A Conversation About Abortion you need to read!

All good points, but the best is the parents LACK of parenting and that is where the problem is mainly.

If you wish the state to teach your kids about oral sex and other things then that is fine, as for my house........not going to happen.....

Originally posted by edsinger
All good points, but the best is the parents LACK of parenting and that is where the problem is mainly.

If you wish the state to teach your kids about oral sex and other things then that is fine, as for my house........not going to happen.....

Just wondering, how DO you plan to teach your kids about sex?

Well I just tell them as it is.....the ol birds and the bee's, so that it is not a mystery to them.

Originally posted by edsinger
Well I just tell them as it is.....the ol birds and the bee's, so that it is not a mystery to them.

So you'll tell them about it but wont let teachers do it....?

Originally posted by edsinger
All good points, but the best is the parents LACK of parenting and that is where the problem is mainly.

If you wish the state to teach your kids about oral sex and other things then that is fine, as for my house........not going to happen.....

I dont know where you get your information from but in my sexual education class oral sex was never mentioned. We talked about symptoms of peuberty more than anything else, some classes had the boys and girls seperated, and some were whole class discussions, and they talked about how babies are made, about std's and about contraception, nothing about oral sex.

Look the schools want to pass out condoms.

As for the oral sex, they mentioned it in mine in 1985. Its not like I didn't already know but I know damn good and well that the schools have not become MORE conservative.

Originally posted by edsinger
Look the schools want to pass out condoms.

Mines didnt.

As for the oral sex, they mentioned it in mine in 1985. Its not like I didn't already know but I know damn good and well that the schools have not become MORE conservative.

Mines definatly didnt LOL.

Originally posted by edsinger
Look the schools want to pass out condoms.

As for the oral sex, they mentioned it in mine in 1985. Its not like I didn't already know but I know damn good and well that the schools have not become MORE conservative.

So what if the schools want to pass out condoms? The teenage boys in my school were more likely to use condoms as water balloons than use them during sexual intercourse, and as for schools becoming more conservative possibly they have because my sex ed course was in 1994 and as I mentioned above , nothing extremley graphic was discussed, including nothing to do with oral sex.

An embryo or fetus cannot survive outside the mother, period. Only when they are a minimum of 7 months old do they even have a chance.

A fetus/embryo is a cluster of cells, that could grow into a human, but isnt necessarily human. They dont even look human. They just look like a mass of tissue sometimes resembling a fish, a seahorse, or a worm.

And by all definitions of the word, embryos/fetuses can be logically considered parasitic. They draw nutrition and sustainence from the host (woman) and give nothing beneficial in turn. If anything, they endanger a womans health.

So abortion in the first two trimesters is not murder. Its simply removing an unwanted condition from a womans body at her own choice.

And even the bible and Jewish religons say that life begins at BIRTH when you draw your first breath.

Originally posted by edsinger
Look the schools want to pass out condoms.

As for the oral sex, they mentioned it in mine in 1985. Its not like I didn't already know but I know damn good and well that the schools have not become MORE conservative.

I had sex education in 1987 and 1985, when I was in 7th and 5th grades.

We learned what sex was, we also were allowedto ask our teachers annonymously about different sex issues. Our teachers discussed it neutrally and openly. Kids themselves asked about things like oral and anal sex, and the teachers responded by simply explaining what each was, and that you could not get pregnant from swallowing sperm.

I dont see a damn thing wrong with it. In fact, I think you are a bit naive about just how much your kids REALLY know. The school itself did not teach us about oral sex, yet almost every kid in the class at least knew what it was from what they picked up on the streets from other kids. The teachers acted responsibly. They did not give any "moral" opinions, they simply from an intellectual and scientific viewpoint answered our questions and dispelled myths about certain sexual activities.

I dont see how that could be wrong.

And what do you suggest we do when the earth overpopulates and there is not enough fresh food and water to support the human race. It seems to me that you are not really concerned with the issues directly effecting you and your family. Do we need to be like China and allow one child per family? Is that what it will take? Or do we just overpopulate the earth till disease and famine take care of the problem? Don't your morals interfere with fact. I believe Helen Keller said it best " People don't like to think, thinking leads to conclusions and conclusions are not always pleasent.

Originally posted by kleverone
I believe Helen Keller said it best " People don't like to think, thinking leads to conclusions and conclusions are not always pleasent.

Great quote Kleverone! Very (k)lever. No opinion on topic though,
AAC

If all life is precious you might as well just kill yourself because life cannot sustain life without consuming itself. You consume life constantly as does all living things around you.
Humans are not that precious. Get over it. There's over a billion already on this earth. If people cannot financially support their children they should not be having them. I would prefer those people remain abstinate, but you can't tell a bunch of chimps to do that because their primal instincts still dictate a lot of their behavior.

One other issue I'm disturbed with is how people are desperate to save fetuses while completley ignoring starving, homeless, abused children from all over the world that need homes.

Personally I view abortion as a last resort for population control. It's unfortunate, but people are not always reliable and they will often make mistakes that they regret. The only limitations I see is that abortions should be performed prior to the first trimester.

It has nothing to do with people being able to fiancially support thier children. It has to do with the earth not being able to support life. Overpopulation. And your comment about Killing myself is just plain ignorant. How about we take rational action instead of making suggestions like that. If that is the case then I'll go right after you! We cannot do anything about the past. Only the present and future can be altered. Lets educate people about birth control and not always make decisions based on religious or moral beliefs. Sometimes that is not what is best for the earth. That is why politics should always be seperate from religion, which with the current administration is unfortunately not the case. Stemcell shootdown is a great example. Oh and there is a lot more than a billion people on this earth, maybe you should rethink you ideas on how much longer the earth can susstain life without drastic measures being taken to reduce the population. Just because we choose to ingore this fact, does not mean it is not there.

[edit on 20-8-2006 by kleverone]

I believe that everyone should have to apply for birth. Have a social worker assigned to your case, look at your situation, and decide on such. It seems extreme I realize, but it solves: over population, welfare fraud, tax payers billions, education system solidifies, environmental purposes, parental neglect, orphanage over population, etc...

I'm sure the list goes on....

AAC

Wow, welcome to a military society. By taking away one of our most basic rights to reproduce we are being put into the same class as the dogs and cats that we have neutered, in other words we would be the pets of the goverment. It would never work of course, our instinct to survive through reproduction is too strong, you start trying to suppress natural human urges and instincts there will definetly be a civil war.

"And by all definitions of the word, embryos/fetuses can be logically considered parasitic."

That is outright false, a parasite is NEVER created by it's own host, to then feed of the older parasite. An embryo is only created in humans through sexual intercourse, at no time can one magicly INVADE the host( the female). Just because something(the fetus) acts like something else( a parsite) for a small portion of its gestation period, doen not make it a parasite. A parasite by definition and scientificly works different than a newborn life in a human. If an embryo, or fetus WAS a parasite, we would all be taught this in science class in school. We are mammals by definition, stop using "Agent Smith" like "matrix" analogys. For the 5-10% of women that get raped and inpregnated...I truely fell sorry for them. Everyone else who is too stupid to control basic bodily fuctions( caused by hormones) are indeed a sad bunch. Logic and inteligence is FAR more powerful than hormones, stop using "we are sexual beings" as an excuse...WE are not sexual beings, you are, because you enjoy it. Poor self control says alot about someone.

Now for those who try to equate some imbalace between pro war, and pro life.
War, is not an act of aggression, it is an act of both self defence and self preservation. If you want to bring the USA into this coversation(and our current war in Iraq, terrorism) so be it. I will ignore you, as it has nothing to do with this issue and topic we are disscussing. Reproduction ( the creation of life) is not by deffinition the same as self defence. If I raised my sword( or any weapon) to you, without reason.....YOU ARE ALLOWED AND INCOURAGED TO DEFEND YOURSELF. Now tell me where the zygote(or fetus) that YOU created, is attacking you and bringing great harm to your life( in the 90% of abortions that are not concerned with rape, and bodily harm). I, in no way take this stance as a religious man, for I am not of any religion....I use logic.

Well someone I know in his later years just found out that he will be a dad again. His oldest is 18 now. He was shocked and I think disappointed.

He did not understand why I was congratulating him on the news. He said that his plans have to now change, he can't buy the things nor do the things he wanted.


Sad.......many out there can not have a child and yet their are still those that want to kill them before they ever have a chance at life.

Children are a blessing.....

Originally posted by edsinger
Well someone I know in his later years just found out that he will be a dad again...

Children are a blessing.....

Obviously not for your friend.

...He said that his plans have to now change, he can't buy the things nor do the things he wanted.

While I can see the argument that he should have taken precautions, I can also see the argument that at his age he should not have to devote his later years to raising a child who will be a financial burden to him when he should be planning his retirement etc. Especially as your president wishes to defraud the nation of its social security benefits.

Children are not a blessing.

I have a friend who had the snip quite some time ago. After my second child was born he asked me if I was going to tell him how good kids were, how life-affirming they were and how he should find the right woman and have kids (as some other friends had done).

I told him that kids were the most fantastic thing that could happen to you, if you were ready for them.

Every six months in Australia we get news reports about parents that shook their baby to death because it wouldn't stop crying.

Children are not always a blessing. Anyone who says they are needs a fast reality check and to stop thinking in platitudes.

Children are an awesome responsibility, the greatest on earth, pressure that many people buckle under.

I have a question. Could you (anyone) kill someone and not think twice about it? Could you live the rest of your life knowing you killed someone?

I'm sorry but I could never live with the regret of killing something, especially my own child. There is adoption. There are choices, other than abortion.

Really who the hell are you anyway? Choosing who lives and who dies, like it's your responsibility or something. Like the death penalty, which I am against. You can not just choose to kill someone. There is no way in hell that it is your right.