Who are you with no ego and ambition, with no desire?

sn0rch

Lysergic
reply to post by onequestion

 

I am the universe experiencing itself.

What is the universe?

Why does it care about itself?

And what will it do when it realises that it's finite?

If we weren't observing the universe it wouldn't exist, vice versa.


I think the realizing something is for us.

reply to post by onequestion


What is it that you have realized 'Ambition really is' ?

reply to post by Bluesma

When I was younger, after a very difficult early childhood, my state of mind was very different than now. In trying to describe it to others, I often get some who say that that is the desirable state of enlightenment. I continue to find this questionable, as it was void of any emotional pleasure or appreciation of life. I find it hard to believe that people actually seek to become numb, and completely at the whim of others and their environment.

Bluesma,
That was your first take of the void. Had you adapted, embodied, and stabilized within that ground of Being, you would eventually find that it is also Love, Infinity, is prior to all but includes and allows all, you'd then be able to find the source of Love within yourself.....it's deeper than the first primary description...it changes and eventually reveals so much more.

"Emotional pleasure & appreciation" are static relatives to a subject. You experienced what is prior to all things which is naked and nothing could be said of it, & yet that void is the foundational building block of all that is. Since its infinite & ineffable, by its very nature it will be prior to all things and be void of anything but also include everything, as is the nature of infinity

To the OP:

The answer is that the end result is:
openness
spontaneity
flow
being
oneness
simultaneously all & none

Lysergic


If we weren't observing the universe it wouldn't exist, vice versa.


I think the realizing something is for us.

That makes me wonder, what is what you call the universe?

Lysergic

sn0rch

Lysergic
reply to post by onequestion

 

I am the universe experiencing itself.

What is the universe?

Why does it care about itself?

And what will it do when it realises that it's finite?

If we weren't observing the universe it wouldn't exist, vice versa.


I think the realizing something is for us.

I assume by "We" you mean life capable of having a concept of universe… What we call the universe would exist just fine without us, there simply would be no value applied to it.

In regard to the original post… Being without ego, ambition, desire? I think that would make you... boring. I've always felt bad for people who wanted to live their lives more like inanimate objects. Empirically there is no evidence to suggest we are supposed to live our lives like sentient rocks or trees, I think the rocks and trees have that covered. If anything based off of empirical observation… we are exactly what we should be and that is whatever the hell we feel like being.

Among other things like our ability to create and to have and be able to apply our will onto our known world, the capability to be what we choose to be places us in my opinion damn close to popular depictions of gods separated only by knowledge/known capability; Which brings me back to, why the hell would anyone want to be a rock?

reply to post by Strayed

I assume by "We" you mean life capable of having a concept of universe… What we call the universe would exist just fine without us, there simply would be no value applied to it.

You don't know that.

Its crazy to assume that.

reply to post by onequestion


You don't know for sure the universe wouldn't exist anymore either. But I assume it would. To think otherwise is absurd. Do explain why you think the universe wouldn't exist anymore if there would be no humans. When I die it continiues existing. I've seen other people die and the universe did not vanish.

Ofcourse, me being a creationist, God created man after he created earth.

Its not about having no ambition or goal. Though in this world, many come in to develop their higher abilities, and can't, blocked, run like a hellzone, the middle class slaves, they're a world minority and the rest fodder. No one developing their higher mind, communication, counselng, healing, teaching, inventing, designing or gaining admin and unity/diplomacy skills. When I say no one, always mean the majority on earth, couldn't care less about any form of minority including spiritual seekers, minority elitism is evil, so spiritual seekers who think they're all that following the Way are growing dark wings.

This planet is akin to having the answers, but limited in resources, and kind of bent out of shape due to wounds, so you're always on healing mode, keeping your family safe and protected, while doing yet one more sinkload of dishes, and your whole time is spent trying to clean up the whirlwind of messes, and intercede between family squabbles whether you work out or not. Not willing to ever come back for another load of dishes.

Now, back to the actual ambitions and goals. If you're doing your work, overcoming lower and base instincts and selfishness, striving like a salmon swimming upstream to nurture the spirit of peace and love in a world of war and greed. Then seeking within may open the doors to some of the work you're meant to do. On the other hand, for some, holding frequency, staying out of the limelight, so as not to get targetted, may be what is always arranged for you, against your conscious plans, whether you like it or not.

But we should be striving to see through the world and do the work we came to do, uncover it, whether its in the world or keeping soul family safe.

reply to post by oktopus


Its not absurd to think otherwise.

I don't think either which way but for sure i dont make the assertion of either. We really have NO idea.

onequestion
reply to post by Strayed

 

I assume by "We" you mean life capable of having a concept of universe… What we call the universe would exist just fine without us, there simply would be no value applied to it.

You don't know that.

Its crazy to assume that.

Evidence of simple life (life which had no capability to understand the concept of "universe") existing before "we" came into existence suggests more strongly that the universe doesn't need us than the baseless proposition "that the universe needs us to exist".

reply to post by onequestion


Well, I could say, if everybody dies, and there is just one person left, the death of that one person would make the universe go bye bye. Ain't that right? I'm only asking this question.

reply to post by Bluesma

When I was younger, after a very difficult early childhood, my state of mind was very different than now. In trying to describe it to others, I often get some who say that that is the desirable state of enlightenment.
I continue to find this questionable, as it was void of any emotional pleasure or appreciation of life. I find it hard to believe that people actually seek to become numb, and completely at the whim of others and their environment.

I understand what you mean. This ego-less numbness leads to doubt about the "otherness" of other people, solipsism, and such views that seek to negate the inherent difference between every living thing in the hopes of turning us into products of some assembly line. Those that preach such nonsense only wish everyone were like them, and attempt to seduce others to their homogenization by promising some strange form of satiation—to become numb as you put it, a leaf in the wind riding on the gusts as if we had no direction.

reply to post by Bluesma

Bluesma


When I was younger, after a very difficult early childhood, my state of mind was very different than now. In trying to describe it to others, I often get some who say that that is the desirable state of enlightenment.
I continue to find this questionable, as it was void of any emotional pleasure or appreciation of life. I find it hard to believe that people actually seek to become numb, and completely at the whim of others and their environment.

Basically, I think my ego had been diminished to such a great degree it was barely existant. I didn't have much of a concept of self. I couldn't answer questions like what I wanted, what I liked, how I am in this way or that. If pressed, I could come up with a basic thing like that I am female, and my age, because I was told these facts and told to repeat them.

When left alone, I had no action to take, I did not play. I would sit and listen to sounds around me, look at colors around me. I was completely in the moment, yes, but if someone wanted to take my life, I would just let them. I had no will. I wanted nothing, I had no personal opinion.

Now, with the contrast of my experience now to refer to, I would say I simply projected my concept of self outward- I was all that I was experiencing in the moment- I was the others around me, I was the objects around me, I was the events. I felt emotions only second hand, through others. If a person walked in filled with an emotion, I would feel it, then when they left the room, it was gone. I had no sense of choice, of being a point from which choices could be made.

As I got older, this meant people did what they wanted to my body, to beat it or rape it, and I only began to build a sense of self after I had a child, and by contrast, began to find a self in me that could choose to protect it and care for it (and had to).
...

I´ve got a few questions for you. Don´t get me wrong. I´m pretty motivation free too so...
-How did you manage to live a common daily life (like apply for a job)?
-How were you able to become pregnant? Someone just came and took you like you lived in China or India?
-How were you able to rise a child (chldren learn by mimicking parents so is it an empty vessel like you or rather like it´s father)?
-Can it be some kind of neurological, psychological, hormonal disorder? Are you capable of feeling compasion (psychopaths don´t)
Can you be autistic?
-Don´t you think that it is rather normal for a woman than for a man to feel this way?

reply to post by onequestion


Its all very interesting how people approach this topic. I think a precursor question that is often missed is the actual definition of "self." According to how one defines it, it starts to change how one looks at the entire topic.

If "all is self," then destroying the ego as many claimed they have, means they have actually severed themselves from who they really are. These claims tends to go hand in hand (I am the universe experiencing itself, I have no ego). Also, in this respect, being selfish would be seen by many as being entirely selfless. A bit of a paradox among the subjectivity.

If the self is defined as only being the body in which one resides, then there can be numerous redefining moments that change how this perspective is based. And yet, if one destroys the ego in this sense, they are again severing themselves from who they really are in the most literal way. Its a trick of the mind, a last bastion of sorts.. to think that one can cease the bodies subjective interpretation without destroying the body itself.

In the end, so much of the topic is all about our perceptions of this place and ourselves. In that, so much of it is in our minds. Continually experiencing the simultaneous interaction of the subjective interpretation and the objective events from which they co-dependently arise seems to be the most accurate way to perceive "what is." But, perhaps it is simply a baseline for a slightly stronger subjective foundation.

onequestion
Who are when you have no desire, when you reach a point where you realize what ambition really is? What do you then become?

Can any of you explain yourself without the lexicon you use to explain your identity?

Forget what you do and what your goals are, how do you then explain yourself?

Can anyone honestly answer this question?

edit on 3/5/2014 by onequestion because: (no reason given)

Where would the need to explain yourself come from ?

Wouldn't your identity then be "explained" as desireless, ambitionless and egoless? ...
as "I am".

Ego vs. Non-Ego, Ambition vs. Ambitionlessness...those are dualistic terms. In a "beyond ego" state there is neither Ambition nor Ambitionessless, neither Ego nor non-Ego. The Ambition of the Self merges with the Ambition of the Universe.

reply to post by Skyfloating


I'd say, with the ambition of the Spirit, which is good.

reply to post by dominicus


I didn't even need to read your post because I knew what you're going to say

When you turn off your internal dialogue and just start to receive with a a quiet mind, miracles REALLY start to happen. When you're not driven by cynicism, assumptions and prejudice you can really start to create. Not an easy thing to do in the modern society, but it's there and always will be. It's actually the most productive and free state possible.

There you can also find the happiness you've been searching for (if you deserve it because your actions)

What am I? Energy.

onequestion
Who are when you have no desire, when you reach a point where you realize what ambition really is? What do you then become?

Can any of you explain yourself without the lexicon you use to explain your identity?

Forget what you do and what your goals are, how do you then explain yourself?

Can anyone honestly answer this question?

edit on 3/5/2014 by onequestion because: (no reason given)

You would reach the point of Self realisation. As you know, our path is to raise our awareness so that we function close to the level of the higher self.

It is difficult to explain the "identity" of the higher self, except state that it is not limited by time and space and it knows what is and what will be. You only need to achieve a certain degree of proximity to it to get the benefits.

Even when I was a teenager, I always felt that there was a need to invest spiritually because it is the only wealth that you take with you after physical death.

So , if I have to explain my Self, I would say that my new identity would be one where I was immune to the currents and ups and downs of the mundane life.I would appear magnetic and my goals would be Self- generated rather than whimsical. The goals would become philanthropic since I would have by then the power to get most of what I wanted for my lower self.

onequestion
Who are when you have no desire, when you reach a point where you realize what ambition really is? What do you then become?
Can any of you explain yourself without the lexicon you use to explain your identity?
Forget what you do and what your goals are, how do you then explain yourself?
Can anyone honestly answer this question?

edit on 3/5/2014 by onequestion because: (no reason given)

... Who are you right now identifying with ambition, ego and desires?

I would say
" I am not ego, ambition and desires".
I am.