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Russia declares war on Ukraine. Live updates from inside Ukraine

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posted on May, 5 2014 @ 11:31 PM
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originally posted by: Xcathdra
RT journalist - Paula Slier

I keep seeing her name popping up with reports on the more graphic incidents. I will concede she may be a good journalist, however personally speaking I find it odd that a single journalist can have such good luck that no matter where she goes, she always seems to be in the right place at the right time.

Not an accusation, just an observation.


Absolutely understandable observation.

I believe she received word of the sniper attack on the woman from the hospital she was taken too. And then went to seek out the family to get their take.

Paula is bouncing from one battle to the next if she can. Gotta give her credit for having big steel balls lol.




posted on May, 5 2014 @ 11:32 PM
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originally posted by: cosmonova
I believe a moment of 'enough is enough' for EU is around the corner.



BERLIN— Angela Merkel is carrying a clear message from Germany's business lobby to the White House: No more sanctions




Several of the biggest names in German business—including chemical giant BASF BAS.XE -3.25% SE, engineering group Siemens AG SIE.XE +0.17% , Volkswagen AG VOW3.XE 0.00% , Adidas AG ADS.XE -0.39% adidas AG Germany: Xetra €76.84 -0.30 -0.39% May 5, 2014 5:35 pm Volume : 720,174 P/E Ratio 20.44 Market Cap €16.14 Billion Dividend Yield 1.95% Rev. per Employee €285,681 77.5077.0076.5076.00
10a11a12p1p2p3p4p5p
05/05/14 Adidas Puts Rockport Shoe Bran... 05/01/14 German Businesses Urge Halt on... 04/29/14 Adidas Reinstates Marketing Pa... More quote details and news » and Deutsche Bank AG DBK.XE -1.06% —have made their opposition to broader economic sanctions against Russia clear in recent weeks, both in public and in private.




A breakdown in Germany's trade relations with Russia could cost as many as 300,000 German jobs, according to the German government.


online.wsj.com...


Odd she said something very different when she met the president at the white house. So id say your source is wrong since we can hear what she says on it directly. Heres a quote from her speech-




"We have a range of tools at our disposal, including sanctions that would target certain sectors of the Russian economy," Mr. Obama said from the White House Rose Garden with Merkel at his side. "If we see the disruptions and destabilization continuing so severely that it impedes elections on May 25, we will not have a choice but to move forward with additional sanctions."

Showing that the U.S. and Europe are unified on the matter -- in spite of concerns that further sanctions could hurt the European economy -- Merkel said, "I am firmly convinced... the United States and European Union need to act in concert here."



posted on May, 5 2014 @ 11:37 PM
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a reply to: dragonridr

I thought the same thing -

Talk of Russia to dominate Obama, Merkel meeting President to push Germany to levy more sanctions


The crisis in Ukraine, and Germany’s reluctance to impose deeper sanctions on Russia, will dominate a meeting Friday when President Obama hosts German Chancellor Angela Merkel at the White House.

Mr. Obama is expected to lobby Mrs. Merkel to put more economic pressure on Moscow for its continued violation of a deal reached in Geneva on April 17 to de-escalate the crisis in Ukraine, where pro-Russia militants have seized government buildings in about a dozen cities.

“There’s no question that the situation in Ukraine, the continued failure by Russia to abide by its commitments in the Geneva agreement will be a focus of the conversation,” said White House Press Secretary Jay Carney.

Mrs. Merkel is the first European leader to visit Washington since the Ukrainian crisis began in March with Russia’s annexation of the Crimean peninsula. She is also on better terms with Russian President Vladimir Putin than Mr. Obama is, having spoken to the Russian leader by phone at least a dozen times since the crisis began.

In addition to four hours of meetings scheduled with Mr. Obama, Mrs. Merkel will hold a joint press conference Friday with the president.

Before her arrival in Washington, Mrs. Merkel said she was working through various channels to negotiate with Russia, but added that “there is a readiness to impose economic sanctions at the same time.”

“Should all this fail to bring results, we also should not fear the necessity of further sanctions,” she said.



I think this is coming down to all politics are local -


Former German Chancellor Gerhard Schroeder celebrated his 70th birthday this week in St. Petersburg at a bash with Mr. Putin, a close friend whom Mr. Schroeder has called “a flawless democrat.” The birthday party was hosted by Nord Stream, which is 51 percent owned by OAO Gazprom, the Russian state gas monopoly and the nation’s biggest company.

Mr. Schroeder is a member of the German Social Democratic Party, now governing in coalition with Mrs. Merkel’s party.


“There are big tensions in the SPD on Russia-Ukraine,” said Joerg Forbrig, a senior program officer of the German Marshall Fund of the U.S. in Berlin.

German Social Democratic Party Foreign Minister Frank-Walter Steinmeier “wants a balanced approach, but many party rank and file want the old line of understanding, engagement and no difficulties with Russia,” he said.



Schroeder already pissed Merkel off once about the oil pipeline.
I think this may be round #2






edit on 5-5-2014 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 5 2014 @ 11:40 PM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

The Germans are not going to do anything...it's pretty sad. They are going to cower, and whimper, just like they have done for quite a long period of time now. Money is talking....



posted on May, 5 2014 @ 11:40 PM
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a reply to: dragonridr

If I may put my .2 cents in.

I've been seeing that US and friends wanted to use more of a 'targeted pressure' on companies such as: Microsoft & Oracle which make up the operating backbone for Russian banks.

Thats what I expect from this. . . what, 4th round of sanctions?
edit on 5-5-2014 by SurrenderingAmerica because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 5 2014 @ 11:44 PM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

I dont think Russia understands Obama hes being tugged along by Germany.Hes dealing with bigger problems like possible impeachment for Benghazi which just blew up hes been trying to avoid Ukraine since it started and catching alot of heat for it. Its Germany or more accurately Merkel thats pushing back at Russia. Shes been running this from the beginning partly because in my opinion she feels responsible since she pushed heavily to get Ukraine to join the EU.



posted on May, 5 2014 @ 11:44 PM
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originally posted by: Catacomb
a reply to: Xcathdra

The Germans are not going to do anything...it's pretty sad. They are going to cower, and whimper, just like they have done for quite a long period of time now. Money is talking....


Ya know I don't think so. I truly think this is a local politics issue with Merkel. Putin already wagered on Merkel and lost since he thought she would not go along with sanctions. Since then she has supported them each step of the way.

The other way to look at this is sanctions will cause damage to economies. How much would a war cause?


a reply to: dragonridr
I think Merkel should lead. People bitch enough about the US acting without allies. Germany is the biggest economy and if something hits will be the first staging points.

As for Obama I agree - Pelosi was asked about it and her response was

Pelosi says she ‘couldn’t care less’ about Benghazi criticism

edit on 5-5-2014 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 12:16 AM
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Sanctions against Russia can be sum'd up as this:






. . . European citizens are brave to allow their govt's to act reckless with their own economy.



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 12:24 AM
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originally posted by: SurrenderingAmerica
a reply to: dragonridr

If I may put my .2 cents in.

I've been seeing that US and friends wanted to use more of a 'targeted pressure' on companies such as: Microsoft & Oracle which make up the operating backbone for Russian banks.

Thats what I expect from this. . . what, 4th round of sanctions?


I read a report on this apparently not only the banking industry but many areas of there economy are dependent on US tech. Including there gas industry.Same article was discussing the damage to Russian space program NASA is already taking steps to remove Russia from the equation. In fact Space X just docked with the ISS want to bet when this Russian crew goes home there wont be any more Russians on the ISS.



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 12:27 AM
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originally posted by: SurrenderingAmerica
Sanctions against Russia can be sum'd up as this:






. . . European citizens are brave to allow their govt's to act reckless with their own economy.


Im not sure is it worth the pain if it avoids world war 3??? The US economy wont be devastated except oddly agricultural they sell alot of food to Russia but that may continue do to its a need. Without agricultural imports
russians would starve.



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 12:34 AM
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originally posted by: dragonridr

originally posted by: cosmonova
I believe a moment of 'enough is enough' for EU is around the corner.



BERLIN— Angela Merkel is carrying a clear message from Germany's business lobby to the White House: No more sanctions




Several of the biggest names in German business—including chemical giant BASF BAS.XE -3.25% SE, engineering group Siemens AG SIE.XE +0.17% , Volkswagen AG VOW3.XE 0.00% , Adidas AG ADS.XE -0.39% adidas AG Germany: Xetra €76.84 -0.30 -0.39% May 5, 2014 5:35 pm Volume : 720,174 P/E Ratio 20.44 Market Cap €16.14 Billion Dividend Yield 1.95% Rev. per Employee €285,681 77.5077.0076.5076.00
10a11a12p1p2p3p4p5p
05/05/14 Adidas Puts Rockport Shoe Bran... 05/01/14 German Businesses Urge Halt on... 04/29/14 Adidas Reinstates Marketing Pa... More quote details and news » and Deutsche Bank AG DBK.XE -1.06% —have made their opposition to broader economic sanctions against Russia clear in recent weeks, both in public and in private.




A breakdown in Germany's trade relations with Russia could cost as many as 300,000 German jobs, according to the German government.


online.wsj.com...


Odd she said something very different when she met the president at the white house. So id say your source is wrong since we can hear what she says on it directly. Heres a quote from her speech-




"We have a range of tools at our disposal, including sanctions that would target certain sectors of the Russian economy," Mr. Obama said from the White House Rose Garden with Merkel at his side. "If we see the disruptions and destabilization continuing so severely that it impedes elections on May 25, we will not have a choice but to move forward with additional sanctions."

Showing that the U.S. and Europe are unified on the matter -- in spite of concerns that further sanctions could hurt the European economy -- Merkel said, "I am firmly convinced... the United States and European Union need to act in concert here."





the real sanctions are far away and I doubt it will be implemented at all by Germany. They would risk to much.
This is all nonsense so far and barking without biting. What is hurting Russia a bit more is transition of Crimea into Federation I believe. That is making a big impact on economy. But that was unavoidable and taken in consideration
prior Russia approved Crimea to join. Germany went through the same thing when Eastern part joined after Berlin Wall.
What I am looking forward to is Putin's visit to China in a couple weeks time and what is going to happen there.
Quite curious to find out where is Russia-China relation going after that visit.
This can be a major game-breaker for Russia's geo-strategic positions.



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 12:44 AM
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originally posted by: cosmonova

originally posted by: dragonridr

originally posted by: cosmonova
I believe a moment of 'enough is enough' for EU is around the corner.



BERLIN— Angela Merkel is carrying a clear message from Germany's business lobby to the White House: No more sanctions




Several of the biggest names in German business—including chemical giant BASF BAS.XE -3.25% SE, engineering group Siemens AG SIE.XE +0.17% , Volkswagen AG VOW3.XE 0.00% , Adidas AG ADS.XE -0.39% adidas AG Germany: Xetra €76.84 -0.30 -0.39% May 5, 2014 5:35 pm Volume : 720,174 P/E Ratio 20.44 Market Cap €16.14 Billion Dividend Yield 1.95% Rev. per Employee €285,681 77.5077.0076.5076.00
10a11a12p1p2p3p4p5p
05/05/14 Adidas Puts Rockport Shoe Bran... 05/01/14 German Businesses Urge Halt on... 04/29/14 Adidas Reinstates Marketing Pa... More quote details and news » and Deutsche Bank AG DBK.XE -1.06% —have made their opposition to broader economic sanctions against Russia clear in recent weeks, both in public and in private.




A breakdown in Germany's trade relations with Russia could cost as many as 300,000 German jobs, according to the German government.


online.wsj.com...


Odd she said something very different when she met the president at the white house. So id say your source is wrong since we can hear what she says on it directly. Heres a quote from her speech-




"We have a range of tools at our disposal, including sanctions that would target certain sectors of the Russian economy," Mr. Obama said from the White House Rose Garden with Merkel at his side. "If we see the disruptions and destabilization continuing so severely that it impedes elections on May 25, we will not have a choice but to move forward with additional sanctions."

Showing that the U.S. and Europe are unified on the matter -- in spite of concerns that further sanctions could hurt the European economy -- Merkel said, "I am firmly convinced... the United States and European Union need to act in concert here."





the real sanctions are far away and I doubt it will be implemented at all by Germany. They would risk to much.
This is all nonsense so far and barking without biting. What is hurting Russia a bit more is transition of Crimea into Federation I believe. That is making a big impact on economy. But that was unavoidable and taken in consideration
prior Russia approved Crimea to join. Germany went through the same thing when Eastern part joined after Berlin Wall.
What I am looking forward to is Putin's visit to China in a couple weeks time and what is going to happen there.
Quite curious to find out where is Russia-China relation going after that visit.
This can be a major game-breaker for Russia's geo-strategic positions.


I agree i dont think they fully took Crimea into account however and there appears to be some disagreement in Moscow with that report they came out with saying that less than 33 percent of Crimeans voted to join Russia is almost like there leaving the door open for another election. Possibly allowing Crimean to re vote to become independent nation getting Russia off the hook. Crimea is a huge money pit Ukraine spent billions over what it received in taxes over half the population is on pensions and another 15 percent receive government aid such college etc. If thats not bad enough there economy was highly dependent on Ukraine for basics food water etc all of which is going to become more expensive. This means Russia will have to continue to raise pensions just to keep up with inflation. International banks are refusing to enter Crimea because the UN including Russian banks fearfull they will be locked out of international markets. And is all of that isnt bad enough you have Turkey starting to get upset at the way the tatars are being treated how long before they start arming them.

I think this was a case of afterwards the Kremlin going what did we just do?????



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 12:45 AM
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originally posted by: dragonridr

originally posted by: SurrenderingAmerica
a reply to: dragonridr

If I may put my .2 cents in.

I've been seeing that US and friends wanted to use more of a 'targeted pressure' on companies such as: Microsoft & Oracle which make up the operating backbone for Russian banks.

Thats what I expect from this. . . what, 4th round of sanctions?


I read a report on this apparently not only the banking industry but many areas of there economy are dependent on US tech. Including there gas industry.Same article was discussing the damage to Russian space program NASA is already taking steps to remove Russia from the equation. In fact Space X just docked with the ISS want to bet when this Russian crew goes home there wont be any more Russians on the ISS.


Yup.

I'm expecting US to take more of a 'surgical' approach this time around.

I'm still in doubt over the Space 'sector' sanctions though. That is still messy as of today. For every 'talk' about dropping Russia, there's counter-'talk' saying it won't happen. This isn't coming from Russia side - rather Western media.

SpaceX may get tied up in court over legal issues. I do know that as of today Russia will still be getting paid for delivery of pre-order rocket engines to US. That hasn't been ruled out nor stopped.


In regards to ISS, this can also back fire on American astronauts as well. As you know the ISS is a permanently staffed research laboratory. And currently Russia Soyuz spacecraft are currently the only vehicles capable of ferrying astronaut and cosmonaut crews to and from the ISS.



I think we can both agree that it's messy & still early.



p.s. A good indicator that brown is about to hit the fan is when ISS international ties are 100% severed between the two countries. . .



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 12:53 AM
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originally posted by: dragonridr

originally posted by: cosmonova

originally posted by: dragonridr

originally posted by: cosmonova
I believe a moment of 'enough is enough' for EU is around the corner.



BERLIN— Angela Merkel is carrying a clear message from Germany's business lobby to the White House: No more sanctions




Several of the biggest names in German business—including chemical giant BASF BAS.XE -3.25% SE, engineering group Siemens AG SIE.XE +0.17% , Volkswagen AG VOW3.XE 0.00% , Adidas AG ADS.XE -0.39% adidas AG Germany: Xetra €76.84 -0.30 -0.39% May 5, 2014 5:35 pm Volume : 720,174 P/E Ratio 20.44 Market Cap €16.14 Billion Dividend Yield 1.95% Rev. per Employee €285,681 77.5077.0076.5076.00
10a11a12p1p2p3p4p5p
05/05/14 Adidas Puts Rockport Shoe Bran... 05/01/14 German Businesses Urge Halt on... 04/29/14 Adidas Reinstates Marketing Pa... More quote details and news » and Deutsche Bank AG DBK.XE -1.06% —have made their opposition to broader economic sanctions against Russia clear in recent weeks, both in public and in private.




A breakdown in Germany's trade relations with Russia could cost as many as 300,000 German jobs, according to the German government.


online.wsj.com...


Odd she said something very different when she met the president at the white house. So id say your source is wrong since we can hear what she says on it directly. Heres a quote from her speech-




"We have a range of tools at our disposal, including sanctions that would target certain sectors of the Russian economy," Mr. Obama said from the White House Rose Garden with Merkel at his side. "If we see the disruptions and destabilization continuing so severely that it impedes elections on May 25, we will not have a choice but to move forward with additional sanctions."

Showing that the U.S. and Europe are unified on the matter -- in spite of concerns that further sanctions could hurt the European economy -- Merkel said, "I am firmly convinced... the United States and European Union need to act in concert here."





the real sanctions are far away and I doubt it will be implemented at all by Germany. They would risk to much.
This is all nonsense so far and barking without biting. What is hurting Russia a bit more is transition of Crimea into Federation I believe. That is making a big impact on economy. But that was unavoidable and taken in consideration
prior Russia approved Crimea to join. Germany went through the same thing when Eastern part joined after Berlin Wall.
What I am looking forward to is Putin's visit to China in a couple weeks time and what is going to happen there.
Quite curious to find out where is Russia-China relation going after that visit.
This can be a major game-breaker for Russia's geo-strategic positions.


I agree i dont think they fully took Crimea into account however and there appears to be some disagreement in Moscow with that report they came out with saying that less than 33 percent of Crimeans voted to join Russia is almost like there leaving the door open for another election. Possibly allowing Crimean to re vote to become independent nation getting Russia off the hook. Crimea is a huge money pit Ukraine spent billions over what it received in taxes over half the population is on pensions and another 15 percent receive government aid such college etc. If thats not bad enough there economy was highly dependent on Ukraine for basics food water etc all of which is going to become more expensive. This means Russia will have to continue to raise pensions just to keep up with inflation. International banks are refusing to enter Crimea because the UN including Russian banks fearfull they will be locked out of international markets. And is all of that isnt bad enough you have Turkey starting to get upset at the way the tatars are being treated how long before they start arming them.

I think this was a case of afterwards the Kremlin going what did we just do?????



I would not go that far, as I said this is a transition period and it is going to hurt. They were aware of that from the very beginning. But on a long run, Crimea's strategic position is way to important for Russia.
Once things settle and investments start to come, Crimea is going to boom. At the end it is only 2 million people.
Much more complicated is in South East of Ukraine, I have no idea how is that going to end up and what is going to happen with the rest of Ukraine.
edit on 6-5-2014 by cosmonova because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 12:54 AM
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True but ive been watching and i think there space industry is becoming fair game. first Canada pulled the plug on its plan to launch a satellite on a Russian Soyuz rocket in June. NASA is no longer discussing with Russia about ISS but instead booking flights on there own. Not only have they contracted with Space x but also one alot of people probably havnt heard of. Orbital Sciences is slated to launch a cargo-loaded Cygnus spacecraft aboard its Antares launch vehicle on June 10. And Boeing is ready to go on there vehicle its actually ahead of schedule how often does that happen?? they begin testing by the endof this year.



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 12:55 AM
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This video popped up on youtube, filmed in Antrasyt, Luhansk region, allegedly showing Russian Cossacks passing through the city:



LE: There seem to be sources online stating the same, tweets only:


Ukraine Reporter @StateOfUkraine
1 source has confirmed Russian military without insignia and huge # of weapons entering #Ukraine through #Antratsyt in the #Luhansk region



/r/UkrainianConflict @UkraineConflict
UNCONFIRMED Reports that Russian military crossing the border without insignia at the captured border crossing in #Luhansk #Ukraine


There is another picture of this, in which the license plate of the KAMAZ looks very similar to those we saw in the Crimea, white lettering over black background, used by the Russian army:

pic.twitter.com/L088O3qJ2D

Also this video from Antrasyt, showing the Russian Cossacks' flag flying at the captured Antrasyt city hall:

edit on Tueu3112514 by Dutzy because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 12:58 AM
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a reply to: cosmonova

I do think the idea of trying to turn it into lav Vegas may work with authorizing gambling its a buetiful area but im not sure if the locals will like that . And if only 30 percent actually voted there goin to have problems which would make any investment unlikely.



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 12:59 AM
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Just a friendly reminder to everyone:

Please refrain from expressing any pro-Ukrainian sympathies

(at least while in public in Moscow)




posted on May, 6 2014 @ 01:01 AM
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For those that claim there Russian Agents on the Ground this will disprove you on that matter. From My trusted sources.

Odessa survivors, video with english subtitles

Odessa survivors are telling what really occurred.



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 01:04 AM
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a reply to: ALoveSupreme

From the very same link.



расцветает фашистская Россия...



According to the User Claims that Russia is an Fascist state yet the majority there are wearing the flags of the fascists ukrankian cross arm.




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