalition and form a national unity government within 10
2. Constitutional reform, balancing the powers of the President, the government and parliament, will start immediately and be completed in September
3. Presidential elections will be held as soon as the new Constitution is adopted but no later than December 2014. New electoral laws will be passed
and a new Central Election Commission will be formed on the basis of proportionality and in accordance with the OSCE & Venice commission rules.
4. Investigation into recent acts of violence will be conducted under joint monitoring from the authorities, the opposition and the Council of
5. The authorities will not impose a state of emergency. The authorities and the opposition will refrain from the use of violence.
*** A portion was removed by me as it dealt with actions taken under part 5 - the link has the full text ***
6. The Foreign Ministers of France, Germany, Poland and the Special Representative of the President of the Russian Federation call for an
immediate end to all violence and confrontation.
The simplified impeachment process was valid and lawful under the Ukrainian Constitution.
Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovych has announced that, to settle the crisis in Ukraine, he will initiate the reinstatement of the 2004
constitution and call early presidential elections. He also called for starting the procedure of forming a government of national confidence. "I am
announcing steps that need to be made in order to restore peace and avoid more victims of the standoff," Yanukovych said in a statement available on
the presidential website on Friday.
"These tragic days when Ukraine has taken the gravest losses and when people has died my duty is to state that human lives are very important. We
should do our best to take joint steps to restore peace in Ukraine," Yanukovych said.
"I declare the steps that should be taken to restore calm and avoid new victims," the Ukrainian president said.
"I state that I initiate early presidential elections and return the 2004 Constitution by redistributing powers from the president to the
parliament," Yanukovych said.
Yes the return to the 2004 Constitution was valid / lawful.
Yes the impeachment using the simplified process from the 2004 Constitution was valid / lawful.
The impeachment process followed the law as the bill was introduced by Parliament, and was actually authored by Nikolay Rudkovskiy, head of the
Socialist Party in Ukraine, which is part of the ruling Party of Regions coalition. The Party of Regions was the party of former President
Since people have issues using western sources, the above are all Russian sources. The Constitutional changes were discussed by Russian media in
2010/20/12, noting the changes in how parliament was elected would most likely result in parties coming together to impeach the former President. He
had been under investigation for a few years prior to all the mess we have now over corruption charges.
Finally - Library of Congress - Ukraine: Simplified Impeachment Procedures -
Library of Congress - Ukraine: Simplified Impeachment Procedures - Link
(Feb 03, 2009) On January 15, 2009, the Ukrainian legislature, the Verkhovna Rada, adopted the Law on Special Temporary Investigative Commissions,
which simplifies the procedure for the legislative body to impeach the President. Previously, the impeachment procedure could be initiated on the
basis of a petition signed by three-quarters of the parliamentarians. The new Law provides that the formation of a Special Investigative Commission is
the formal beginning of the impeachment process. Such a Commission must be formed upon the request of a simple majority of the Rada's members. The
original sponsors of a bill on the creation of a Special Investigative Commission cannot recall their signatures and withdraw the proposed bill. Legal
justification and evidential materials must accompany the bill.