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Russia declares war on Ukraine. Live updates from inside Ukraine

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posted on Jun, 2 2014 @ 04:46 PM
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a reply to: letscit




are you talking about the armed invaders at the elementary school that was bombed by the ukranian pilots while school was in session? you know, the armed teachers and 5 to 10 year olds they tried to kill by shooting a missile into their elementary school.


Do you really want to discuss schoolchildren, because I remember a little school incident that did cause the death of children being used as human shields, and btw they were shot by Russian soldiers.


According to military prosecutor, a BTR armoured vehicle drove close to the school and opened fire from its 14.5x114mm KPV heavy machine gun at the windows on the second floor.[11] Eyewitnesses (among them Totoonti[71] and Kesayev[84]) and journalists saw two T-72 tanks advance on the school that afternoon, at least one of which fired its 125 mm main gun several times.[11] During the later trial, tank commander Viktor Kindeyev testified to having fired "one blank shot and six antipersonnel-high explosive shells" on orders from the FSB.[96] The use of tanks and armoured personnel carriers was eventually admitted to by Lieutenant General Viktor Sobolev, commander of the 58th Army.[90] Another witness cited in the Kesayev report claims that he had jumped onto the turret of a tank in an attempt to prevent it from firing on the school.[84] Scores of hostages were moved by the militants from the burning sports hall into the other parts of the school, in particular the cafeteria, where they were forced to stand at windows. Many of them were shot by troops outside as they were used as human shields, according to the survivors (such as Kudzeyeva,[97] Kusrayeva[98] and Naldikoyeva[48]). Savelyev estimated that 106 to 110 hostages died after being moved to the cafeteria.[99]


en.wikipedia.org...

That was done by Chechans and now we have Chechans fighting in Ukraine, so if they would do it once what stops them from doing it twice. Using kids and adults as human shields.




you speak of irony. but this thread is so full of people spewing b.s.. how about this irony. Russia has spy satellites every bit as capable as ours, maybe better. it just so happens they are watching everything. and I haven't seen this posted in the thread yet, but Russia has kept tabs on all these pilots who have shot at the civilians and their children and are making their names public to the ukranian people. how is that for irony?


Do you understand the context I was using irony for?

You see it was said by another member that if armed insurgents tried to do what they are in Ukraine they would be met with swift and overwhelming force, but when the Ukraine tries to do that in their own country it is a war crime.

Are you telling me you don't see the irony in that?




posted on Jun, 2 2014 @ 08:54 PM
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So anyway...

Can someone explain to me how Chechens end up on the side of RU forces? I'm kind of lost on that one.



posted on Jun, 2 2014 @ 09:21 PM
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aftermath of air-strike in Lugansk. Once again, Kiev winning minds and hearts of its own people.




moment when SU-25 fires rockets in Lugansk yesterday.


edit on 2-6-2014 by cosmonova because: (no reason given)


craters from bombing in the park across the road from the building


edit on 2-6-2014 by cosmonova because: (no reason given)



This is a different angle catching the moment of air strike in Lugansk


edit on 2-6-2014 by cosmonova because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 2 2014 @ 10:58 PM
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a reply to: cosmonova

Somethings wrong here we saw the aircraft fire one missile yet it looks like a grenade launcher as far as damage. A jet would use a rocket pod smallest Ukraine would have is 57 mm S-5 rockets in UB-32 pods. This would fire 5 rockets problem is should have done more damage would have blown out a good section of the building and left craters the size of cars. The damage looks more like grenade blasts if there was a hind in the area that makes more sense other possibility anti aircraft gun happened in Baghdad the anti aircraft guns do more damage to the city than airstrikes.They fired so many frag rounds in the air but forgot the laws of physics what goes up comes back down. They used fragmentation rounds and this also looks more like grenade damage than rocket damage. air to surface rockets and missiles are made to create huge blasts because its hard to hit someone with a rocket but make the blast big enough its alot easier. 3rd option would be the jet was armed with explosive rounds but unlikely because there again would have been alot more hitting the target even with a 2 second burst. Im thinking most likely was a hind with HE rounds they have grenade launchers.



posted on Jun, 3 2014 @ 01:01 AM
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originally posted by: dragonridr
a reply to: cosmonova

Somethings wrong here we saw the aircraft fire one missile yet it looks like a grenade launcher as far as damage. A jet would use a rocket pod smallest Ukraine would have is 57 mm S-5 rockets in UB-32 pods. This would fire 5 rockets problem is should have done more damage would have blown out a good section of the building and left craters the size of cars. The damage looks more like grenade blasts if there was a hind in the area that makes more sense other possibility anti aircraft gun happened in Baghdad the anti aircraft guns do more damage to the city than airstrikes.They fired so many frag rounds in the air but forgot the laws of physics what goes up comes back down. They used fragmentation rounds and this also looks more like grenade damage than rocket damage. air to surface rockets and missiles are made to create huge blasts because its hard to hit someone with a rocket but make the blast big enough its alot easier. 3rd option would be the jet was armed with explosive rounds but unlikely because there again would have been alot more hitting the target even with a 2 second burst. Im thinking most likely was a hind with HE rounds they have grenade launchers.


Nah this is something like S-8.
Looks like there was 5 rockets all together.
Check it out, this just fit the second video of air strike I posted above.
Absolute nonsense saying manpads/RPGs did that.



edit on 3-6-2014 by cosmonova because: (no reason given)

edit on 3-6-2014 by cosmonova because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 3 2014 @ 01:07 AM
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originally posted by: SurrenderingAmerica


More video that prove this was not a rpg/manpad attack in #Lugansk 6 craters different impact locations.



Didnt think of RPG but yes it does look more like RPG especially the ones in the woods would have taken 3 to cause that damage. Thanks for the video im sure that was done by Ukrainian air force (not) . That leaves hind or as you pointed out RPGs . There to small to be anything but grenades. Fits more to RPG there made not to detonate on impact but to penetrate a tank you see where the one went into the ground actually exited again and detonated looks like at the street. The other ill bet is still buried since theres no exit and a third was fired through the window that would explain lack of detonation on impact with the building. Most rockets wont penetrate brick and morter unless they are anti tank.
edit on 6/3/14 by dragonridr because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 3 2014 @ 01:28 AM
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a reply to: cosmonova


S-8 rocket pods have 5 rockets and would have blown that area to hell. Cars would have been destroyed easily thats what there designed to do large explosion you want to get an idea look at the airport video. That is rocket damage entire buildings destroyed.



posted on Jun, 3 2014 @ 01:31 AM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Jun, 3 2014 @ 01:48 AM
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originally posted by: cosmonova

originally posted by: dragonridr
a reply to: cosmonova

Somethings wrong here we saw the aircraft fire one missile yet it looks like a grenade launcher as far as damage. A jet would use a rocket pod smallest Ukraine would have is 57 mm S-5 rockets in UB-32 pods. This would fire 5 rockets problem is should have done more damage would have blown out a good section of the building and left craters the size of cars. The damage looks more like grenade blasts if there was a hind in the area that makes more sense other possibility anti aircraft gun happened in Baghdad the anti aircraft guns do more damage to the city than airstrikes.They fired so many frag rounds in the air but forgot the laws of physics what goes up comes back down. They used fragmentation rounds and this also looks more like grenade damage than rocket damage. air to surface rockets and missiles are made to create huge blasts because its hard to hit someone with a rocket but make the blast big enough its alot easier. 3rd option would be the jet was armed with explosive rounds but unlikely because there again would have been alot more hitting the target even with a 2 second burst. Im thinking most likely was a hind with HE rounds they have grenade launchers.


Nah this is something like S-8.
Looks like there was 5 rockets all together.
Check it out, this just fit the second video of air strike I posted above.
Absolute nonsense saying manpads/RPGs did that.




Yeah the more i watch this video was definitely RPG notice you see the flash at the tree they zoom in on. But no explosion or smoke it was someone in the woods firing an RPG. Notice you see the flash than you see the explosions at the street. Where did this video come from was it a security camera? Any way someone attacked the building from the woods and whoever did it was attempting to hide it.



posted on Jun, 3 2014 @ 01:57 AM
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originally posted by: dragonridr

originally posted by: cosmonova

originally posted by: dragonridr
a reply to: cosmonova

Somethings wrong here we saw the aircraft fire one missile yet it looks like a grenade launcher as far as damage. A jet would use a rocket pod smallest Ukraine would have is 57 mm S-5 rockets in UB-32 pods. This would fire 5 rockets problem is should have done more damage would have blown out a good section of the building and left craters the size of cars. The damage looks more like grenade blasts if there was a hind in the area that makes more sense other possibility anti aircraft gun happened in Baghdad the anti aircraft guns do more damage to the city than airstrikes.They fired so many frag rounds in the air but forgot the laws of physics what goes up comes back down. They used fragmentation rounds and this also looks more like grenade damage than rocket damage. air to surface rockets and missiles are made to create huge blasts because its hard to hit someone with a rocket but make the blast big enough its alot easier. 3rd option would be the jet was armed with explosive rounds but unlikely because there again would have been alot more hitting the target even with a 2 second burst. Im thinking most likely was a hind with HE rounds they have grenade launchers.


Nah this is something like S-8.
Looks like there was 5 rockets all together.
Check it out, this just fit the second video of air strike I posted above.
Absolute nonsense saying manpads/RPGs did that.




Yeah the more i watch this video was definitely RPG notice you see the flash at the tree they zoom in on. But no explosion or smoke it was someone in the woods firing an RPG. Notice you see the flash than you see the explosions at the street. Where did this video come from was it a security camera? Any way someone attacked the building from the woods and whoever did it was attempting to hide it.



If my government supports these thugs in Kiev I would be ashamed as well and would try to talk all kind of nonsense
justifying actions of these criminals. That is not wood that is a park. You know, where people go out for a walk, kids play. According to you somehow amongst those people in the park there was 3-4 persons with RPG who all decided to shoot at the building regardless there was plenty of militia people around. They must wore invisible uniforms. While they were shooting at the building people start to be killed in the park.
Cool story bro.


edit on 3-6-2014 by cosmonova because: (no reason given)

edit on 3-6-2014 by cosmonova because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 3 2014 @ 02:08 AM
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a reply to: cosmonova

I think we should be careful about throwing accusations in the manner you did, even more so when Russia did far worse in the Novye Aldi massacre (the members involved have never been brought to justice).

Russian Federal forces perpetrated that massacre of civilians in Grozny. Actually their actions were taken from the Nazi playbook.

The question becomes are we allowed to hold the Russian President / Cabinet members / top military leadership for the actions of that group?

My point is one person, 2 person or 5 persons taking an action does not always equate into sanctioned / supported by others. There are many many incidents around the globe where individuals belonging to a group take an action that is neither supported / authorized by the group.

one person killing another person does not make everyone a criminal suspect.


edit on 3-6-2014 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 3 2014 @ 02:21 AM
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a reply to: cosmonova




Nah this is something like S-8.
Looks like there was 5 rockets all together.

Check it out, this just fit the second video of air strike I posted above.
Absolute nonsense saying manpads/RPGs did that.


So if this was an S-8 rocket fired from an aircraft, did they have an aircraft sitting in the park because we see a flash in the trees but we don't see this rocket enter those trees from above?



posted on Jun, 3 2014 @ 02:25 AM
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originally posted by: cosmonova

originally posted by: dragonridr

originally posted by: cosmonova

originally posted by: dragonridr
a reply to: cosmonova

Somethings wrong here we saw the aircraft fire one missile yet it looks like a grenade launcher as far as damage. A jet would use a rocket pod smallest Ukraine would have is 57 mm S-5 rockets in UB-32 pods. This would fire 5 rockets problem is should have done more damage would have blown out a good section of the building and left craters the size of cars. The damage looks more like grenade blasts if there was a hind in the area that makes more sense other possibility anti aircraft gun happened in Baghdad the anti aircraft guns do more damage to the city than airstrikes.They fired so many frag rounds in the air but forgot the laws of physics what goes up comes back down. They used fragmentation rounds and this also looks more like grenade damage than rocket damage. air to surface rockets and missiles are made to create huge blasts because its hard to hit someone with a rocket but make the blast big enough its alot easier. 3rd option would be the jet was armed with explosive rounds but unlikely because there again would have been alot more hitting the target even with a 2 second burst. Im thinking most likely was a hind with HE rounds they have grenade launchers.


Nah this is something like S-8.
Looks like there was 5 rockets all together.
Check it out, this just fit the second video of air strike I posted above.
Absolute nonsense saying manpads/RPGs did that.




Yeah the more i watch this video was definitely RPG notice you see the flash at the tree they zoom in on. But no explosion or smoke it was someone in the woods firing an RPG. Notice you see the flash than you see the explosions at the street. Where did this video come from was it a security camera? Any way someone attacked the building from the woods and whoever did it was attempting to hide it.



If my government supports these thugs in Kiev I would be ashamed as well and would try to talk all kind of nonsense
justifying actions of these criminals. That is not wood that is a park. You know, where people go out for a walk, kids play. According to you somehow amongst those people in the park there was 3-4 persons with RPG who all decided to shoot at the building regardless there was plenty of militia people around. They must wore invisible uniforms. While they were shooting at the building people start to be killed in the park.
Cool story bro.




Like a care who my government supports in fact that would tend to make me vote for the other side not a big fan. However that doesnt change the facts thanks to the video you posted there is no way that was done by the Ukrainian air force angle is to low to ground thats why one exits the ground think whoever fired it was attempting to make crater not realizing there anti tank weapons. Also they have a much smaller charge than air to surface missiles in anti tank rounds dont use alot of explosives standard grenade really 20 meter kill zone mostly shrapnel. And if you watch the video you posted you see the launch than miraculously we see the explosions. Im thinking someone tried to fake an attack.but to be fair ill look to see if i can find some more pictures to verify this though i do thank you for the videos. See i just knew something didnt look right couldnt figure out what could have caused such small impacts until you mentioned it. Because i was still thinking in line that an aircraft did it though i would have guessed a hind with anti personnel rockets like the 57mm UB-32 rocket pod. Problem is should have been alot more hits and you would have seen the block light up.So the RPG best fits with what we see in the video.
edit on 6/3/14 by dragonridr because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 3 2014 @ 02:48 AM
link   

originally posted by: dragonridr

originally posted by: cosmonova

originally posted by: dragonridr

originally posted by: cosmonova

originally posted by: dragonridr
a reply to: cosmonova

Somethings wrong here we saw the aircraft fire one missile yet it looks like a grenade launcher as far as damage. A jet would use a rocket pod smallest Ukraine would have is 57 mm S-5 rockets in UB-32 pods. This would fire 5 rockets problem is should have done more damage would have blown out a good section of the building and left craters the size of cars. The damage looks more like grenade blasts if there was a hind in the area that makes more sense other possibility anti aircraft gun happened in Baghdad the anti aircraft guns do more damage to the city than airstrikes.They fired so many frag rounds in the air but forgot the laws of physics what goes up comes back down. They used fragmentation rounds and this also looks more like grenade damage than rocket damage. air to surface rockets and missiles are made to create huge blasts because its hard to hit someone with a rocket but make the blast big enough its alot easier. 3rd option would be the jet was armed with explosive rounds but unlikely because there again would have been alot more hitting the target even with a 2 second burst. Im thinking most likely was a hind with HE rounds they have grenade launchers.


Nah this is something like S-8.
Looks like there was 5 rockets all together.
Check it out, this just fit the second video of air strike I posted above.
Absolute nonsense saying manpads/RPGs did that.




Yeah the more i watch this video was definitely RPG notice you see the flash at the tree they zoom in on. But no explosion or smoke it was someone in the woods firing an RPG. Notice you see the flash than you see the explosions at the street. Where did this video come from was it a security camera? Any way someone attacked the building from the woods and whoever did it was attempting to hide it.



If my government supports these thugs in Kiev I would be ashamed as well and would try to talk all kind of nonsense
justifying actions of these criminals. That is not wood that is a park. You know, where people go out for a walk, kids play. According to you somehow amongst those people in the park there was 3-4 persons with RPG who all decided to shoot at the building regardless there was plenty of militia people around. They must wore invisible uniforms. While they were shooting at the building people start to be killed in the park.
Cool story bro.




Like a care who my government supports in fact that would tend to make me vote for the other side not a big fan. However that doesnt change the facts thanks to the video you posted there is no way that was done by the Ukrainian air force angle is to low to ground thats why one exits the ground think whoever fired it was attempting to make crater not realizing there anti tank weapons. Also they have a much smaller charge than air to surface missiles in anti tank rounds dont use alot of explosives standard grenade really 20 meter kill zone mostly shrapnel. And if you watch the video you posted you see the launch than miraculously we see the explosions. Im thinking someone tried to fake an attack.but to be fair ill look to see if i can find some more pictures to verify this though i do thank you for the videos. See i just knew something didnt look right couldnt figure out what could have caused such small impacts until you mentioned it. Because i was still thinking in line that an aircraft did it though i would have guessed a hind with anti personnel rockets like the 57mm UB-32 rocket pod. Problem is should have been alot more hits and you would have seen the block light up.So the RPG best fits with what we see in the video.




Yesterday’s Ukrainian Air Force strike on the regional administration building in Lugansk generated a flurry of media and social media responses. Many pro-Russian news outlets have claimed that cluster munitions were used, or that unexploded submunitions were found near the impact site. Whilst that is certainly possible, the evidence that has come to light thus far indicates that S-8KOM high explosive anti-tank air-to-surface rockets were fired from a Ukrainian Air Force Sukhoi Su-25, perhaps in conjunction with strafing fire from its Gryazev-Shipunov GSh-30-2 30 x 165 mm dual-barrel autocannon. The S-8 rockets were likely launched from B-8M1 rocket pods, each capable of carrying up to 20 rockets.


check the rest in here
www.armamentresearch.com...



posted on Jun, 3 2014 @ 02:54 AM
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today is the busiest day so far on all fronts, some heavy figths in Slavyansk, Kramatorsk region



rui borges ‏@homo_viator 1m
#BREAKING #Slavyansk area attack by #Ukraine airforce is underway. Via @ActualidadRT




Catherina ‏@Catherina_News 4m
#Slavyansk - Two #Ukraine helicopters hit- 1 helicopter downed, 1 left with engine on fire via @POS_troi




Amitashi ‏@amitashi01 5m
Good morning begins with blowing up some nazi APCs with RPGs. As Resistance did today! #Ukraine #Slavyansk

edit on 3-6-2014 by cosmonova because: (no reason given)



Slavyansk today


edit on 3-6-2014 by cosmonova because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 3 2014 @ 03:26 AM
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originally posted by: tsurfer2000h
a reply to: cosmonova




Nah this is something like S-8.
Looks like there was 5 rockets all together.

Check it out, this just fit the second video of air strike I posted above.
Absolute nonsense saying manpads/RPGs did that.


So if this was an S-8 rocket fired from an aircraft, did they have an aircraft sitting in the park because we see a flash in the trees but we don't see this rocket enter those trees from above?





Ukrainian Defense Ministry has officially confirmed the information that on the eve of the country's air force has released one hundred and fifty shells near Luhansk. One of the shells exploded in the central square. 8 killed civilians.

Оригинал статьи: russian.rt.com...



posted on Jun, 3 2014 @ 03:46 AM
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a reply to: FlyingFox

These are Chechens loyal to Razman Kadyrov, the Russian apointed leader in Chechnya. The same ones that fought on the Russian side in the Chechen wars and it seems most of them are employees of the Russian MIA over there.
edit on Tueu3015314 by Dutzy because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 3 2014 @ 05:28 AM
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this fella must be onto something



C. B. Malaparte ‏@CBMalaparte 3m
Every time an American Big Bug comes to #Kiev, the number of deaths in #Ukraine instantly grows #Lugansk




The United States is ready to provide Ukraine with economic support in the future, including in defense sectors, US Ambassador to Kyiv Geoffrey Pyatt said.

In the past three months the US tripled the budget of US military assistance to Ukraine and a special emphasis was made on increasing the combat efficiency of Ukrainian border guards and their capacity to defend Ukraine's borders, Pyatt said in an interview with Dzerkalo Tyzhnia (Mirror Weekly ) newspaper when commenting on the statement of Petro Poroshenko, who won the presidential elections, on the necessity of the US military assistance.

Pentagon delegation should arrive to Ukraine next week to meet with government representatives in order to discuss how to use better the US support in Ukraine's defense sector in the coming months and years, the ambassador said.


en.interfax.com.ua...



posted on Jun, 3 2014 @ 08:18 AM
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a reply to: cosmonova

Obama has requested a billion dollars from Congress to be used in moving / shuffling / adding military in Europe.




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