I think Jesus warned the 12 disciples against apostle Paul in Matthew 24:26

Jesus gave us this warning and I can't help but notice it seems to match the circumstances leading to Paul's conversion while on his way to Damascus (Acts 9:3-5)

Matthew 24:26
"So if anyone tells you, 'There he is, out in the wilderness,' do not go out; or, 'Here he is, in the inner rooms,' do not believe it.


The place immediately surrounding Damascus is a desert (wilderness):

bibleatlas.org...

The Greek word used in Matthew 24:26 to describe "wilderness" is ἐρήμῳ which means desolate, lonely, solitary. A desert is as desolate as it can be.

biblehub.com...
nlp.perseus.tufts.edu...)rh%2Fmw%7C&la=greek&can=e)rh%2Fmw%7C0&prior=th=%7C

Acts 9 describes Paul nearing Damascus in his journey when he encountered a supernatural event which he claimed to be an encounter with Jesus which clearly puts him in the desert wilderness.

Paul's conversion experience cross references in Acts:

biblehub.com...

In some of these cross referenced verses, Paul is practically telling other people that he saw Jesus in the wilderness (the place near Damascus)!!




Given the many apparent contradictions of the teachings of Paul against the teachings of Jesus, it doesn't seem surprising that Paul would match person(s) Jesus warned us about in Matthew 24:26!

And it gives us confirmation those contradictory teachings of Paul, are not just apparent, they absolutely contradictory!

Gee even I the religious ignorant on the panel knows the gospel was written after Jesus was already dead. A little late for a warning don't you think?

reply to post by ahnggk

I think Paul gave the same warnings Jesus did in Mathew 13 .Peter along with others acknowledged Paul as a brother in the faith .peace

reply to post by ahnggk

"So if anyone tells you, 'There he is, out in the wilderness,' do not go out; or, 'Here he is, in the inner rooms,' do not believe it.

The world is filled with self proclaimed "Saviors".

Donnn't choo believe them.

Its that simple, imo.

ahnggk


And it gives us confirmation those contradictory teachings of Paul, are not just apparent, they absolutely contradictory!

What is the contradiction? Do the teachings of Paul tell us to murder our neighbors? Please list what you feel the difference in the teachings and the contradiction is.

Oh my goodness gracious me, how can you take a text like that and botch up the meaning so badly.
Oh I know, quote it completely out of context.

Jesus wasnt talking about Paul. Paul never claimed to be the Messiah

4Jesus answered: “Watch out that no one deceives you. 5For many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am the Messiah,’ and will deceive many. 6You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come. 7Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. 8All these are the beginning of birth pains.

9“Then you will be handed over to be persecuted and put to death, and you will be hated by all nations because of me. 10At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, 11and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. 12Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, 13but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved. 14And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.

15“So when you see standing in the holy place ‘the abomination that causes desolation,’a spoken of through the prophet Daniel—let the reader understand— 16then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. 17Let no one on the housetop go down to take anything out of the house. 18Let no one in the field go back to get their cloak. 19How dreadful it will be in those days for pregnant women and nursing mothers! 20Pray that your flight will not take place in winter or on the Sabbath. 21For then there will be great distress, unequaled from the beginning of the world until now—and never to be equaled again.

22“If those days had not been cut short, no one would survive, but for the sake of the elect those days will be shortened. 23At that time if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Messiah!’ or, ‘There he is!’ do not believe it. 24For false messiahs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25See, I have told you ahead of time.

26“So if anyone tells you, ‘There he is, out in the wilderness,’ do not go out; or, ‘Here he is, in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it. 27For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man. 28Wherever there is a carcass, there the vultures will gather.

29“Immediately after the distress of those days

“ ‘the sun will be darkened,
and the moon will not give its light;
the stars will fall from the sky,
and the heavenly bodies will be shaken.’b
30“Then will appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven. And then all the peoples of the earthc will mourn when they see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory.d 31And he will send his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.

32“Now learn this lesson from the fig tree: As soon as its twigs get tender and its leaves come out, you know that summer is near. 33Even so, when you see all these things, you know that ite is near, right at the door. 34Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened. 35Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away.

wait a second,,,you mean the bible is written in code,,,how foolish of me for thinking the average person should be able to understand its meanings,,,luckly we have a whole industry & class of people too tell us its meanings

Matthew 23:34-36

34 Therefore, indeed, I send you prophets, wise men, and scribes: some of them you will kill and crucify, and some of them you will scourge in your synagogues and persecute from city to city...

This is where Paul comes in...

IMHO. Only those who have not studied the bible in depth see a contradiction between Jesus teachings, and Paul's teachings. They are, in effect, the same teachings. Keep in mind the dividing line that separates Judaism and Christianity. Before Christs death, legalism reigned supreme. After Christ's death, came grace, liberty, and the law of love.

Matthew 9:13

13 But go and learn what this means: ‘I desire mercy and not sacrifice...

reply to post by ahnggk


The verse(s) you cited refers to Jesus' return to Earth at His 2nd Advent. He was warning us not to embrace a false messiah. Moses met God in the wilderness does that make him a false prophet too? The fact is, this verse has nothing to do with Paul.

The only time Paul's teachings contradict Jesus' words are when people take individual lines out of context. Taking stuff out of context is easy to do. Conducting a critical analysis of scripture requires a functioning brain.

Klassified
Matthew 23:34-36

34 Therefore, indeed, I send you prophets, wise men, and scribes: some of them you will kill and crucify, and some of them you will scourge in your synagogues and persecute from city to city...

This is where Paul comes in...

IMHO. Only those who have not studied the bible in depth see a contradiction between Jesus teachings, and Paul's teachings. They are, in effect, the same teachings. Keep in mind the dividing line that separates Judaism and Christianity. Before Christs death, legalism reigned supreme. After Christ's death, came grace, liberty, and the law of love.

Matthew 9:13

13 But go and learn what this means: ‘I desire mercy and not sacrifice...

I've studied the bible in depth and I don't find Paul and Jesus to have the same teachings

Interesting that you used hat passage from Matthew 9 though...

consider this...

Acts 21:26

26 Then Paul took the men, and the next day purifying himself with them entered into the temple, to signify the accomplishment of the days of purification, until that an offering should be offered for every one of them.

Jesus said sacrifice wasn't necessary, Yet it seems Paul returned to blood sacrifices after Jesus died...

hmmm....

No, that is not what the passage means. It means its not out there in the world, its not in the real sky, its not in the real outer dust, shadow distortion hologram, where the second coming will occur.

Its in our hearts, inner. Go within. The kingdom of heaven is within. Earth is a mirror. Deal with the man/woman in the mirror, for our inner Michael defeats our inner dragon.

reply to post by ahnggk

Matthew 24:26
"So if anyone tells you, 'There he is, out in the wilderness,' do not go out; or, 'Here he is, in the inner rooms,' do not believe it.

Jesus wasn't talking about himself, he was talking about "false messiahs and false prophets".
What he was talking about was the people who led the revolt against the Romans which resulted in the fall of Jerusalem and the destruction of the temple.

Given the many apparent contradictions of the teachings of Paul against the teachings of Jesus . . .

Could you mention what one of those might be?

reply to post by Akragon

consider this...

Acts 21:26

Acts was written probably a hundred years after when these events supposedly happened.
The Paul of Acts contradicts the real Paul who wrote Romans, 1 & 2 Corinthians, Galatians, 1 Thessalonians, Philippians, and Philemon.

reply to post by Akragon

Ahhhh yes. The infamous Acts 21:26. There's much I could say to this, but I'll keep it brief. I have two different thoughts on this. First, from Paul's own teachings, he was well aware that he could not be justified by following the law. I see Paul's actions here as an "all things to all men" kind of thing. For him, it was a symbolic action that he could later use to preach the gospel to those he was with. In this way, he could teach them why it was in the law to start with. Paul did not sin, or go against Christ in his actions here imo, except to those with legalistic minds, and an unwillingness to understand the Christian concepts of grace and liberty.

Maybe we should throw out Peter's writings as well, since he denied Jesus 3 times, tried to idolize Moses and Elijah, played the hypocrite with the Christian Jews later in his life, and told god he wouldn't eat what god presented to him, because it was unclean. On top of that, he supported Paul, and wrote about those who didn't understand Paul's writings...
2Peter3

15 and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation—as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, 16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

Just my thoughts on the matter, my friend. You and I have discussed this before. I don't think either of us is going to change the others mind on this. It's just one of those "agree to disagree" subjects.

AutumnWitch657
Gee even I the religious ignorant on the panel knows the gospel was written after Jesus was already dead. A little late for a warning don't you think?

The warning is still needed today. Despite the fact you are pointing out, you will still notice there are two Gospels in the Bible. The original four Gospels against the epistles of Paul, lots of contradiction between the two.

Why would there be tons of contradictions if it were the same and all the authors heard the same Gospel?

intrptr
The world is filled with self proclaimed "Saviors".

Donnn't choo believe them.

Its that simple, imo.

Paul is a self-proclaimed apostle and many fell for that despite what many of the claims of Paul doesn't always hold true in real life (twisted logic):

www.voiceofjesus.org...

PsychoEmperor
What is the contradiction? Do the teachings of Paul tell us to murder our neighbors? Please list what you feel the difference in the teachings and the contradiction is.

It's quite an extensive list so I'll just give you a link:

www.jesuswordsonly.com...

Klassified

IMHO. Only those who have not studied the bible in depth see a contradiction between Jesus teachings, and Paul's teachings. They are, in effect, the same teachings. Keep in mind the dividing line that separates Judaism and Christianity. Before Christs death, legalism reigned supreme. After Christ's death, came grace, liberty, and the law of love.

I've been a Christian for more than 20 years, most that time, I believed Paul to be a true Apostle. But it wasn't until I took an in-depth study of the Bible or New Testament specifically, through cross-referencing and in Greek that I realized the contradictions are irrefutable and that the claims of Paul are as worthless and easily blown away by circumstances as sand.

Akragon

Matthew 9:13

13 But go and learn what this means: ‘I desire mercy and not sacrifice...

I've studied the bible in depth and I don't find Paul and Jesus to have the same teachings

Interesting that you used hat passage from Matthew 9 though...

consider this...

Acts 21:26

26 Then Paul took the men, and the next day purifying himself with them entered into the temple, to signify the accomplishment of the days of purification, until that an offering should be offered for every one of them.

Jesus said sacrifice wasn't necessary, Yet it seems Paul returned to blood sacrifices after Jesus died...

hmmm....

Paul makes a clown of the Gospel if you stand by Paul's teachings.

It brings no good, undermines it and gives a very good reason for unbelievers, Atheists, etc to mock and doubt the religion due to the many contradictions that are too obvious and too devious to defend!

Which sadly prevents them from seeing any credibility in Christianity.


Paul practically, gave Satan a foothold in Christianity.

reply to post by ahnggk

I've been a Christian for more than 20 years, most that time, I believed Paul to be a true Apostle. But it wasn't until I took an in-depth study of the Bible or New Testament specifically, through cross-referencing and in Greek that I realized the contradictions are irrefutable and that the claims of Paul are as worthless and easily blown away by circumstances as sand.

I was a preaching, teaching, street witnessing, Christian for decades. Biblically, Paul's teachings are no further off the mark than any of the other epistles. As I mentioned previously, Peter seemed to think Paul was a "beloved brother", and said very plainly...

as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, 16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

So...
1. Peter was a liar?
2. Peter didn't write that?
3. You are doing exactly what Peter said some do when they find certain teachings hard to understand.

reply to post by Klassified

Just my thoughts on the matter, my friend. You and I have discussed this before. I don't think either of us is going to change the others mind on this. It's just one of those "agree to disagree" subjects

not my intention brother...

As always I can only say, stick to the gospels and these issues are easily avoided

Paul said nothing Jesus didn't cover... Thus, his writing is useless in my opinion

You don't have to toss out anything... Keep Paul close to your heart, and peter if you will

I shall stick to the only man who Knows God

Klassified
So...
1. Peter was a liar?
2. Peter didn't write that?
3. You are doing exactly what Peter said some do when they find certain teachings hard to understand.

edit on 3/11/2014 by Klassified because: clarity

I don't trust Peter either.

Remember when Jesus asked Peter 3x, "do you love me?", Peter said "yes" 3x, but also broke his word a little while later??



And again in John 21, Jesus asked Peter 3x "do you love me? then feed my sheep" shortly before Jesus went back to the Father in Heaven.

A prophecy that Peter will fail to "feed the sheep"?? "Feeding the sheep" is a figure of speech for preaching the Truth (God's Words) to God's children.



Why would Jesus ask Peter the same thing 3x? A sign that Peter will fail for he will welcome a deceiver with them and be deceived himself that will cause him to fail to preach the Truth?

Does Jesus not fully trust Peter? Note in John 21, it hurt Peter to hear Jesus ask him the same thing 3x.

reply to post by ahnggk


To me Paul do not add anything good with his books to Jesus teaching just muddy the water. On a dualistic/non dualistic scale Jesus message goes towards non dualistic/symbiosis without garmenttation (pure spirituality not a dualistic group) while Paul (the scripture written as the person Paul) create duality and garmented laws that sound close to Jesus preaching.

“I like your Christ. I do not like your Christians. They are so unlike your Christ.” Gandhi

1 Corinthians 5 Paul teaching judgement.

1Does any one of you, when he has a case against his neighbor, dare to go to law before the unrighteous and not before the saints? 2Or do you not know that the saints will judge the world? If the world is judged by you, are you not competent to constitute the smallest law courts? 3Do you not know that we will judge angels? How much more matters of this life? 4So if you have law courts dealing with matters of this life, do you appoint them as judges who are of no account in the church? 5I say this to your shame. Is it so, that there is not among you one wise man who will be able to decide between his brethren, 6but brother goes to law with brother, and that before unbelievers? 7Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded 8On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren. 9Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. 11Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God. 12All things are lawful for me, but not all things are profitable. All things are lawful for me, but I will not be mastered by anything.

John 8, Jesus teaching the golden rule leaving judgement to god. Knowing the current karma is a work in progress.

1But Jesus went to the Mount of Olives. 2Early in the morning He came again into the temple, and all the people were coming to Him; and He sat down and began to teach them. 3The scribes and the Pharisees brought a woman caught in adultery, and having set her in the center of the court, 4they said to Him, "Teacher, this woman has been caught in adultery, in the very act. 5"Now in the Law Moses commanded us to stone such women; what then do You say?" 6They were saying this, testing Him, so that they might have grounds for accusing Him. But Jesus stooped down and with His finger wrote on the ground. 7But when they persisted in asking Him, He straightened up, and said to them, "He who is without sin among you, let him be the first to throw a stone at her." 8Again He stooped down and wrote on the ground. 9When they heard it, they began to go out one by one, beginning with the older ones, and He was left alone, and the woman, where she was, in the center of the court. 10Straightening up, Jesus said to her, "Woman, where are they? Did no one condemn you?" 11She said, "No one, Lord." And Jesus said, "I do not condemn you, either. Go. From now on sin no more."

In the whole Christian vs homosexuals debate that goes on Paul will be the hater of even karmaless symbiotic behavior since it is not Paul:s cup of tea while Jesus will know throwing a stone is a sin. The Karma is for god to know and god to judge not people like Paul who are blinded by duality hate. The whole take out the blockage in the third eye bit.

Paul have nothing to teach me except how to put yourself/group on a pedestal and hate dualisticly those who do not want to behave according to this persons judgment. He even thinks he will Judge angels/blessed ONES. Foolish on a level beyond compare. And in the end all is law full to him since he is Paul (talk about ego corruption).

Jesus is boxless, Paul is boxed. From my point of view Paul is the goat creater and the sheep are many times not calling themselves Christians since they do not like the hypocrisy of the goats.

You can tell see that the fruit of Christian faith was never pure when you look at the actions of those that said the where followers of Jesus.