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Ancient Egyptian Relief Depicting A DC Generator?

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posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 01:25 PM
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While most sources suggest that the Dendera Zodiac is an astronomical calendar of the Ancient Egyptians, I'd like to challenge this view with an alternative and perhaps additional interpretation. With that, I mean that we may actually be looking at a representation of an advanced, technological device.

I'm considering this viewpoint mainly because of other depictions, such as the Dendera Lights (see further below), that are also highly reminiscent of ancient technology in Ancient Egypt.

But Let's have a look at the Zodiac first:



Astronomical Calendar, Technological Device or Both?

When looking at the circular layout of the Zodiac, it could indeed represent a starmap or calendar incl. a representation of the skies and heavens (especially since the zodiac is on the ceiling of a chapel at the Dendera Temple complex). But when looking closely, there might be more to it than just an astronomical 'twist' as part of a rather marvelous piece of artwork.

So let's get to the point: below, you see a comparison between the Zodiac and a modern-day diagram showing a 4-pole DC Generator with eight coils surrounding an armature core:

Diagram Source


The similarities are intriguing and IMO a device like that is certainly at the heart of any advanced society that knows about electricity and physics. A generator and motor, producing motion and electricity, thereby bringing things to life ... certainly something to worship, if witnessed by a less developed civilization.

Here's why I believe that the generator layout would 'fit' the Egyptian depiction:
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1. The main field poles (A) are represented by two Egyptians holding the disc at the 4 cardinal positions
2. The interpoles (B) are each represented by one Egyptian at the 4 ordinal positions
3. 4 Poles seem to be connected to the outside (as would be the case in a 4-pole generator with 8 coils)
4. The rotation & motion of the core is represented by people & animals (central disc) facing in 'one' direction


Yet another diagram shows the possible configurations of DC generators including wiring and external connections, seemingly resembling the basic symmetrical layout of the Dendera Zodiac:

Diagram Source


Why use daily-life pictorial elements for a technical representation?

If the Dendera Zodiac is indeed a simplified representation of a DC generator, then why did the ancient Egyptians depict it using elements of their daily lives instead of a pure technical representation? Well, a very good question which perfectly relates to the Dendera Lights as well.

When looking at the image below, it becomes clear that the 'general' layout of the Dendera Lights is that of a Crooke's Tube. But on the detail-level, we see elements of daily Egyptian life, perhaps with the exception of the djed symbol which almost exactly resembles a high-voltage insulator:

Sources: Dendera Lights 1 and 2


The fact that these reliefs solely seem to depict 'simplified' technological diagrams, with no evidence of any actual hardware found in the vicinity, led me to believe that this knowledge was either shown to the Ancient Egyptians or that they found some of it at some point in the past.

Maybe some more distant ancestors or visitors had access to this technology and some descriptions or manuals ended up in the legacy of Egyptian culture? In this context, it may be noteworthy to mention that there are also other reliefs in Ancient Egypt that also seem to depict technological devices, such as here (electro-magnetism?) and here (Tesla coils?).

Due to the speculative content presented in the OP, I posted this in ATS Skunkworks instead of the Ancient Civilizations forum, but I still hope it reaches those interested in the subject matter. Thanks for reading up to here and I'm very much looking forward to your thoughts on this ...


Source & Links:
--------------------------
1. General Information About The Dendera Zodiac
2. Basic Motor Theory
3. DC Machine Construction
4. The Astronomical Monuments of the Ancients (Cuvier)
5. Lights of the Pharaohs: the Electric Lights in Egypt?
6. The Dendera Temple Complex
7. Ancient Electricity, Dendera Lights
8. The Dendera Affair
9. The Egyptian Calendar

DISCLAIMER: All images used in this post are either in the Public Domain, have a Creative Commons license or are otherwise implemented in a way that is likely to qualify as a fairuse.
edit on 19-3-2014 by jeep3r because: Text/Title




posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 02:11 PM
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S&F, could it be that a DC motor works using the same principle that creates the movement of the zodiac? if you get what I mean, friction genratin electricity and further motion, that its the same principle so both when depicted would look the same ? if you see what I'm getting at, us using natural or universal principles, knowingly or unknowingly ?

defo an interesting post though and its not inconceivable that they had this technology, I watched an excellent documentary the other day about how they now know that the Greeks should be credited with the invention of the first computer, not Charles Babbitch or Ava Lovelace or the principles of the Jaccard loom that came thousands of years later, they were using an elaborate system of gears and cogs to follow moon cycles well into the future, very impressive. so maybe the Egyptians were using similar principles at a similar time, maybe they got it from one another, who knows, they certainly learned a lot from each other.



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 02:18 PM
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It could indeed represent an astronomical calender....
Since there are two eclipses that happened noted on the calender.



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 02:26 PM
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Delicious work. Especially the idea of it having been shown to them.

Having looked into this stuff for about 20 years now, I've concluded that some technology was available to the "elite class" and not available to anyone else. Evidence of such can be found all over the world and I think the kind of knowledge you are showing us here is only the uppermost tip of a gigantic iceberg that will show itself more and more in centuries to come.
edit on 2014 by Skyfloating because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 02:44 PM
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Definitely a cool theory and well presented. Would explain how they got that biga$$ light bulb to work.



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 02:48 PM
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I have a question.
Why don't we make schematics of DC generators using the Zodiac?
Or, why didn't the ancient Egyptians make schematics without using people and animals to do it?



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 03:04 PM
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butcherguy
I have a question.
Why don't we make schematics of DC generators using the Zodiac?
Or, why didn't the ancient Egyptians make schematics without using people and animals to do it?


So that its kept secret and only the "enlightened" could understand it. Why secret? Well thats part of a longer story involving a cataclysm, war amongst Gods and whole range of other stuff so far out it would take this thread way off topic.

The other explanation is in the OP: Because they were shown this stuff and didnt understand what it meant.
edit on 2014 by Skyfloating because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 03:08 PM
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Looks more like an ion collector to me.

Could use it to collect and allocate ions to light some fluorescent lights if you spun it.
edit on 19-3-2014 by rickymouse because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 03:11 PM
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reply to post by Skyfloating
 





The other explanation is in the OP: Because they were shown this stuff and didnt understand what it meant.

That doesn't do a very good job of explaining why they would go to all the trouble of superimposing the Zodiac on a DC motor or generator. Plus, if they just looked at a motor or generator, they wouldn't see it as a section drawing, they would see the outside of it. If they are representing a cutaway, that would indicate they had knowledge of how it worked and could possibly use a line drawing instead of people and animals... Like I said, the calender is a calender. It has been dated by the astronomical references that are on it.
From the OP's link to Wikipedia:

Sylvie Cauville of the Centre for Computer-aided Egyptological Research at Utrecht University and Éric Aubourg dated it to 50 BC through an examination of the configuration it shows of the five planets known to the Egyptians, a configuration that occurs once every thousand years, and the identification of two eclipses. The solar eclipse indicates the date of March 7 51 BC, it is represented by a circle containing the goddess Isis liking an animal (wild boar) by the tail. The lunar eclipse indicates the date of September 25 52 BC, it is represented by an Eye of Horus locked into a circle.
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posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 03:12 PM
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reply to post by jeep3r
 


You don't say... As a Facility Engineer, the resemblance is uncanny (to uncanny, however the representation on why they would pose a 4 pole generator this way is a mystery in itself... still) Possibly that humans are energy or something along those lines? I'm very impressed. If I can applaud I would but here's a medal for some stellar work


Best regards,



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 04:14 PM
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reply to post by jeep3r
 


just wondering what they used to excite the generator, in other word where did the induced voltage come from.
that diagram you showed calls for voltage/ current applied across the commutator.

as far as i know they didn't have magnets back then and don't say baghdad batteries, they only produced small amount of voltage and current, and i don't ever recall any being found in egypt.
edit on 19-3-2014 by hounddoghowlie because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 05:50 PM
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butcherguy
 

I have a question.
Why don't we make schematics of DC generators using the Zodiac?
Or, why didn't the ancient Egyptians make schematics without using people and animals to do it?

I was asking the very same question, which is also included in the OP. They depict the general outlines or layouts, but only used metaphors or symbols from their own culture to make it come alive.

Machines, to them, must have been something that's alive. People & animals can represent action and motion, so can the hands that provide spin to the central disc or core. IMO they probably incorporated a legacy from much earlier times into their culture. It seems as though they are not the creators of said technology, but those who somehow were in contact with a highly advanced civilization (or visitors) that engineered such devices.

Overwhelmed by their technology and what it could do, they may have asked: "What is that? How does it work?". Then, somebody might have shown them diagrams illustrating how these wonderful devices do what they do.

All this may then have lived on in their memories, an unforgettable legacy ... their lack of knowledge regarding the details and single elements of electrical circuits could explain why they used terms & categories from their daily lives, while preserving the fundamental layout of the design.
edit on 19-3-2014 by jeep3r because: text



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 06:00 PM
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hounddoghowlie
reply to post by jeep3r
 

Just wondering what they used to excite the generator, in other word where did the induced voltage come from.
that diagram you showed calls for voltage/ current applied across the commutator.

Thanks for your comment, please also see my previous reply to butcherguy. If 'they' were not the creators of the technology they are depicting, they wouldn't need electricity and current to run those devices.

Within their culture, they may have preserved the fundamental designs of devices witnessed through an early experience with a highly advanced civilization ... after they've been shown how some of the machines worked (eg. by using diagrams), they tried to interpret the basic layouts using symbols from their daily lives to reproduce the details (which, of course, were unknown to them. So they could have used the next best metaphors to describe them).
edit on 19-3-2014 by jeep3r because: text



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 06:26 PM
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reply to post by jeep3r
 



Machines, to them, must have been something that's alive.

They managed to picture ships and chariots in their art without making them into animals. They built the pyramids but they couldn't draw the outside of an electric motor?



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 06:47 PM
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if one was navigating one would have to use the astrological symbols to keep track of the moon
and the various constellations and planets like venus...
so they could calculate longitude among other things
they didn't have chronometers like the brits had which gave them navigational abilities

navigational abilities
www.viewzone.com...

they did after all have all that math in their pyramids...
hence the old saying: if you hear hooves its more likely a horse then a zebra


Then four years ago a German scientist, Dr Svetla Balabanova, made a discovery which was to baffle Egyptologists, and call into question whole areas of science and archeology to chemistry and botany.

She discovered that the body of Henut Taui contained large quantities of coc aine and nicotine. The surprise was not just that the ancient Egyptians had taken drugs, but that these drugs come from tobacco and coca, plants completly unknown outside the Americas, unheard of until Sir Walter Raleigh introduced smoking from the New World, or until coc aine was imported in the Victorian era.

www.druglibrary.org...

The controversy began in the early 1990s, when a team of German researchers published a couple short papers claiming they'd found significant traces of coc aine, nicotine, and "hashish" in several Egyptian mummies, some of which were more than 3,000 years old. The papers offered a provocative insight into the personal habits of the idle rich in ancient times (conclusion: things haven't changed much in 3,000 years). Just one problem: in pre-Columbian times, so far as we know, tobacco and coca grew only in the Americas, and there was no trade between the Old World and New.
www.straightdope.com... aine-mummies

except now we have this

Published on Sep 23, 2012
White Caucasian red haired mummies were found in Florida's Windover Bog. The mummies dated to be over 7000 years old.

www.youtube.com...
couldn't embed for some reason


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posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 07:06 PM
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this is excellently presented, and i certainly see some direct correlations to what you are referring.

the resemblance to the generator is uncanny, as is the electromagnetism link provided - it seems to me to show electro-plating of jewelry? -

interesting indeed;

thanks for sharing!

S+F



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 07:18 PM
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The earliest known iron artifacts are nine small beads, dated to 3200 BC, from burials in Gerzeh, northern Egypt, that were made from meteoritic iron, and shaped by careful hammering.[5] Iron's qualities, in contrast to those of bronze, were not understood. Between 1200 BC and 1000 BC, diffusion in the understanding of iron metallurgy and utilization of iron objects was fast and far-flung. In the history of ferrous metallurgy, iron smelting — the extraction of usable metal from oxidized iron ores — is more difficult than tin and copper smelting. These other metals and their alloys can be cold-worked, or melted in simple pottery kilns and cast in molds; but smelted iron requires hot-working and can be melted only in specially designed furnaces. It is therefore not surprising that humans only mastered iron smelting after several millennia of bronze metallurgy.

In 2005, metallurgical analysis by Hideo Akanuma of iron fragments found at Kaman-Kalehöyük in 1994 and dating to c. 1800 BCE revealed that some of these fragments were in fact composed of carbon steel; these currently form the world's earliest known evidence for steel manufacture.[6][7]

Modern archaeological evidence identifies the start of iron production as taking place in Anatolia around 1200 BC, though some contemporary archaeological evidence points to earlier dates.

Lack of archaeological evidence of iron production made it seem unlikely that it had begun earlier elsewhere, and the Iron Age was seen as a case of simple diffusion of a new and superior technology from an invention point in the Near East to other regions. It is now known that meteoric iron, or iron-nickel alloy, was used by various ancient peoples thousands of years before the Iron Age. Such iron, being in its native metallic state, required no smelting of ores.[8][9] By the Middle Bronze Age, increasing numbers of smelted iron objects (distinguishable from meteoric iron by the lack of nickel in the product) appeared in the Middle East, Southeast Asia, and South Asia.

Iron in its natural form is barely harder than bronze, and is not useful for tools unless combined with carbon to make steel. The percentage of carbon determines important characteristics of the final product: the more carbon, the harder the steel. The systematic production and use of iron implements in Anatolia began around 2000 BC.[10] Recent archaeological research in the Ganges Valley, India showed early iron working by 1800 BC.[11] However, this metal was expensive, perhaps because of the complications of steel-making. It is attested in both documents and archaeology as a material for precious items such as jewellery.

en.wikipedia.org...

you would need fairly sophistcated iron work to make an electric motor especially like the one described



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 07:24 PM
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reply to post by Danbones
 


you would also need a honking big capacitor and circuitry to kick that over
a 7 1/4 skill saw motor takes 1600 watts to start

which raises some big infrastructure issues
a bagdad battery would not do it unless it was a mini toy



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 07:30 PM
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hounddoghowlie
reply to post by jeep3r
 


just wondering what they used to excite the generator, in other word where did the induced voltage come from.
that diagram you showed calls for voltage/ current applied across the commutator.

as far as i know they didn't have magnets back then and don't say baghdad batteries, they only produced small amount of voltage and current, and i don't ever recall any being found in egypt.
edit on 19-3-2014 by hounddoghowlie because: (no reason given)


From the earth. The pyramids in Egypt are built over a certain rock formation (forgot the name) where water could flow through and create in a sense, a form of energy. Tesla built his unique Wardenclyffe tower over one of these said rock formations in order to harness energy from the earth and to transmit it wirelessly.

Very interesting stuff that is little known by most.



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 08:11 PM
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kushness

hounddoghowlie
reply to post by jeep3r
 


just wondering what they used to excite the generator, in other word where did the induced voltage come from.
that diagram you showed calls for voltage/ current applied across the commutator.

as far as i know they didn't have magnets back then and don't say baghdad batteries, they only produced small amount of voltage and current, and i don't ever recall any being found in egypt.
edit on 19-3-2014 by hounddoghowlie because: (no reason given)


From the earth. The pyramids in Egypt are built over a certain rock formation (forgot the name) where water could flow through and create in a sense, a form of energy. Tesla built his unique Wardenclyffe tower over one of these said rock formations in order to harness energy from the earth and to transmit it wirelessly.

Very interesting stuff that is little known by most.


if they could harness electricity from the earth, why would the so called visitors need to bring generators, ac or dc. all they would need is the motors.
edit on 19-3-2014 by hounddoghowlie because: (no reason given)





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