Ukraine's Military Mobilizes, Prepares For Combat: Trucks, APCs, SAMs, Howitzers, Tanks Rolling Out

TritonTaranis

No one is ignoring the wishes of the people in the Ukraine, but to be fair, every time the wind blows, it seems the Ukrainian peoples wishes change with it. Perhaps if they weren't so flighty in their wishes and had a modicum of compromise as we ALL have to do in the world and in our private lives, there wouldn't be such turmoil in the region.

edit on 10-3-2014 by alphabetaone because: (no reason given)

No one? Who is the people of Ukraine? Kharkov is part of Ukraine? Klicsko is Ukrainian?

Yesterday Klicsko was visiting Kharkov and was welcomed with rain of eggs from his Euromaidan-supporters. Guess why?

Let's examine all of this for a minute and see what's what shall we:

TritonTaranis

I you can't see the Ukrainians people wishes hasn't budged one bit just like there boarders then I'm sorry but you're either incredibly [snip] or just plan [snip]

Do you truly expect that you could elicit some form of aggravation on my part with this? Not going to happen.

TritonTaranis


Either way if I said jump Im willing to bet you could be persuaded,

Don't lose sleep or quit your day job hoping for THAT ship to come in lol.

TritonTaranis


you and other are like dogs chasing your tails

Let's see, I make a LOT of money, I am happy, I treat everyone around me with fairness, and I have previously spent 20 years of my life cleaning up the messes that people like you tend to incite without once ever asking for a thank you OR a paycheck for it....so where is it again that I am chasing my tail?

To specifically address (leaving your atrocious grammar out of the equation) the "you and other", in terms you may just understand, WUT? Are you proposing I am schizophrenic or something? "Today me and other went to the mall".

TritonTaranis

simply because you fail to see there are many thousands of Russian illegally occupying Ukrainian, of course the Ukrainian people keep changing there minds *ROLLS EYES*

I don't fail to see anything, you are simply wrong. Every day it seems there is some oppression in the Ukraine that the rest of the world "needs to help with"...in a post a few back, someone said "shouldn't the Ukraine as a sovereign nation be able to decide for themselves what is best?" to which I absolutely agree, they should.

So, I say LET them decide....and if they decide they don't like Russia, let THEM (the Ukrainian people ONLY) take up arms against the aggressors and when they lose, they will NOW have lost their entire country and not just Crimea and then they can be happy because they "tried".

Why fight the us and Russia when you can make them fight one another? It is the nazis I'm telling everyone of you.

Acidx
Why fight the us and Russia when you can make them fight one another? It is the nazis I'm telling everyone of you.

edit on 11-3-2014 by Acidx because: (no reason given)

Is that the ones that own all the central banks and have made European countries go to war in the historic past because it was profitable for their family? Or do you mean the ones that tried to keep Ukraine free from control by international forces?

Op-ed from the Moscow Times

Op-ed from the Moscow Times - Top 5 Myths About Russia's Invasion of Crimea
By Michael Bohm
Mar. 11 2014 00:00
Last edited 21:46

1. There was no invasion.

Media from all over the world have reported testimonials from soldiers in Crimean cities who are dressed and armed exactly like those in the Russian Army — minus the insignia. They have seized airports, border crossings and administrative buildings, and are pressuring Ukrainian soldiers stationed in Crimea to surrender. Yet, President Vladimir Putin insists that the estimated 15,000 soldiers who have seized Crimea are local Crimean "self-defense forces."

2. Russians are in danger in Crimea.

There is no evidence that Ukrainians in Crimea ­— and certainly not Crimean Tatars — support Right Sector, Svoboda or other far-right, anti-Russian groups whose base of support is limited largely to the Western regions of Ukraine. Nor is there any evidence, despite Russia’s claims, of “Ukrainian fascists” coming to Crimea to carry out attacks against Russians there. Even a group of Ukrainian Jewish leaders wrote an open letter to Putin on Thursday, admonishing the Kremlin not to exaggerate the fascist threat in Ukraine.

3. Ukrainian revolutionary armed groups invaded Crimea.

This was the other justification for the Federation Council’s decision to approve military intervention. The Foreign Ministry claimed that on Feb. 28, forces loyal to the new government in Kiev attempted to seize Crimea’s Interior Ministry building in Simferopol. This attempt to fabricate a casus belli was a complete failure.

4. The revolution in Kiev was unconstitutional.

By shifting the focus to the “unconstitutional” nature of the revolution and trying to paint it as a “fascist coup,” Putin is trying to conceal the fact that the Maidan protests were, in fact, a widespread, moderate and grassroots movement that rose up against ousted President Viktor Yanukovych’s rampant corruption, lawlessness and autocracy.

It is odd that Putin is choosing a legal argument to oppose the ousting of Yanukovych. What, then, is the legal foundation for Russia’s military intervention in Crimea?

5. Crimea wants to be a part of Russia.

Crimeans, including ethnic Russians, joined the overwhelming majority of Russians in supporting independence from Moscow after the failed coup in August 1991. Little has changed since then. Independence from Russia is still highly valued by most Ukrainian citizens, including those in Crimea and the eastern regions of the country.

There was never any serious separatist movement to speak of in Ukraine – until Russia stoked the issue of annexing Crimea after Yanukovych was ousted. Still, only the nationalist Russian Unity party in Crimea, which holds just three of the 100 seats in the Crimean parliament, and pensioners, whose only criteria for supporting annexation is that their meager pensions might increase, support the idea of joining Russia. Notably, Sergei Aksyonov ­— who was installed as prime minister of Crimea on Feb. 27 after a group of armed men seized the parliamentary building in Simferopol ­— is a leader of Russian Unity.

When anchors of one of Russia’s top propaganda outlets start risking their careers by protesting the Kremlin’s crude manipulation of the truth on air, this shows that the Kremlin has taken its distortions, myths and lies about the Crimean invasion way too far.

Click link for remainder of article / expanded information for each section.


Thoughts?

reply to post by Xcathdra


Ukraine names Oligarchs and Gangsters as Governors and Ministers

What we get instead is what I can only describe as one shade to the right of old Soviet Red Terror propaganda. So far the public response has me worried. There isn't much, and I can assure you the bad guys are making notes on that.

Read carefully:

“Ukraine, a new and important space on the Eurasian chessboard, is a geopolitical pivot because its very existence as an independent country helps to transform Russia.

Without Ukraine, Russia ceases to be a Eurasian empire. Russia without Ukraine…would then become a predominantly Asian imperial state, more likely to be drawn into debilitating conflicts with aroused Central Asians, who…would be supported by their fellow Islamic states to the south…

if Moscow regains control over Ukraine, with its 52 million people and major resources as well as its access to the Black Sea, Russia automatically again regains the wherewithal to become a powerful imperial state, spanning Europe and Asia.”

Zbigniew Brzezinski, The Grand Chessboard: American Primacy and it’s Geostrategic Imperatives, New York: Basic Books, 1997, p. 46.

reply to post by maghun


Its to bad that Ukraine is sovereign.

Russia is ramping up the push to justify action in E. Ukraine though - All Pravda sources

Pravda - In Ukraine, two people sitting in a café shot from Kalashnikov

In a café in Kharkov, unknown individuals shot two people from a Kalashnikov.

The incident occurred at Norma "café," at the intersection of Lenin Avenue and Bakulina Street. Kharkov Attorney Eugene Popovich confirmed the incident. "I can confirm that there are victims," said the prosecutor.

According to eyewitnesses, the shooter drove up to the cafe and made the first shot at a man, who was sitting at table. The man was killed on the spot. His companion was wounded, and was still alive at the time when ER doctors arrived, but later died. A cafe waiter was also injured. The offender left his weapon on the crime scene.

According to preliminary information, one of those killed was Evgeni Slonevsky - a man related to of the largest conversion center in Kharkov. Through the center, many businessmen cashed their assets to avoid paying high taxes.

Ukraine strengthens control over railway stations and highways

The Ukrainian Cabinet of Ministers instructed the State Border Service to strengthen control over the movement of persons on a number of railway stations and highways.

In particular, measures will be taken to control the movement of objects on the railways (Kherson, Vadim, Novoalekseevka, Melitopol) and highways (Chaplinka, Kalanchak, Salkovo).

Click link for remainder of article

All inside of Ukraine and outside of Crimea... Guess we are getting close to the invasions of E. Ukraine by Russia. I'm thinking it is going to occur shortly after Russia is done filling out those Crimean ballots.


Maidan activists take Russian Embassy in Kiev under control
Yet there is absolutely no evidence to support this. There is nothing listed on the United Nations site, No western media and no independent media from various regions who have nothing to do with Ukraine.


Ukraine's nationalist movement Right Sector to start political activities
I was wondering how long it would take for Russia to link Chechnya into the mix.



Explosion occurs near Crimean Parliament in Ukraine amid two mass rallies
Apparently a firecracker went off. Russia is insinuating the firecracker caused the death of an old man from a heart attack.


Russian troops take Sevastopol Airport in Ukraine's Crimea under control
Occurred at the end of February. Apparently Russian media forget to use the term "self defense force".

Can anyone find western media / 3rd party media covering the same stories

reply to post by Xcathdra

Is it an invasion by Russia or is it exercising its legitimate right to protect its interests and Russians there? Viktor Yanukovych was elected. The opposition that toppled him also claims they did so in the name of the people. The independence and protection of Russia that Crimea has sought is also from the will of the people. Those two things seem contradictory. What is real democracy? Each has its own reasoning, while the one who dominates is determined by power.

I'm confused...

“While I deplore any kind of state propaganda and hate speech as part of the current information war, everyone has the right to receive information from as many sources as he or she wishes,” Mijatovic said. “Switching off and banning channels is not the way to address these problems; any potentially problematic speech should be countered with arguments and more speech.”

OSCE slams Ukraine’s repressive censorship of Russian TV channels

The new "democratic" cabal is so concerned about truth, that they shut down liar channels...

But wait, why don't investigate the event that kills 100+ people?

Ashton sounds taken aback by his remarks: "I think we do want to investigate. I mean I didn't know. I didn't pick that up. Gosh."

How should I vote on Scottish independence referendum from Kosovo?

reply to post by Xcathdra


Wiki on Crimea:

This section is missing information about the details regarding the referendums promoted by the Crimean parliament in 1992 and 1994, the tensions these created in Kiev, Kiev's reasons to deter them, the required majority vote for the referendums, and Tatar repatriation and population distribution at the time. Please expand the section to include this information. Further details may exist on the talk page. (March 2014)

Reuters is RT?

(Reuters) - Ukraine's Crimea region has invited the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe (OSCE) to send a mission to observe Sunday's referendum on joining Russia, Russia's RIA news agency said on Monday.

Turkey has just now western-type "democratic" problems: corrupt government with leaked phone calls behind. I doubt they want to interfere with Russia now, because the next orange revolution could be sponsored by Putin with kurdish support...

reply to post by maghun


Not sure what you are talking about.. I went back and checked my post where I stated the sources were Russian, and they still are. Pravda.

So im not sure what you are talking about?

reply to post by Xcathdra

Xcathdra

edit on 12-3-2014 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)

Cannot qoute from emptied post, but the answares are the same.

maghun
reply to post by Xcathdra

 

Xcathdra

edit on 12-3-2014 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)

Cannot qoute from emptied post, but the answares are the same.

Cannot quote from emptied post, but the answers are the same.
(I'm trying to write correctly, but does not always succeed)

maghun

maghun
reply to post by Xcathdra

 

Xcathdra

edit on 12-3-2014 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)

Cannot qoute from emptied post, but the answares are the same.

Cannot quote from emptied post, but the answers are the same.
(I'm trying to write correctly, but does not always succeed)

Its cool man.. no worries.

I'm still not quite sure what you are referencing though.

I will ask my question again: How many of you posters are Ukrainian/Russian speakers/readers getting your information firsthand? How many are depending on translations?
I ask this because some have spoken quite forcefully about what seems to be going on and using only English speaking sources. I have a best friend who speaks/reads Russian and since Ukrainian is very close can translate most of it as well. His perception after watching several videos posted that are "translated" is that these are not always translated accurately at all.
Some seem quite sure they "know" what happened in Kiev, they "know" what the Ukraine constitution says, and the laws of Ukraine and Crimea so I ask---how do you "know" if you cannot read the original documents?

diggindirt
Some seem quite sure they "know" what happened in Kiev, they "know" what the Ukraine constitution says, and the laws of Ukraine and Crimea so I ask---how do you "know" if you cannot read the original documents?

People on BOTH sides are doing this so.


Source - Office of the President Constitution of Ukraine - English
United Nations - Documents / Publications / Treaties
Constitution of Ukraine - Title X The Autonomous Republic of Crimea

Article 134. The Autonomous Republic of Crimea shall be an integral constituent part of Ukraine and shall resolve issues relegated to its authority within the frame of its reference, determined by the Constitution of Ukraine.

Article 137 and 138 are the "can do's" for Crimea - if you notice what Crimea / Russia is doing violates the Ukrainian Constitution.


Constitution of Ukraine - Title III Elections. Referendum

Article 73. Alterations to the territory of Ukraine shall be resolved exclusively by the All-Ukrainian referendum.

Constitution of Ukraine - Title XIII Making Amendments to the Constitution of Ukraine

Article 154. A draft law on making amendments to the Constitution of Ukraine may be submitted to the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine by the President of Ukraine or by the people’s deputies of Ukraine comprising at least one-third of the constitutional membership of the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine.

Article 155. A draft law on making amendments to the Constitution of Ukraine, except for Title I General Principles, Title III Elections, Referendum, and Title XIII Making Amendments to the Constitution of Ukraine, previously adopted by the majority of the constitutional membership of the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine, shall be deemed adopted, if at least two-thirds of the constitutional members of the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine vote in its favour at the succeeding regular session of the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine.

Article 156. A draft law on making amendments to Title I General Principles, Title III Elections, Referendum, and Title XIII Making Amendments to the Constitution of Ukraine, shall be submitted to the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine by the President of Ukraine, or by not less than two-thirds of the constitutional membership of the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine, provided that it is adopted by at least two-thirds of the constitutional members of the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine, be approved by an All-Ukrainian referendum called by the President of Ukraine.

Resubmission of a draft law on making amendments to Titles I, III and XIII of this Constitution, addressing the same issue, shall be possible only at a succeeding convocation of the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine.

Article 157. The Constitution of Ukraine shall not be amended, if the amendments foresee the abolition or restriction of human and citizen rights and freedoms, or if they are aimed at the liquidation of the independence or violation of the territorial integrity of Ukraine.

The Constitution of Ukraine shall not be amended under the conditions of martial law or a state of emergency.

Article 158. The draft law on making amendments to the Constitution of Ukraine, having been considered by the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine and failing to be adopted, may be submitted to the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine no sooner than in one year from the day of the adoption of the decision on this draft law.

Within the term of its powers, the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine shall not amend twice the same provisions of the Constitution of Ukraine.

Article 159. A draft law on making amendments to the Constitution of Ukraine shall be considered by the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine upon the availability of an opinion of the Constitutional Court of Ukraine on the conformity of such draft law with the requirements of Articles 157 and 158 of this Constitution.

When you read their Constitution, it clearly spells out how things work, including how to remove a President and how to amend the Constitution, which does not need Presidential sign off. If people have issues with the Ukrainian Government Website being used as a source, we can always head over to the UN Website where its in their repository.



[align=center]Source - Office of the President Constitution of Ukraine - English[/align]

Quick Link - Ukrainian Constitution in English

Title I General Principles
Title II Human and Citizen Rights, Freedoms and Duties
Title III Elections. Referendum
Title IV The Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine
Title V The President of Ukraine
Chapter VI The Cabinet of Ministers of Ukraine. Other Executive Authorities
Title VII Public Prosecution
Title VIII Justice
Title IX Territorial Structure of Ukraine
Title X The Autonomous Republic of Crimea
Title XI Local Self-Government
Title XII The Constitutional Court of Ukraine
Title XIII Making Amendments to the Constitution of Ukraine
Title XIV Final Provisions
Chapter XV Transitional Provisions

2014 UNHCR regional operations profile - Eastern Europe| Overview |Ukraine

Did anyone hear about this aswell, Ukraine's gold getting taken?

Ukraine Gold Theft

reply to post by randomCache


A thread on another board totally lacking any actual sources beyond saying ther "are sources that say"??

No - I've not heard of that.

Stil wish I hadn't - do you notice how no-one there actually bothered to ask whether it was true or not, asked for the sources, looked for any corroborating information - they just all lept to the immediate conclusions that it was theft, and was by the USA!

It took me 5 seconds on google to find the source of the information - a pro-Russian newspaper that makes the claim without any supporting evidence at all.

It's probably as true as those Russian TV stories showing the riots in Kiev and claiming they were ethnic Russians being beaten up in Crimea!

reply to post by diggindirt


I'm Hungarian, I speak russian better than english. I have friends in Ukraine, the elders never move from living places all their lives and were citizens of Austro-Hungarian Empire, Czechoslovakia, Hungary, Soviet Union and now Ukraine, and they were allways hungarians, and "Kárpátalja" was part of Kingdom of Hungary for about 1.000 years according to the official history of the present.



Because the coup has been executed using paramilitary groups, the minorities are under phisical threat now. The Right Sector nazis now starting to terrorize hungarians, rusins, slovaks in the west. First just beaten, but they can kill anyone any time...



It always begins with monuments.

So much for freedom of speech in Russia -

Russia Bans Several Websites Critical of Gov't

Russia on Thursday banned several websites notable for their criticism of the government and a blog run by prominent opposition leader Alexei Navalny as the Kremlin intensified its crackdown on independent media amid tensions over Ukraine.

The government communications watchdog, Roskomnadzor, said Grani.ru, Kasparov.ru and Yezhednevny Zhurnal (Daily Journal) have carried incitements to unlawful behavior and participation in unauthorized mass gatherings. It said the ban was requested by the Prosecutor General's Office and Internet providers are now under instructions to implement the block.

Click link for remainder...

Crackdown on media...
Crackdown on individual freedoms...
Crackdown on protesting...
Armed military patrolling the streets...

** Putin address nation **
"Now witness the firepower of this fully ARMED and OPERATIONAL Russia!"

** Ukraines Response **
"Never. We will never turn to the Dark Side. You've failed, Putin. I am a Ukrainian, like my father before me."