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Canadian doctor makes anti-Obamacare senator look like a buffoon

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posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 01:11 PM
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Does that maybe show that Govt, when allowed to grow, encroaches on every aspect???
reply to post by macman
 


Agreed. The best government is the one you hardly know exists.





And it really troubles me that you are fine with people being taxed higher, just because they earn more.


I was one of those people that have been taxed at a much higher rate...I'm 54, university educated...healthy, retired, own my home outright, have a boat, quad and drive a Mercedes.....I'd say I didn't do too badly out of the deal. I paid what I could afford to pay. We all do.

Do I wish my government was better? Of course. Do I wish I could pay lower taxes?...yes. Do I want cheaper, better and more efficient healthcare?....of course. Like I said....we're working on it. But to my mind...we have made a good start.




Guess that taxes are punitive in nature and you are fine with that.


I guess that all depends on how you look at it.




posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 01:32 PM
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macman
reply to post by bluesilver
 


It is the persons right to either focus on themselves and/or focus on others.

I guess your okay with forced compassion via Govt.


Why do you think it is 'forced' when we want it to be like it is? I'm not sure how many more times you need me to tell you that?



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 01:33 PM
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So why not cut military and black ops and alphabet agency spending and put that into healthcare. No higher taxes and problem solved.
reply to post by amazing
 


Excellent point. If the US cut just their defence budget by half...you could all have healthcare, help people in poverty, and have enough left over to throw some down on the debt or even replace the crumbling infrastructure.

Even cutting your defence budget by half....you will still outspend everyone else in the world by a long shot.




Just look up the biggest nuclear arsenals and then look up navies and aircraft carriers and then look up military aircraft and then look up military satellites and then look up military technology and you'll see that we could cut trillions and still have the worlds largest most advanced military and pay for all the healthcare we'd ever need.


I guess in the end it all comes down to priorities. Right now the US Gov is more interested in spending your hard earned money to destroy other countries and build bigger and better machines of death... spy on absolutely everything, everywhere..ect....than they are on improving the lives of it's own people.

I thank the maker everyday I was born in Canada.



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 01:33 PM
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macman
reply to post by bluesilver
 


How is it cheap exactly???

It is paid for via extra taxes, taken from people. And I am sure it is a sliding scale of taxation, so there are people that are paying higher percentages then most.


It works out around £85 per month, if I was earning £25,000 per year. Like I said before. How much do you pay per month?



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 01:39 PM
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I'm not sure how many more times you need me to tell you that?
reply to post by bluesilver
 


Be gentle with him. It's hard for him to grasp how we could want to live like we do in Canada....when you've been told all your life you are number 1 at everything...everyone else is wrong and you're right. That your model of government is the best, and everyone else wants to be just like you...it takes a complete paradigm shift....that isn't easy.

It's not his fault.



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 01:42 PM
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macman

deadcalm


Huh? I fail to see how having universal healthcare equates to the government having control over a large part of my life....other than having to get a replacement health card every 5 years...I never see or hear from the government regarding my healthcare. Wanna know what else I never see??

Of course you do.

So, who controls when/where/how/why for your medical issues?

the UK is the same as Canada (Deadcalm) by the looks of it - we get to decide, along with the doctors recommendation. There are waiting lists but nothing too long if it is urgent.






deadcalm
Yeah...it's our southern neighbor....the rot and corruption there has been spreading all over the globe....we in Canada haven't escaped it either.

Deflecting does very little for me.
Care to answer the question?



deadcalm
It's not like I'm paying his mortgage...car payments..food costs....LOL. But yes....I don't care if a part of my tax dollars go to keeping my neighbor healthy and well. After all....he's doing the same for me.

If you don't care about paying for someone else's medical needs, why stop there? I mean, it is in fact only compassionate to have everyone be able to eat, have a home and clothing.
But, in a sense you are paying for them, or at the very least offsetting their financial obligations so they can pay for other items.


deadcalm

Ok...you lost me.

Maybe you should actually go and research the bible that you quoted from.

You know, the part about Cain and Able.

I know that Progressives like to pull things out of context and use them as talking points, but we really need to stop with the "brothers keeper" crap and actually show it for what it meant.




edit on 19-3-2014 by macman because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 01:48 PM
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reply to post by Serdgiam
 

I think that there is.

Nothing stops you from directly helping people.



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 01:49 PM
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reply to post by deadcalm
 


So the Govt can't step in and control who you see, what procedures you get or anything else? It just smiles, pays the bill and moves on.

Yeah, I don't believe that.



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 01:50 PM
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macman
reply to post by deadcalm
 


Well, you have a solid point. We are taxed greatly, with little to show for it. Does that maybe show that Govt, when allowed to grow, encroaches on every aspect???


And it really troubles me that you are fine with people being taxed higher, just because they earn more.

Guess that taxes are punitive in nature and you are fine with that.


That would depend on whether you think your Govt is broken, which if it is, it is up to you to fix it. Maybe then you'd be less cynical about our way of life. We are happy, you really don't seem to be.

With regard to taxes, I guess it is a different ethos - everything is proportionate. Why would someone earning £10,000 pay the same tax as someone who earns £100,000? Maybe in our nations we have an outlook of looking after eachother,where you want to live in a nation that everyone looks after number one. That doesn't seem to be working out too great for you though.



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 01:54 PM
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deadcalm

I OBJECT!! LOL

I didn't deflect anything...you made a statement and I commented on it. There was no question.

Here is what you said...

So, we are on Jeopardy now and I must pose it in the form of a question.
Is your Govt encroaching on certain rights/freedoms?
Are you okay with said encroachment?







deadcalm

We don't. We go way further....we actually have subsidised housing for the poor, welfare, workers compensation, subsidised daycare programs, old folks homes...we pay for a lot of things through our taxes....how in the hell can we afford to do this kinda stuff you ask??

And you think it is fair that someone foots the bill for this crap? Basically so someone else can fund others lives.



deadcalm
We don't blow 5 trillion dollars on wars that gain us nothing. We don't spend 700 BILLION a year blowing other countries back into the stone age.

You might want to review what roll your Country/Govt has in regards to the wars. Seems Canadian Forces are/were there with others.


deadcalm
Let me try and boil this down simply for you.

As a Canadian...I don't want the government to be an anchor around my neck pushing my nation closer to bankruptcy everyday.

So, just have the Rich foot the bill?



deadcalm

If we have to have a government at all then I want it's focus to be on the betterment of the society we are building for ALL OF US. Thats what a government should do....SERVE IT's CITIZENS. Not the other way around.

A radical concept, I know.

A Govt that provides can take away.
Sounds very much like you are fine being dependent upon your Govt.



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 01:55 PM
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deadcalm



I'm not sure how many more times you need me to tell you that?
reply to post by bluesilver
 


Be gentle with him. It's hard for him to grasp how we could want to live like we do in Canada....when you've been told all your life you are number 1 at everything...everyone else is wrong and you're right. That your model of government is the best, and everyone else wants to be just like you...it takes a complete paradigm shift....that isn't easy.

It's not his fault.



I know...but it is hard to keep trying to explain the same things over and over again.... Canada, the UK, most of Europe really..we all seem to have the same idea, which works, which is cheap...and yet he just doesn't seem to understand... he just seems to think there is some conspiracy about it...or just can't understand why we might actually like helping eachother...why it is actually a good idea to do it like we do..... I know to us it just seems normal and civilised, so I just can't understand why he thinks this is a bad thing...just baffling...



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 01:56 PM
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reply to post by amazing
 


How about we cut it all?
You know, move towards what the Constitution states as the role of the Govt?

Military funding is actually part of what the Govt was designed to take care of.



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 01:57 PM
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the UK is the same as Canada (Deadcalm) by the looks of it - we get to decide, along with the doctors recommendation. There are waiting lists but nothing too long if it is urgent.
reply to post by bluesilver
 


I lived in GB for a year...our healthcare systems are rather similar for sure. Not really surprising though...we based our government directly off the English paliamentary model....ties between our nations run deep...on many levels....not just healthcare.




Maybe you should actually go and research the bible that you quoted from.


You can direct your ire to me for that....I hadn't realized that there was some huge controversy over it. I was using it in the context of Canadian healthcare...we look after each other...hence we are our brothers keeper. I thought it was appropriate...perhaps I was mistaken.

I really don't like religion at all so I won't be burying my nose in a bible any time soon.



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 02:01 PM
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macman
reply to post by deadcalm
 


So the Govt can't step in and control who you see, what procedures you get or anything else? It just smiles, pays the bill and moves on.

Yeah, I don't believe that.


YES!!!!! You've got it. it is like this. That is what we are trying to tell you.

You go to the doctor, he tells you why you are feeling like you are and what can be done to help. You listen to his suggestions, decide how you want to proceed and then you get on a waiting list. Your position on the list is decided by the urgency of your need. If you want to speed it up you can go private and pay. Entirely up to you.

You will get a letter from the hospital, we have 2 in the area, and it will tell you the date of your operation. You go to the hospital, you get to see a consultant and they explain the procedure to you. You have the operation, you stay in hospital for a bit and then you leave. You may have to go and pick up a prescription for medication and depending on your circumstances you may have you pay around £10-£20 or so. Or free.

Once you are home, depending on what you were in for, you will get a home visit by a doctor (or nurse) to see how you are. This may happen on more than one occasion, again depending on what you were in for.

This is our health service. This is available to everyone. This is why we love it.

The cost for this, based on a wage of £25,000 is around £80 per month.



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 02:02 PM
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reply to post by deadcalm
 


So, earn more, pay more is fine with you?

So much for everyone paying their "fair" share.



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 02:03 PM
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reply to post by bluesilver
 


If you want to be compassionate, you can.

As it is right now, you have no choice.

There seems to be a big difference there.



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 02:04 PM
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deadcalm



the UK is the same as Canada (Deadcalm) by the looks of it - we get to decide, along with the doctors recommendation. There are waiting lists but nothing too long if it is urgent.
reply to post by bluesilver
 


I lived in GB for a year...our healthcare systems are rather similar for sure. Not really surprising though...we based our government directly off the English paliamentary model....ties between our nations run deep...on many levels....not just healthcare.

We've always wanted to visit Canada actually. I've heard from friends that it's a great place


[
edit on 19-3-2014 by bluesilver because: no reason



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 02:04 PM
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reply to post by deadcalm
 


The amount of money thrown at Poverty now shows that Govt can't do it. It is a waste.

More money does not mean a better outcome.



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 02:05 PM
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macman
So much for everyone paying their "fair" share.

"Fair" in Canada, in regards to taxation, is defined by equal burden, not equal rates.
2nd.



posted on Mar, 19 2014 @ 02:07 PM
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macman
reply to post by bluesilver
 


If you want to be compassionate, you can.

As it is right now, you have no choice.

There seems to be a big difference there.


Ok...deep breath......

WE CHOOSE TO HAVE THIS SYSTEM.... At this point I'm tempted to start doing diagrams if it helps you understand..?

I'll try it again...

We have a choice because we CHOOSE to have this system. It is what we want. It is what we would fight for. Everyone in the country wants it. If a GOVT tried to take it away there would be riots. Why do you think so many countries HAVE this sytem?



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