Russian Federation Council Agrees to Putin's Request for military intervention in Crimea

16:55: Interfax-Ukraine reports that the far-right group Right Sector, which was actively involved in anti-Yanukovych protests, has called for full-scale mobilization in response to Russia's decision to back the use of troops, saying that their armed struggle will be "against the empire but not Rusophobic" - via BBC Monitoring

reply to post by MessageforAll


I wonder how many in that group, somewhere back home, have ID cases with ornate badges and a paycheck arriving from either the SVR or FSB? (Hard to say..given the mix of Russian domestic/foreign here..which agency would it be, or both?).

I think the rebels without a plan here ...didn't think this out. They have a tiger by the tail and the tiger is starving, and enraged. They can't hang on forever and the tiger knows as well as accepts the injury it will sustain in killing the source of it's anger.

The Rebels simply, absolutely, cannot survive against a serious and determined Russian effort. It would be VERY MUCH like saying Occupy could have taken and then held against determined force, a state building or STATE anywhere in the nation. They'd have held it precisely as long as it took authorities to load live ammo and drop the pretense of playing games. Short later, it would have been over with nothing to do but call in the medical examiner with his bags and tags.

Same here, I fear. Russia likely infiltrated the groups that ever *COULD* pose a threat to them before those groups even realized they someday would.

Chess....among checkers players. It's a hoot to watch..until it turns deadly, anyway.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Private security firms and "logistics" specialists could probably be making a lot of money right now.

The banks will be in dissaray mad cash black market economys spike, very little traceability in troubled times.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Hard to say, all nations use these tactics, to pinpoint this to one nation is probably impossible.

Referring to : uk.news.yahoo.com...-search
Ukraine Protests: Israeli Ex-Officer Leads Militant Group


Some updates:
17:03: UK Foreign Secretary William Hague tweets: "Russian Ambassador has been summoned to the Foreign Office over #Ukraine"
17:00: US Senator John McCain tweets: "Russian Senate backs Putin request to send troops to #Ukraine- straight out of Soviet playbook. Don't want Cold War back, but Putin seems to"

Putin is taking a play right out Adolph Hitlers play book,
Hitler used the excuse of "protecting ethnic Germans" living in a neighboring region to justify invading Czechoslovakia.

*** just got real, had this update on the BBC livefeed.
17:24: The BBC's Kevin Bishop in Sevastopol tweets: You've probably never heard of the Budapest Memorandum. It may crop up in conversation in the next few days.

So I googled the Budapest Memorandum...

When the Soviet Union collapsed in 1991, the newly independent Ukraine had on its territory what was the third largest strategic nuclear weapons arsenal in the world. It was larger than those of Britain, France, and China combined. On June 1, 1996 Ukraine became a non-nuclear nation when it sent the last of its 1,900 strategic nuclear warheads to Russia for dismantling.[1] The first shipment of nuclear weapons from Ukraine to Russia (by train) was in March 1994.[2]

www.theblaze.com...

The United States and Britain “reaffirmed” its commitment to protect Ukraine’s borders in exchange for the nation giving up its nuclear weapons in a little-known treaty known as the “Budapest Memorandum signed by former President Bill Clinton in 1994.

The Daily Mail notes reports “if Russia has invaded Ukraine then it would be difficult for the US and Britain to avoid going to war.”

Sir Tony Brenton, who served as a British ambassador from 2004 to 2008, said war is certainly on the table if it’s determined that the Budapest Memorandum is “legally binding.”

According to the Daily Mail, Kiev has asked that the agreement be honored as it claims its borders have been violated.

When the Soviet Union collapsed in 1991, the newly independent Ukraine had on its territory what was the third largest strategic nuclear weapons arsenal in the world. It was larger than those of Britain, France, and China combined. On June 1, 1996 Ukraine became a non-nuclear nation when it sent the last of its 1,900 strategic nuclear warheads to Russia for dismantling.[1] The first shipment of nuclear weapons from Ukraine to Russia (by train) was in March 1994.[2]

I wonder if the timing of this invasion was on purpose, or not? That's exactly 20 years ago, and it sounds like something Putin would do, with a smirk on his face. Time the invasion to what exactly allowed the invasion to happen in the first place...nuclear disarmament.

reply to post by TrueBrit

The fact of the matter is, that whether it was going to be Russia, or the US in association with the EU member states, someone was going to go into this mess, and try and play for the power.

And why was it the USA? Europe was "slow to respond" and apparently pissing us off (remember the !@$!@ the EU comment from our diplomat). But WHY was Europe "slow?" Because the protesters in Kiev were mostly far-right Nationalist .. they want a "relationship" with the EU and the ability to engage in free trade and travel like the EU but don't want to be in the EU .. they support some extreme nationalist ideas (like refusing to allow non-ukrainians to own land etc). So the EU backs off and lets it play out on its own since they have no real stake in the fight.

USA comes along and decides they want to try, again, to exert some form of political control over the situation and begins interfering from the start. So by our interfering what we've apparently done is split the country into fragments..

Then to top off the catastrophe our President in a juvenile way "warns" Russia of "costs" if they intervene .. so Russia launches an invasion. How many times is Putin going to bend Obama over his knee and give him these public spankings?

Well played Russia, well played.

reply to post by punkinworks10




Ukrainian leaders are fools. They could have joined the Russian Customs Union, dusted off their decaying economy, earned new markets for their goods and then......................along with Russia applied for the EU membership.

Non english speaking or thick accented Eastern europeans have little prospects for decent jobs in EU. Only menial jobs will be given in the west. Ukranian goods are not competitive in the western markets.

Most importantly, corrupt and inefficient societies like that of Greece (Ukraine is many times worse) will fail in any set up. If Ukraine could not make their country even half as successful in 25 years after independence, then they hold little chance a strong state in the future.

Do you honestly believe there would be another world war ? Do you know how much the world has changed since then last world war. The way people around the world communicate now there are so many methods. Social networking, YouTube, Instagram, Skype, photo sharing sites. The people of the world are much closer together than they were 60 years ago. I can travel abroad meet someone from another country become friends or even have relationships with. A world war would upset a lot of people and lose a lot of trust with politicians and world leaders. Just like we have seen in the Ukraine, can you imagine a country like the UK (where I'm from) that half the population turns around and says no we don't want to go to war that's a few million people not happy with what's going on

If a world war started and the army put a call out for every male to sign up is tell them to stuff it. I'd rather sit in jail and agree to join a war that I, as a human being who's home is earth, does not want. I mean our lives are screwed as it is with the banking crisis. A lot of people in a lot of countries wouldn't want to go to war. That's just what I think anyway if I'm wrong I'll see you on the other side and I'll eat my shoe just for being wrong

reply to post by ThePeaceMaker


Technically Russia and the USA could have a "limited" war in just one specific region without actually invading Russia, or either side losing more than lives and influence. It doesn't HAVE to be an all out nuclear war. Most agree nuclear powers would only use their nukes if they were about to collapse, which is why some nuclear countries (India and Pakistan for instance) can war without nuking.

reply to post by Rockpuck


Technically speaking that is the MOST Foolish logic I have read on ATS in a while................technically speaking ;-)

ThePeaceMaker
Do you honestly believe there would be another world war ? Do you know how much the world has changed since then last world war. The way people around the world communicate now there are so many methods. Social networking, YouTube, Instagram, Skype, photo sharing sites. The people of the world are much closer together than they were 60 years ago

It took all of about just a few hours to cut the internet, and phone lines inside of the Ukraine. People are not close together these days, look at how fractured each country is now, with dozens of new countries that didn't even exist 60 years ago. I hate to say it, but the world is further apart than ever.

Sad, really.

reply to post by Rockpuck


I see what you are saying but I just don't think people of certain countries who may get involved just wouldn't want it. I'm only 28 and I'm sick of wars. I know what I said was probably wrong but just wanted to have my say

reply to post by Catacomb


not sure about the phone but the internet is working very well
infosevas.ru...

There were about 150,000 troops that took part in the exercises right? Sounds like enough troops for a war...

I think Russia is/has prepared for any scenario that may rise out of this

reply to post by Catacomb


Point taken and you are correct. What I was trying to aim at is just people's personal feelings. Say for example a Russian family goes to the US meets lots of lovely people, they go home happy they have spent their time in the US and know that there are some nice people there. Then say Russia is at was with the US. The Russian family would feel a little upset over it.
Maybe anyway

I was just trying to explain the way I see things worth a try

Kuroodo
There were about 150,000 troops that took part in the exercises right? Sounds like enough troops for a war...

I think Russia is/has prepared for any scenario that may rise out of this

Such as Ukraine having held on to a couple of tactical nukes on the sly?

DJW001

Kuroodo
There were about 150,000 troops that took part in the exercises right? Sounds like enough troops for a war...

I think Russia is/has prepared for any scenario that may rise out of this

Such as Ukraine having held on to a couple of tactical nukes on the sly?

Ukraine has 5 nuclear plants..with the wind blowing the right way all they have to do is destroy one or two...

Biggest laugh I had today, a real WTF moment of monumental proportions, was listening to the news while driving back from my early morning walk. Susan Rice, that clueless Obama appointee talking head, saying that Russia should respect Ukraine sovereignty!

You couldn't make this stuff up!